Did Melville have the gay?

Did Melville have the gay?

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  1. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    women (and this grandpa) only take passages from moby dick like this as homosexuality because they have never experienced true male friendship

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      sailors do gay shit, moron, it's not a israeli conspiracy to steal friendship from you. melville knew what he was writing

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        That passage is not about gay shit, moron.

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          do you think herman melville wrote about two men embracing like a husband and wife and didn't know what that implied? do you think he had brain damage?

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            The screenshotted passage doesn't imply any gay shit you brainwashed media golem. I can relate to this passage, I recognize what is being referenced. You do not you illiterate cancerous homosexual because you're completely out of touch with reality, completely deranged.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            >I can relate to this passage
            This guy whispers sweet nothings to his bros while they share a bed

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            Lmao the projection ToT

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >ToT
            I have always seen and will always see this as a deku scrub with a "sick of your bullshit" expression
            It doesn't make sense for crying or "uoh" because there are no sad eyebrows, these have very strong eyebrows on the capital T

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            >you're completely out of touch with reality, completely deranged.
            i'm not the one going to pieces because an old book made a gay joke

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            This is my very first post on this board, though I've been on this site since 2006. I wanted to say you are so equsitiely homosexual that I had to take it upon myself to inform you of your circumstance, since you seem zealously unaware.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            you know this passage isn't about sharing a bed during a trip or whatever lame shit from your boring life you've mythologized in your own mind as being TRADITIONAL EVROPEAN FRATERNITY. it's about a guy sharing a bed with a strange man he just met and opening "the very bottom of their souls" to one another -comparing it explicitly to a man and wife and a honeymoon. again, these are people who had just met.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            >no place like a bed
            >men and wife
            >old couples
            >honeymoon
            >loving pair
            It's very clearly supposed to have a romantic tone, anon.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            Romanticism doesn't imply sodomy. Eros doesn't mean sex. You're all completely illiterate brainwashed commies.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            I agree, but the tone is a lot more intimate than just a couple of bros hanging out.

            I actually think you're right about people being way too quick to assume any friendship between men is gay, and it's mostly woke women projecting their fantasies, but I do think in this case you're ignoring the obvious. That's why I wanted to show you with direct quotes rather than giving my opinion. If Queequeg was a woman here I don't think you would be putting up this much of an argument about the nature of the scene.

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          Cuddling up with your boy for 7-8 hours is a little different than hugging your friend/kissing his cheek.

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          Why would this be gay? I've slept right next to some of my male friends on a trip in the same tent and none of us were/are gay. Male friends can do outwardly gay-seeming things like that exactly because everybody knows that there is zero sexual tension between the men involved.

          Yes. we covered this in the IQfy annoted edition.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            >Queequeg, Queerqueg as I named him,
            Howling

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          Why are morons so adamant about denying the existence of homosexuality in media, even when it is so plainly obvious? You could write a paragraph in a novel talking about a dude fricking another dude in the ass in explicit detail, and these guys would still come out the woodwork saying "aCTUALLY ITS NOT GAY, THEY WERE SHARING A BROTHERLY BOND, YOURE A israelite GOLEM DEMORALIZER homosexual israelite" and the like. Is it fetal alcohol syndrome? Is it autism? What is their affliction?

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous
    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      No, dude. That's very obviously the big gay.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      >me and bros share a bed and cuddle

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        It was thing with medieval european royalty to share a bed as a sign of trust. Alas moby was looking for some dick here

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Fpbp.

      sailors do gay shit, moron, it's not a israeli conspiracy to steal friendship from you. melville knew what he was writing

      No, dude. That's very obviously the big gay.

      >me and bros share a bed and cuddle

      The curse of homosexuality is to project sexuality where it doesn't belong.

  2. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    No, but he was writing in the tradition of men who were. Anyway, this book is incredible, you should read it.

  3. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    whether or not Melville had homosex impulses is irrelevant since he surely never acted on them.

