at what point did punk become so lame and tryhard? what was the tipping point?

at what point did punk become so lame and tryhard? what was the tipping point?

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  1. 6 days ago
    Anonymous

    You being born.

  2. 6 days ago
    Anonymous

    the minute that people from the punk generation started holding university faculty and political positions and then doing jack shit with them and enforcing the status quo

  3. 6 days ago
    Anonymous

    When something becomes popular people try to recreate that feeling that the original pioneers of the style created and it's just not possible to do. Look at rap music, the guys who try to capture the old school feel and style over do it because they weren't born then and don't understand that those guys talked about what they were talking about and acting the way they acted because they were a product of the time, the younger guys only see that world through music and video. Same goes for punk or even country music for that matter, we are in a different world you can't recreate Conway Twitty or Marty Robbins because they wouldn't be the same people if they were in their prime today.

  4. 6 days ago
    Anonymous

    after the pistols broke up

  5. 6 days ago
    Anonymous
    • 6 days ago
      Anonymous

      Lol, this saved punk, the frick you on?

      • 6 days ago
        Anonymous

        You're genuinely moronic for believing this. There was still "real" Punk coming out at the same time as this was and also Grunge was just as commercially popular. I'd say it's honestly fair to say Green Day killed it. Essentially the point where punk stopped being cool or intresting.

        • 6 days ago
          Anonymous

          Bullshit. Green Day saved mainstream punk. Grunge sucked ass for the most part, and the only real "punk grunge" band was Nirvana. Without Green Day there'd be no Blink 182, no My Chemical Romance, etc. and mainstream punk would have died or became irrelevant.

          • 6 days ago
            Anonymous

            I mean as long as we can agree punk as a whole kinda ran its course I guess. Also that Pop-Punk in the conventional sense is unlikely to see a Revival compared to "Real Punk" in light of the Warped Tour Scandal. I think that basically killed the subgenres appeal in a lot of ways. Unironically think there have been less "Defens Pop Punk" T-Shirts since that happened and people who wanted to believe the worst obviously did. Punk in general kinda became outmoded when it stagnated in terms of musical evolution and Metal didn't though. Same with more conventional rock. From now on it will probably mostly be Metal. Idk if it's impossible for punk in some veauge form to come back though. Pop-Punk would be hard to market. It has to compete with more mainstream pop but also looks extremely bad I'm the eyes of more mainstream pop fans because of Warped Tour. That might not have been all Pop-Punk but it's not really that hard to see why it was enough of it and enough of the biggest names in the subgenre to seriously curtail a major intrest in revival. Not sure if it's fair that all pop punk gets grouped in with Warped Tour. Obviously I'm more biased towards the extreme end of Punk and Metal but that doesn't mean every Green Day or Blink 182 Fan was a sexual predator. I'm not sure if someone who had never been to a punk show at this point would believe me saying that though. On Paper this really looks bad and it was prettymuch 0 Nu Metal 0 Hardcore 0 Black Metal 0 Post Punk etc bands involved. Given the ways in which Pop Punk was more commercial too relative to Nu Metal which still mostly appealed to a male audiance. Like yeah ig if you want to say Nu Metla was more mainstream or less abrasive than some Black Metal was too you can for sure argue that but it was still appealing to a mostly male audiance. Pop-Punk being something that was largely meant to appeal to Teenage Girls doesn't help.

          • 6 days ago
            Anonymous

            >Pop-Punk being something that was largely meant to appeal to Teenage Girls doesn't help.

            I feel like every zoomer girl I know these days is a die hard Blink and MCR fan. Also, I'm not familiar with the Warped Tour scandal, but I can assure you that Pop Punk and Emo are very alive nowadays. Just like how it happened with Nu Metal, every zoomer kid these days is obsessed with Limp Bizkit, Deftones etc., and also Blink, as I mentioned, so I think the future of punk in the mainstream could come with something like what this argentinian girl is doing (she's very big in Latin America, which is where I'm from). She mixes Drain Gang aesthetics with pop punk and emo melodies and screaming, and she's pretty much seen as the future of pop in Argentina / Latin America.

