Are HDDs just more reliable than SSDs beside speed?

Are HDDs just more reliable than SSDs beside speed? These things can last for 30 years without even needing to be powered

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  1. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    SSDs are yes, transient, but they're also power efficient and quick. Because we're in a world that wants everything yesterday but can't always connect to mainframe servers (that could utilize HDDs more efficiently) at high speeds, this is where we're at

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      it is recommended to keep a 4TB HDD around, well packaged so it survives accidental collapse of your shelves or whatever

      have it filled with 4TB of data you belive might be interesting years later

      one day you may wake up to find all of your SSD stuff is goners and all your HDDs that are regularly used have gone through mechanical failure

      but an unused HDD? the data simply stays there for decades if its not dropped to the floor at 1 meter height

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        You don't specifically need 4TB

        >but an unused HDD? the data simply stays there for decades if its not dropped to the floor at 1 meter height
        Wrong, you will have to power on and rewrite the data every few years to avoid bit flipping.

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          >You don't specifically need 4TB

          I dont think smaller capacity is enough

          But also definitely 4TB is big enough and you do not need 8TB

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            How would you know what I need?

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          >Wrong, you will have to power on and rewrite the data every few years to avoid bit flipping.

          I have never seen bit flip happen and I have had drives that werent powered up for about 1000 days

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            Ah the ol' it's never happened to me so it must not happen at all argument.

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          >bit flipping
          They use ECC. A bit flip literally can't happen. It will be either corrected, or detected as broken.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            >A bit flip literally can't happen. It will be either corrected, or detected as broken.
            everyone assumed this (for both spinning rust and, later, flash) for a long time and then found out it wasn't actually true, and that's why ZFS and Btrfs exist.

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          Outdated info, HDDs made in the last decade already have built in error correction

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            Having error correction doesn't mean the recorded information cannot be corrupted to the point where the error correction is insufficient to retrieve it. You might still be able to detect that the data is fricked and as such the drive will produce a read error, but your data is still gone. That can most certainly happen.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            Yeah, but not bit flipping.

            >A bit flip literally can't happen. It will be either corrected, or detected as broken.
            everyone assumed this (for both spinning rust and, later, flash) for a long time and then found out it wasn't actually true, and that's why ZFS and Btrfs exist.

            In theory bit flipping can happen on all layers. ZFS devs are so afraid of bit flips that they recommend using ECC RAM.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            >not bit flipping
            Seems to me like you're making an incredibly dumb semantics argument. When multiple events of "bit flipping" happen you get enough corruption that the error correction can no longer actually correct for it. It should handle a single bit flip, but data loss due to bit flipping is still possible and does happen. It's still bit flipping even if it takes multiple instances to actually lose data.

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        what if it's dropped at 2 meter height?

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          Then it downloads data from CIA's secret servers and makes mustard gas

  2. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    HDDs:
    >complex mechanics
    >only a handful of production companies left
    >only the competent ones survived
    >optimized them for decades
    >higher density achieved by making the mechanics even more precise
    >there's little inherent wear
    >head crashes lose all data at once, but often there are signs for failure before that happens
    SSDs:
    >new mass product
    >flash is volatile and wears down quick
    >lots of complexity goes into the controller, which does wear-leveling and disables bad flash sectors
    >even big name brand had fatal controller bugs
    >they keep trying to go cheaper by using even less reliable flash technology
    >lose all their data if unpowered for too long
    >some SSDs brick themselves and lose all data if power goes away unexpectedly, or on the first flash error (lol Intel)
    All in all, I'd say HDDs are simply the more mature product. And there's an obvious reason why flash can't remain unpowered for as long.

  3. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    Lasting while not being powered isn't an indication of reliability, reliability would imply they last a long time in active use. They do last a fairly long time though, modern HDDs are quite reliable but they do rely on high-precision mechanisms to function and those can always be prone to failure.

    SSDs are fully solid state. They should be quite reliable if you don't let them overheat and toast themselves (as with all electronics) or write crazy amounts of data to one and wear it out completely.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      >They should be quite reliable
      If you approximately knew how flash actually works, you wouldn't say that. Basically they're storing an electrical charge, which slowly discharges over time.

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        So what? The storage devices in my daily-use PC aren't archival media and nobody is selling you SSDs telling you to use them for data archival either.

  4. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    WRONG. HDDs rust which is why we all call them "spinning rust". You actually have to boot them up every once in a while to slosh around the oil. Eventually this gets dirty just like car engine oil and metal particles/dust gunk up the thing to the point of mechanical failure.

    Meanwhile SSDs have none of these problems. You still have to power them on every few years but killing 1TB or higher capacity variants from day to day use is actually very difficult due to modern wear leveling algorithms.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      >HDDs rust
      not a problem if u dont live underwater

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        HDDs are NOT made out of gold, look it up. That's LITERALLY why they have oil inside.

  5. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    >there are only 3 companies left that still make hdds
    >western digital already has a market for ssd and might bail out in the near future
    >one day you won't be able to get a new hdd at all

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      which are these companies? hitachi, seagate, toshiba, western digital, even hp and dell. you are full of shit Black person

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      adata,crucialx,sanddisk.
      >only 3.
      source? kys

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      >might bail out in the near future
      WD? Maybe. Would that matter? Not even remotely. There's a reason they bought HGST who primarily make HDDs, probably so that WD could focus on SSDs now that they've got a specialist subsidiary who's good (if not the best) at HDDs.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      which are these companies? hitachi, seagate, toshiba, western digital, even hp and dell. you are full of shit Black person

      >hitachi
      not anymore, it was sold to Western Digital a couple of years ago

      >seagate
      yes, they started HDD manufacture in 1970s and are still in the business

      >toshiba
      yes they started in 1980s and are still in the business

      >western digital
      yes they started in 1960s and are still in the business

      >hp
      no they do not make HDD, they buy either Seagate or WD HDD and re-label it as a HP hdd

      >DELL
      no they do not make HDD, they buy either Seagate or WD HDD and re-label it as a DELL hdd

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        what hdd would you recommend? toshiba, wd or seagate?

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          Both toshiba and seagate are good. I don't know about the other. In fact. The companies sare so few, it doesn't matter which one you choose.

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          I would say Toshiba just to make more people buy their stuff

          WD and Seagate could be better performance but all of them are HDDs in the end and not SSDs so differences are small

          Toshiba seems more reliable than usual Seagate or WD models. But yeah, datacenter Seagate or WD drive is very reliable, its just that their cheapest desktop HDDs are not. While Toshiba desktop HDD is quite reliable if not fast.

          Another difference is that Toshiba tend to be smaller capacity (hard to find bigger than 8TB) than Seagate and WDD who now have widely available 16TB drives

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          HGST>WD=Seagate
          Can't say much about Toshiba though, datacenters don't usually get their stuff so not enough AFR data. Seagate being junk is a meme from the past, they're solid now.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            all HGST models are now a few years old since it was sold to Western Digital

            current "HGST" drive line already has WD logo

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            True that, but the consumer WD drives are still manufactured by WD. As for HGST drives, all WD does is slap their label on top of them.

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