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Bro acted on them when he wrote that shi

  4. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    Why would this be gay? I've slept right next to some of my male friends on a trip in the same tent and none of us were/are gay. Male friends can do outwardly gay-seeming things like that exactly because everybody knows that there is zero sexual tension between the men involved.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      It's the frodo/sam effect. Any male characters within a certain radius of each other in a story will start to be aggressively misunderstood as sexual partners by those wishing to have their own tastes and fetishes validated. This is especially important in "highly regarded" works as it creates a subconscious link between the reader and the YA-novel-tier caricature of these characters that exist in their head, a sort of "he's literally me!" kind of phenomenon.

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        I wish someone validated my tastes and fetishes, if you know what I mean

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          diet and exercise, then go out and be social

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            >diet and exercise
            Not fat
            >then go out
            No
            >and be social
            NO
            Getting your dick wet is nice but it's too much work. I'd rather be a recluse

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            Your post claimed that you wanted your tastes and fetishes validated, is there some kind of taste or fetish you have that doesn't exist in the real world?
            Also, diet and exercise isn't something to be avoided if you're "not fat", it's something that allows you to improve yourself.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      I've no idea if the passage in question is about gay men as I haven't read the book and lack context, but I also slept a lot in the same bed as my friend when I used to stay overnight playing video games, and we'd talk about random shit before falling asleep.
      I wonder if male relationships are somehow stifled in any way today because of the more modern openness and acceptance to homosexuality? Boys choosing to not spend as much time together or become as close out of fear of looking gay?
      Not that gayness being accepted is a bad thing mind you, maybe male friendships suffering is a necessary sacrifice, but when I was a teenager being gay was so uncommon that no one would accuse two boys hanging out and sleeping in the only bed they have of being that.
      >inb4 people going all "haha gayboy"

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        haha gayboy

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        I've shared beds with male friends plenty of times before. I truly don't see the issue. Only Americans and their deeply twisted relationship to sexuality are immediately relating this to homosexuality.

        No it's something with Americans, their culture around sexuality is completely rotten. Sadly they're importing it to Europe.

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        >Not that gayness being accepted is a bad thing mind you
        You've just explained why it's a bad thing. What's one good thing about it?

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          I don't think people should be persecuted for a preference or tendency they have no control over, as long as they don't act on those urges to do morally reprehensible things. Like I don't really agree with those organized gay orgies where they share STDs with each other, or pride parades, but if two consenting adults want to stick it up their bum in their bedroom it's no business of mine. I find the treatment of Alan Turing a tragedy for example.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            Wasn't Turing a pedophile?

            Also, not to be rude, but you didn't answer my question. I asked for one good thing about homosexuality, not your classical liberal take on the matter.

            You have an understandable propagandized outsider's understanding of homosexuality. The ones who have "no control over it" were typically raped into it as children. These days, it's not a hard thing to self-teach with all the resources out there.

            An initiatory process that you don't necessarily have the cognizance to consciously understand is not the same as an immutable personal quality, and even if such people do exist it's an incestuous and neutered corruption of male love.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            >Also, not to be rude, but you didn't answer my question. I asked for one good thing about homosexuality, not your classical liberal take on the matter.
            No, I thought you asked what's "one good thing about society accepting homosexuality", which I did answer. The answer being that innocent people no longer get harassed for something outside their control. Asking what's good about homosexuality is like asking what's good about left-handedness, it's just a thing that is, I don't believe by itself to be good or bad, some people are just born that way. Homosexual men don't end up reproducing I guess, you could consider that a "bad", but neither do 60% of straight men if statistics are to be believed, only 40% live to pass their genes.
            >You have an understandable propagandized outsider's understanding of homosexuality
            I discovered IQfy as a teenager so I'd rather say I have a pretty insider view on homosexuality, heh.
            >The ones who have "no control over it" were typically raped into it as children
            Sounds to me like the problem is rapists and sexual molesters, no? Which is bad for both straight and gay ones. And you say "typically", which means you acknowledge there are people who just happen to become gay for no discernible reason. Do you think a just society should incarcerate those people?