          • 6 days ago
            Anonymous

            I'm a zoomer (sort of) and obsessed with Black Metal. I would agree somewhat but what I've seen on a ground level is that it would be hard to really revive in the sense of having actual new pop punk bands playing because of Warped Tour Scandal. Warped Tour Scandal was essentially an ongoing sex Scandal with multiple bands implicated. It's about what you would think. I don't doubt there's a Revival of intrest in some of the bands who weren't as heavily touched by this but I couldn't see the genre as a whole being revived in light of that.

          • 6 days ago
            Anonymous

            Also like with "real punk" nu metal didn't really get touched by this. It was basically only like a handful of bands but they were virtually all like classic pop-punk bands prettymuch.

            It's crazy I didn't knew about this scandal. I'm also sort of a zoomer (oldgay) zoomer, and I like pretty much all genres of music, tho pop punk and punk rock in general have been an obsession to me for the last 13 or so years, and I remember vividly the time that I was in high school and I was the only autismo that liked and defended My Chem at that time (people really hated My Chem in the late 00s / early 10s). Nowadays, I feel like 7 out of 10 zoomers that I know that are into music are enjoyers of The Black Parade and shit like that, which is something I hate because I see these guys as trend hoppers, but IDK, maybe the situation is different here in Latin America compared to the states. Do you feel that zoomers in America / where you live are still defendants of emo and pop punk?

          • 6 days ago
            Anonymous

            This is fair but a lot of people went "oh frick my friend in highschool who said pop punk was weird wasn't just being elitist about black metal those guys are fricking creepy". Like I think a lot of the older fanbase especially those who were around for Warped Tour kinda felt ashamed or no longer wanted to associate with it. I don't think that's there fault or because they were genuinely bad people but I do think that actively hurt Pop Punk in terms of mainstream marketability and like I said there is absolutely no fricking reason for a "real punk" band or a mainstream just pop act not to turn people against pop punk. That's more money in there pockets from a marketing perspective. If you're either Taylor Swift or on the flip side trying to sound like Big Black or G.G. Allin and a record label tries to push a "pop punk revival" band instead of you you might be inclined to try and make them sound like freaks or bring up Warped Tour in the next meeting with the executives. To assume that this also doesn't effect like I said how the wider music community views these genres is also foolish and there's a charecter in one of the shows my girlfriend likes who's a creepy substitute teacher that's into Ska and pop-punk. The damage is measurable. I can see if you've always been into pop punk especially that not registering but if I was a parent in the current year racist aside I would probably be more comfortable with my daughter going to see Marduk or The Exploited than Blink. I don't think it's hard to argue that. Also all this information is extremely publicly available.

          • 6 days ago
            Anonymous

            Also like with "real punk" nu metal didn't really get touched by this. It was basically only like a handful of bands but they were virtually all like classic pop-punk bands prettymuch.

          • 6 days ago
            Anonymous

            Like it's super easy to convince normies that all pop punk is just inherently predatory so it would be a risk for record labels to invest in new bands. Also its laughable to assume that "real punk" bands or black metal bands wouldn't also try to scare labels out of signing them. The entire fricking genre got mogged in the court of public opinion on a level that "the kids" being into it isn't really going to change or fix. Also fans of more mainstream pop acts who also always thought Pop Lunk was weird or viewed it as a "phase" aren't now turning to defend Pop-Punk. If they were this would be a different situation but they were basically siding with the "real punks" and "metalheads" and shit on social media when this all came to light. Like I said not all Pop Punks or whatever the frick were going to call hat are actually bad people but the subculture around it got hit hard by like I said a massive virtually immovable sex scandal which didn't effect similar or neighboring genres really whatsoever. There was never a moment when a huge swath of the most important or famous normie boy bands nor a bunch of extreme metal bands were found sleeping with underage girls and it was ofc prettymuch going to be possible to "well actually" that on social media. Basically put Pop Punk back to pre-1990s in terms of widespread appeal it could feasibly have in terms of new bands etc. Nobody believes a new black metal band is actually setting fire to churches or whatever the frick and heroin addiction is prettymuch just killing yourself. The average normie also isn't going to genuinely believe Steve Albini was a pedophile or killing people or whatever. The idea that Pop-Punk Bands were talking to 16 Year Olds though that's basically proven and verymuch would make a label trying to revive the genre or whatever going uphill so to speak. It pretty obviously wasn't for shock and actually was a running issue. Normies would be easily swayed against it.

          • 6 days ago
            Anonymous

            Yeah, but blink 182 still sells out entire stadiums, so IDK about pop punk being fully dead because of the scandal. Also, I need to research more about this subject. I do know that some guys like Jack Barakat from All Time Low have had a long time reputation of being creeps to girls tho.

          • 6 days ago
            Anonymous

            Sure but they're also an established band. A newer Pop Punk Band would be less able to overcome that. If Blink 182 were starting today like with Black Metal Fans and Racism or something that would be a bigger deturance. Blink are already established and were established well before this scandal same with green day so that's not going to be as much of an issue. What I'm talking about is more new bands playing in a pop punk style. I'm sure you have a couple but it wouldn't be crazy to see a record label being nervous or skeptical about signing them after Warped happened. Maybe it would feel safer even to sign both a "real punk" or metal act and then also a female pop singer then to risk having a Warped Tour 2.0. Is that fair? Absolutely fricking not but I can see why someone might not. This also happened in The USA so Latin America could be different or Europe. This doesn't necessarily kill off a chance of Pop Punks Revival outside The States and probably Canada but yeah. It's that Warped Tour felt genuinely ominous to normies at least here in The USA. Retrospectively made the guys b***hing about Pop-Punk in the early 2000s seem like they were looking out for the safety of said teenage girls against creepy pop punk musicians as opposed to just b***hing. Couple things about The Warped Scandal. Black Metal got touched by it with Incantation but really just barely and the level of denial wasn't nearly as severe. That's not to say everyone in the pop punk community protected these guys either but from an outsider perspective Wattie getting into a fistfight with the guy from Green Day reads less as scene rivalry or contrarianism and more to normies like "oh I get it,the "real punks" thought they were "too commercial" because they're fricking creeps who shouldn't be trusted and they were mean to emo kids and pop Punks because they knew that they were bad apples,even if they don't share my values I guess they were just looking out for the good of the community".

          • 6 days ago
            Anonymous

            >"Also, I need to research more about this subject. I do know that some guys like Jack Barakat from All Time Low have had a long time reputation of being creeps to girls tho."

            It hit HARD for a whole while. I think there might have been some other stuff too but mostly Warped Tour. It was a huge running scandal. Good read though just kinda depressing. Even though I'm more into the "Underground" or less "Mainstream" stuff it still like with the oi thing and racism definetely reflected badly on the community as a whole and obviously just because it's not what I'm personally into doesn't make it alright. That being said Pop-Punk as a whole kinda got needed too harshly. I don't think this is a unique problem to just pop punk. A lot of normies obviously didn't really yk accept that though.

    • 6 days ago
      Anonymous

      grunge mixed rock and punk perfectly, and the musicians that followed didnt have the stability of life nor the opportunity to succeed them

      kurt cobain an hero'd two months after the release of dookie, i think we're onto something

  6. 6 days ago
    Anonymous

    grunge mixed rock and punk perfectly, and the musicians that followed didnt have the stability of life nor the opportunity to succeed them

  7. 6 days ago
    Anonymous

    What caused punk to be the center of all this drama and politics?
    You dont see this with literally any other genre

    • 6 days ago
      Anonymous

      anti-establishment and non-conformity is literally the whole point of punk, how the frick could it ever not be political, dumb frogposter

      • 6 days ago
        Anonymous

        >non-conformity is the whole point of punk
        >all punk bands look and sound identical

        • 6 days ago
          Anonymous

          What kind of punk do you listen to? It's obvious that every genre has a set of aesthetics (that's what makes it a genre), and the reality is that a Skacore band like Choking Victim sounds wildly different (and looks too) from a group like Refused.