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            You're the most obviously closeted flag that I noticed on this board yet. You're basically telling us this yourself. The reason you're so sure of the fact that homosexuality is a choice that can somehow be 'controlled' is because you convinced yourself, probably subconsciously, that you have controlled that repressed part of yourself. You're now doing the classical 'I hate people that are living what I have repressed '.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            >The ones who have "no control over it" were typically raped into it as children
            I'm trying to understand if you believe all gay people were raped as children or not.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            >I asked for one good thing about homosexuality
            It leaves more women for men that actually like women.

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        >Not that gayness being accepted is a bad thing mind you
        You've just explained why it's a bad thing. What's one good thing about it?

        The only reason friends are "afraid of being gay" is because of the arbitrary decision that gay=bad, the rational conclusion is entirely pro-gay

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          >The only reason friends are "afraid of being gay" is because of the arbitrary decision that gay=bad,
          I literally said in my post I have nothing against gays, yet I wouldn't want people to think of me as gay, the same way I wouldn't want people to think of me as being vegan, muslim, or something else I'm not, because it's simply not me and it can influence how people treat me in a way that's not beneficial to me. (i.e. give me dairy-free, meat-free gifts.)
          Are you really saying that the only reason someone would not want everyone else to think of them as gay, is because they think being gay is bad? Well I'm not gonna argue with you on this since I probably can't change your mind.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            I can believe that you dont have anything explicit against gays but cultural attitudes subconsciously influence your behaviour
            > same way I wouldn't want people to think of me as being vegan, muslim, or something else I'm not
            Think about it in terms of risk and reward... if you would put off being intimate with your friend just to avoid being seen as gay, you probably view the latter thing as a very undesirable state

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            >if you would put off being intimate with your friend just to avoid being seen as gay
            Wasn't a thing until some Hollywood commie decided to make it a thing in 1993. It does not occur to normal healthy men to associate the intimacy they've experienced with their friends since they were born with any of this deranged horseshit you're trying to push as normal. The media and media golems like you condition people with that unnatural association.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            you didnt even read what i said you illiterate

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      I went camping with some guys and they acted offended when I brought my own personal tent instead of sharing one with them

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        >camping with guys
        they're gays

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          There was a big group, half women half men. I was the only person who tented alone and everyone thought it was weird

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            It is weird. You are supposed to cuddle to conserve body heat like in the olden times. At least have the decency next time to tell them in advance so they can bring an extra blanket

  5. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    Nah. How much room on a ship? Where and how can you confide in someone aboard? And it's weird by most people's standards, but seamen, maybe marines? Public areas are a place on ships these days, so you'd do your talking there.

    He's talking about Queeqweg as if they're an old married couple. It's an adorable contrast to the harsh conditions aboard.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      except they aren't aboard shit, chucklehead. this passage is from before they've even choosen what boat they'll sail on.

  6. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    Yes, but he still wrote some bangers.

  7. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    >that passage.

    I've heard at one point that straight men are emotionally attracted to men, but physically repulsed by men, and as a man I think I believe that.

    I don't necessarily think we should be fricking each other in the ass, but men probably deserve, respect, and cherish each other, more than women ever will.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      ding ding.

  8. 1 month ago
    Anonymous
    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      That's true. Writers always let a bit of their mind leak through their works. Maybe he was a latent homosexual but he didn't know.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      This just looks like the kind of flowery language that someone in the 1800s would write to pad out their word count and get paid more. If the book had more female characters surely they'd be given the same kind of long-winded descriptions. Factor in our present cultural trend of hyper-sexualized recontextualization and suddenly the language becomes more up in the air as to whether or not it was even supposed to be seen the same way then as it is now.
      Moby Dick is as homosexual as you wish to interpret.

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        Supposedly Typee does linger on men much more than on women

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          Documentation of history and culture, especially 19th-century documentation of history and culture, lingers more on men than women.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            > Anonymous 05/23/24(Thu)10:40:06 No.23413079▶

            Supposedly Typee does linger on men much more than on women

            Documentation of history and culture, especially 19th-century documentation of history and culture, lingers more on men than women.