    • 6 days ago
      Anonymous

      contemporary obsession with image and social justice came from punk and the power demographic in western liberalism (age 45-65) grew up on punk

    • 6 days ago
      Anonymous

      When it was relevant it was incredibly relevant and relevant in terms of its social commentary at that. Now it just isn't.

      anti-establishment and non-conformity is literally the whole point of punk, how the frick could it ever not be political, dumb frogposter

      Yes

      contemporary obsession with image and social justice came from punk and the power demographic in western liberalism (age 45-65) grew up on punk

      No

    • 6 days ago
      Anonymous

      i wonder if their focus on fashion was one of the reasons

      they care more about the political image of "how to be a punk" than the music itself.They give metalheads a run for their money when it comes to annoying fanbases. Metalheads are more about gay musical elitism while punks are more about trve anti-stablishment larping

  8. 6 days ago
    Anonymous

    Live music isn't very dangerous anymore. I visited Japan in 1988 and saw hanatarash play at an industrial warehouse, I'm paralyzed from the waist down after that show. I was hit with a flying metal barrel. Not worth it.

    • 6 days ago
      Anonymous

      damn, and now you post here
      what a shitty roll

      • 6 days ago
        Anonymous

        >go to see a few asiatics pretend to be punk
        >get paralyzed
        Amazing

        At least I learned how great Japanese hospitals are. 10/10. If anything atleast that was worth it.

    • 6 days ago
      Anonymous

      >go to see a few asiatics pretend to be punk
      >get paralyzed
      Amazing

  9. 6 days ago
    Anonymous

    >duuuuuuude i'm too cool for skool duuuuuuuuude everyone's tryyyyying too hard maaaaaaaaan

  10. 6 days ago
    Anonymous

    When it was no longer cool for guys in bands to frick highschool girls

    • 6 days ago
      Anonymous

      This more applies to Pop Punk but also ofc Warped Tour looked bad for people who were into Crust Punk or Black Metal or whatever the frick too. It just didn't universally kill off almost any and all intrest in Metal or in "Real" Punk in the same way it did Pop Punk and related,which to be fair never stood a real chance at surviving the Warped Tour controversies since that was a huge chunk of the major bands with almost no or no "Real" Punk Bands or Metal Bands implicated. Nu Metal Bands also weren't really playing Warped Tour. Maybe some Emo Bands but even then not to the same degree where you're never going to see Pop Punk Proper in the popular conscious again. You have seen some intrest in "Real" Punk but mostly only Post-Punk and Hardcore. Hardcore has an issue with spousal abuse mostly which isn't really that surprising. Black Metal has ofc a massive issue with racism but I'm not sure this is as deeply shocking to the point where if Warped Tour tried coming back there would likely be Noth "Real" Punks aswell as fans of more conventional Pop music outside protesting. Warped Tour really really really killed off that specific subset of bands. They may not all have been sleeping with underage groupies but the average consumer before might have thought Pop Punk was slightly lame if they were into "real" Punk or too loud or something before like really banal shit. The average parents not going to allow there kid at a Pop Punk Show because yeah. Especially if the parent is either a "real punk" or "poptimist" (even though nobody says "poptimist" outside of IQfy) if they heard of it veaugly through news media or internet reviewers or whatever that's even less likely. Also both more conventional Pop acts like Taylor Seift and whatever Black Metal or Grindcore or Hardcore Bands would likely end uo bringing this up if mentioned. Basically Pop-Punk is the least likely form of both Pop and Punk to ever become relevant again because that destroyed the perception.

    • 6 days ago
      Anonymous

      amen

  11. 6 days ago
    Anonymous

    Punk died after Reagan's first term. Let it go, kids.

  12. 6 days ago
    Anonymous

    It always was. Punk started as an advertising campaign for homosexual designer clothes and gradually became a musical version of CNN.