            And for good cause: THICK JUICY wienerS

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          Here. Watch this film adaptation of Typee from 1935 titled Last of the Pagans. It is a beautiful film and incredibly underrated.

          https://vimeo.com/306060795

  9. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    This is not gay at all wtf is wrong with people, this was written in the 19th century and Melville mind was pure

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      >no one was gay before 2010

  10. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    I would kill to see those footnotes on the sperm chapter

  11. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    Based grandpa, but yes, if not gay then very close to it.

  12. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    That entire part of the story about sleeping in the same bed with Queequeg is just one big gay joke. It's like
    >Isn't this whole situation uncomfortable? Imagine two men sleeping in the same bed lmao

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      show me the part of the text that indicates that they are not comfortable being in bed together after they share the pipe.

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        stop being obtuse
        stop it

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          how am i being obtuse? queequeg and ismael are the comfiest two characters in all of literature when they share a bed. here are the two paragraphs that follow the one pictured in OP:
          >"We had lain thus in bed, chatting and napping at short intervals, and Queequeg now and then affectionately throwing his brown tattooed legs over mine, and then drawing them back; so entirely sociable and free and easy were we; when, at last, by reason of our confabulations, what little nappishness remained in us altogether departed, and we felt like getting up again, though day-break was yet some way down the future."
          >"Yes, we became very wakeful; so much so that our recumbent position began to grow wearisome, and by little and little we found ourselves sitting up; the clothes well tucked around us, leaning against the head-board with our four knees drawn up close together, and our two noses bending over them, as if our kneepans were warming-pans. We felt very nice and snug, the more so since it was so chilly out of doors; indeed out of bed-clothes too, seeing that there was no fire in the room. The more so, I say, because truly to enjoy bodily warmth, some small part of you must be cold, for there is no quality in this world that is not what it is merely by contrast. Nothing exists in itself. If you flatter yourself that you are all over comfortable, and have been so a long time, then you cannot be said to be comfortable any more. But if, like Queequeg and me in the bed, the tip of your nose or the crown of your head be slightly chilled, why then, indeed, in the general consciousness you feel most delightfully and unmistakably warm. For this reason a sleeping apartment should never be furnished with a fire, which is one of the luxurious discomforts of the rich. For the height of this sort of deliciousness is to have nothing but the blanket between you and your snugness and the cold of the outer air. Then there you lie like the one warm spark in the heart of an arctic crystal."
          the next few paragraphs don't look anybetter for you, either. you couldn't PAY ishmael to get out of that bed. you're just a triggered snowflake.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous
          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            Wow great argument gaytron you sure convinced me with those hot opinions

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            Oh, that's a relief. I will expect better behavior in the future.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            lmao. they really loved that non sexual adult sleepover

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        >show me the part of the text that indicates that they are not comfortable being in bed together after they share the pipe.
        That entire passage, from the moment ishmael enters the tavern, is written as a comedy of errors. The sudden forced intimacy of sharing a bed with a face-tattooed cannibal that sells shrunken heads is absurd, and shocking imagery in an age when christian husbands didn't even sleep in the same bed as their wives.

        This wokeshit instinct to read every instance of male intimacy as homolust is pretty insufferable.

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          you tarded bro? i said after they share the pipe and you referenced the stuff that happens before they share the pipe. yeah, its a comedy of errors, but it resloves itself with the two getting along famously and agreeing to continue the sleeping arrangement tommorow. as i said, you couldn't pay ishmael to get out of that bed because he is sharing it with his lover.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            You are really sperging out about this "before pipe after pipe" thing, yes we get it, but who cares? It's a completely trivial point. That's why I called you "obtuse". Tardy.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            i mentioned before the pipe because at that point they are strangers.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            OK, but who cares? The basic point that the scene is humorous stands. Nobody else even mentioned the fricking pipe.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            but there's nothing humorous after they share the pipe until the next morning when queequeg gets dressed. you say they aren't comfortable sharing a bed and that the whole thing is a joke but that is a flat out lie. they obviously love being in bed with eachother, something you refuse to acknowledge because you are a delicate little prude with a narrow worldview. you might as well watch "the awful truth" and say that cary grant's character can't be attracted to irene dunne's because it's a comedy.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            https://i.imgur.com/mKlBvig.jpeg

            but there's nothing humorous after they share the pipe until the next morning when queequeg gets dressed. you say they aren't comfortable sharing a bed and that the whole thing is a joke but that is a flat out lie. they obviously love being in bed with eachother, something you refuse to acknowledge because you are a delicate little prude with a narrow worldview. you might as well watch "the awful truth" and say that cary grant's character can't be attracted to irene dunne's because it's a comedy.

            Them ending up getting along is the punchline. It subverts your expectation.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      I've slept in the same bed with friends, it's not a big deal.
      But I still think the queequeeg shit is a bit suspect

  13. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    he's just being funny

  14. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    From Melville's, "Journal of a visit to London and the Continent, 1849-1850":
    >"Went to the New Strand Theatre. A capital piece, excellently played - "The Clandestine Marriage" by Colman. All the parts admirably sustained. Mrs. Glover (an old veteran and great favorite) as Mrs. Heidelberg. Leigh Murray as Melvil - the finest leg I ever saw on a man - a devilishly well-turned-out man, upon my soul. Old Farren was Lord Ogleby."

  15. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    More often than not a highly controversial topic of discussion acting as "curtain-theme" that muddies the water -pollutes, that is, not complicates- would leave the average reader wondering whether there is nothing else to the text but, blessed be Moby Dick, that is simply not the case here and in fact works in favour of the book. The only thing I still wonder at is whether this is all a malicious but poorly thought out attempt to hurt the book (and its popularity on IQfy) or if, perhaps, so many people really are so utterly dimwitted.

  16. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    It's well known that all sailors are gay.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      This. I used to work on a fishing trawler and the only thing these gays eould do was shittalk their bosses or the ceo of whatever fishery quota owner most tickled their fancy out of sheer jealousy. Got out of that commie shithole first month i could

  17. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    >paganism leads to homosex
    True facts.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      More like
      >christcuckery bans homosex
      Every other way of interacting with the world for all of human history has been full of it.

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        > the true religion does things differently than the fake ones
        damn

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        >christcuckery
        you mean the old testament, which is israeli
        and abrahamic religions aren't the only religions that opposed gay sex, other ancient civilization did too

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          >you mean the old testament
          the New Testament also says not to have gay sex.

  18. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    nice cursive

  19. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    It's supposed to be funny. Moby Dick is filled with jokes.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      haha what if we cuddled all night long like as a joke haha

  20. 1 month ago
    Anonymous
  21. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    your grandfather sounds like a real perceptive genius. what year did he drink himself to death?

  22. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    Regardless if that particular bit was constructed with a deliberately gay intent, Melville clearly had some homosexual urges.

    His letters to Nathaniel Hawthorne, for context:
    >My dear Hawthorne, the atmospheric skepticisms steal into me now, and make me doubtful of my sanity in writing you thus. But, believe me, I am not mad, most noble Festus! But truth is ever incoherent, and when the big hearts strike together, the concussion is a little stunning.
    >I can’t stop yet. If the world was entirely made up of [magicians], I’ll tell you what I should do. I should have a paper-mill established at one end of the house, and so have an endless riband of foolscap rolling in upon my desk; and upon that endless riband I should write a thousand — a million — billion thoughts, all under the form of a letter to you. The divine magnet is in you, and my magnet responds. Which is the biggest? A foolish question — they are One.

    Here's a stanza from a poem he wrote, a few years after Hawthorne passed away
    >To have known him, to have loved him
    > After loneness long;
    >And then to be estranged in life,
    > And neither in the wrong;
    >And now for death to set his seal—
    > Ease me, a little ease, my song!

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      Literally none of that is gay you frickin freak. What the hell is it with angloids and their brainworms?

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        not him but I'm genuinely curious if there is a single historical figure you accept to be homosexul or bisexual

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          Not any poster in the thread so far, but yeah, I mean there’s at least obvious ones like Oscar Wilde, Gide, and whoever else.