  13. 6 days ago
    Anonymous

    Pop Punk in The 90s is when it stopped actually being cool. Since then it basically turned into fake cringe larping bullshit you hear in shopping malls and then disappeared completely. It was arguably over before Green Day or whatever got really really really big. Maybe mid 90s. Black Metal also kept evolving past that point and a lot of the emo/mall kids ended up transitioning towards that or Midwestern emo style music but it was already probably past peak artistic relevance in The 90s. Grunge was essentially when it started moving more towards Metal which was almost a secondary format up until then. It became more about Teen Rebellion in The 90s and less about genuinely being subversive or challenging or controversial or anything. Ofc that was always a marketing gimmick to a degree but you get what I mean. There's a huge gap between Agnostic Front or Big Black or Aus Pairs or JUDGE and then a mid 90s Green Day or even worse 2000s Linkin Park Album. There are no Linkin Park Songs about Heroin Addiction,Shutting Down Public Assitence,Gender Identity,or setting fire to cop cars. There are no Linkin Park Songs about Intergenerational Poverty or Schizophrenia either. Also I think part of why Nu Metal can see any intrest in Revival really is because it was kind of edgier in a sense. It might have been more commercial but it wasn't THAT much more commercial. You could still have a nu metal band about Heroin or Jesus. This wasn't music that was going to be playing in the background at Wall Green's still. It might have been more commercial than the Metal bands immediately before it but not so much that it actually alienates a modern audiance from ever taking it seriously. It still feels like punk or metal which to me is probably more relevant than if it was "true Underground" or not. It's not jarring to have a Nu Metal Band in the same playlist as a bunch of other metal or punk bands and the relationship is much more natural.

    • 6 days ago
      Anonymous

      90s pop punk is fricking fun though

      • 6 days ago
        Anonymous

        Sure but so is conventional punk or conventional Pop. The issue is both Taylor Swift Fans and guys at basement punk shows are going to distrust you now for even mentioning you like Sum 41 or whatever the frick. Personally I hate Pop Punk too but it must be pretty depressing and abysmal. This was only a couple years ago aswell. It's not like The Beatles in the 60s or something. Both "Real Punks" and the more right-wing Skinhead type guys are not going to allow this shit to happen in a smaller scale venue and most fans of more commercial (relative to Pop punk) Pop Acts also probably wouldn't approve of there friends doing the same. This also is a massive blow to the community in terms of the ethos and shit. It's kinda harder to defend Pop Punk when the vibes are generally this bad. Essentially do not admit to liking Pop Punk at a real life Punk Show or at the next Taylor Swift concert you go to because yeah,the perception swung wildly and almost retroactively looks way way worse. People in music communities are also used to worrying about this stuff and the people setting up venues etc include both stereotypical Punks and then the girls wearing Taylor Swift t shirts. There is a pretty negative level chance of a genuine Revival.

  14. 6 days ago
    Anonymous

    Also I think Metal may never have had the same marketability or at least didn't after maybe The Mid to Late 1980s so it simply didn't get bastardized to the same degree. A lack of a shared culture or values around it may have also helped with that. 70s Metal was obviously extremely commercial and blurred into Hard Rock pretty quickly but when Metal had its first decline in popularity after maybe The Mid 80s or so that never really came back as Metal Fans themselves were extremely intense and largely interested in the music itself. The lack of like some sort of shared manifesto maybe also made it harder to bastardize though. Metal wasn't about a shared identity as much as a guitar tone or a presentational style. Some subgenres might try to create one but it's never as coherently cohesive in this.

  15. 6 days ago
    Anonymous

    america has steadily grown more communist since punk's inception. it's made most of punk's complaints about the establishment turn into praises of it. that's why they're all vaxxies, listening to rachel maddow, and supporting trannies now. gay genre for israelites.

  16. 6 days ago
    Anonymous

    scenes are gay. I just listen to music that makes my brain feel all happy, I dont need to participate in some homosexual club to enjoy it

  17. 6 days ago
    Anonymous

    lindas is literally just some fricking kids having fun
    how the frick is that tryhard?
    you must be such a dim c**t

  18. 6 days ago
    Anonymous

    punk festival in 1995

    ?feature=shared

  19. 6 days ago
    Anonymous

    Punk was dead on arrival

    • 6 days ago
      Anonymous

      Nah but Industrial arguably was depending who you ask.

    • 6 days ago
      Anonymous

      >Dead on arrival

      Fall Out Boy reference?

      • 6 days ago
        Anonymous

        >This Ain't a Scene it's a Goddamn Arms Race

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