          As for Melville, I for some reason tend to weigh down on the side of the view that the whole Queequeg-Ishmael thing is both:
          A.) meant to be at least a little humorous (the unexpected situation of the White man having such a close camaraderie with the seemingly frightening “Savage” and them in fact acting like schoolboys giddy over being able to have a sleepover)
          and B.) also could just be an honest depiction of masculine friendship and camaraderie

          He did marry a woman and have a son. To be generous, and because I admit the subtext there is blatant, I can admit that Melville may have at least had repressed/latent homosexual tendencies, but with his marriage to his wife this would make him bisexual, if anything. (Yes, I know, you might bring up there’s the possible phenomenon of ultra-closeted homosexuals marrying wives to blend into society and even having children with them, but at this point it’s such a far-out conjecture the burden would be on you to prove it). But even then, the critics of this mindset here might be right. I can’t help but feel that some of the motivation for dubbing male camaraderie and masculine bonding “homosexual” or “latently homosexual” is for some type of emasculation of men.

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          >a single historical figure you accept to be homosexul
          Absolutely not anon. No historical figure was actually gay. Any alleged homosexuality was just demoralizing propaganda spread by satanic Freemasons. Christ is KING!

          Hey anon, do you think you can do me the courtesy of not assuming that I'm a frickin cretin?

          Not any poster in the thread so far, but yeah, I mean there’s at least obvious ones like Oscar Wilde, Gide, and whoever else.

          As for Melville, I for some reason tend to weigh down on the side of the view that the whole Queequeg-Ishmael thing is both:
          A.) meant to be at least a little humorous (the unexpected situation of the White man having such a close camaraderie with the seemingly frightening “Savage” and them in fact acting like schoolboys giddy over being able to have a sleepover)
          and B.) also could just be an honest depiction of masculine friendship and camaraderie

          He did marry a woman and have a son. To be generous, and because I admit the subtext there is blatant, I can admit that Melville may have at least had repressed/latent homosexual tendencies, but with his marriage to his wife this would make him bisexual, if anything. (Yes, I know, you might bring up there’s the possible phenomenon of ultra-closeted homosexuals marrying wives to blend into society and even having children with them, but at this point it’s such a far-out conjecture the burden would be on you to prove it). But even then, the critics of this mindset here might be right. I can’t help but feel that some of the motivation for dubbing male camaraderie and masculine bonding “homosexual” or “latently homosexual” is for some type of emasculation of men.

          >I can’t help but feel that some of the motivation for dubbing male camaraderie and masculine bonding “homosexual” or “latently homosexual” is for some type of emasculation of men

          When it is done earnestly and respectfully it can pretty great. Pic related is a homoerotic exploration of Billy Budd and its pure kino. But you're absolutely on point that there is a barbed, malicious quality to these "deconstructions of masculinity".
          >Some non-binary comparative lit major discovers a letter from Tolkien to C.S.Lewis
          >"My dearest friend, as I sit down to write to you, I am reminded of the many discussions we've had over a pint or two. How I miss those days..."
          >TOLKIEN MISSES A MAN! GAY SUBPLOT CONFIRMED!!!
          >see that chud? the author of your favorite christo-teutonic macho power fantasy was actually a repressed sissy gay boy! ha ha!
          Sadly, trite horseshit of this sort is ubiquitous in the liberal arts. Mostly because women really eat this up.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            Yep, that’s pretty much it, thanks for saying it even better for me. The psychological motivations are so funnily transparent and hypocritical here. Of course, from a modern socially progressive view, they have to add that “of course it’s not like there’s anything WRONG with being homosexual teehee”, nor are they implying homosexual men are necessarily effeminate. But at the same time, you can tell some of them rather get off on poking at, disparaging, and embarrassing people’s masculinity. “Queering the Odyssey: Homosexuality and Castration Fear in Odysseus’s Psyche”. Whatever the frick. They feel like they gotta strike back at the chuds and inform them that not only are they latent repressed homosexuals, but also that it’s even in all these idealized masculine writers of the Western canon, but on top of it all, once again, “it’s not like I’m saying there’s anything WRONG with being gay, teehee!”. I just see the desire to emasculate men being so psychologically transparent in some cases like these. Which ironically should be a little offensive to gay people also, because they’re semiconsciously using it as a sort of bludgeon to insult/embarrass people

            I mean, I’ll admit the obvious cases, from pederasty amongst the Greeks and the praise of beautiful boys in Plato’s dialogues, to the beautiful male youth of Shakespeare’s sonnets whom he seems rather obsessed with, but Melville just doesn’t give off that same sense to me. Sometime there really is a thing like masculine bonding without it being sexual. Same way not every case of women bonding together means they’re lesbian. Maybe sometimes it’s true, but far from every case.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      You forgot the gayest quote of them all
      >I feel that this Hawthorne has dropped germinous seeds into my soul. He expands and deepens down, the more I contemplate him; and further, and further, shoots his strong New England roots into the hot soil of my Southern soul.

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous
      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        Sounds pretty gay out of context but I get what he’s saying. This is from “Hawthorne and his Mosses” I think?

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          There's no context in which it doesn't sound gay. Why do anons deny very obviously gay subtext?

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            >There's no context in which it doesn't sound gay. Why do anons deny very obviously gay subtext?
            Men fricking men isn't necessarily gay.

            Gay is a subculture which developed in the 20th century.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            >Men fricking men isn't necessarily gay
            That's suss

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            Gay bars have been around since the 18th century, at least.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            I'm sure you'd know.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            So, are you calling him gay or a vampire?

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            What's the difference.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            Vampires suck.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            Gays don't?

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >Gay bars
            Claiming Mollies were Gay is sick dude.

  23. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    well there's DICK in the title of the book

  24. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    Melville might have been gay if he lived in the 21st century, but I'm not sure if people in the 19th century had the same conception of sexuality as we do today. This is why I'm skeptical when people always claim that the Bible says that homosexuality is a sin.

  25. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    sailors are know to be homosexuals
    and the young guys at the bottom of the sailing hierarchies were raped on boats for months

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      >sailors are know to be homosexuals
      >young guys at the bottom of the sailing hierarchies were raped on boats for months
      This is complete, utterly deranged bullshit. Le gay village people sailor meme is a late 20th century fabrication. In the age of sail sodomy was a grievous crime punishable by death. Midshipmen who were as young as 10 were officers in training and the sons of lords or other important persons. You could not touch a hair on their heads without getting keel-hauled and fed to sharks.

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous
  26. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    Obviously the balls didn't touch. So no, not gay. Just good friends hugging naked in a bed, as we all did in middle school.

  27. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    >I should have a paper-mill established at one end of the house, and so have an endless riband of foolscap rolling in upon my desk; and upon that endless riband I should write a thousand—a million—billion thoughts, all under the form of a letter to you. The divine magnet is on you, and my magnet responds. Which is the biggest? A foolish question—they are One.
    The man wanted hard wiener, it's that simple.

  28. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    >Calls his book the Moby(meaning: extremely large) and Dick(meaning: a dick)
    >Bunch of sailors on a boat are in search of an extremely large dick(s)

  29. 1 month ago
    Anonymous
  30. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    https://www.theguardian.com/books/2019/jul/30/subversive-queer-and-terrifyingly-relevant-six-reasons-why-moby-dick-is-the-novel-for-our-times

    It’s a very queer book

    Moby-Dick may be the first work of western fiction to feature a same-sex marriage: Ishmael, the loner narrator (famous for the most ambiguous opening line in literature) gets hitched – in bed – to the omni-tattooed Pacific islander, Queequeg: “He pressed his forehead against mine, clasped me round the waist, and said that henceforth we were married.” Other scenes are deeply homoerotic: sailors massage each others’ hands in a tub of sperm oil and there is an entire chapter devoted to foreskins (albeit of the whalish variety).
    A 1840 portrait of the writer Nathaniel Hawthorne.
    A 1840 portrait of the writer Nathaniel Hawthorne. Photograph: AP

    Indeed, the whole book is a love letter (sadly unreciprocated) from a besotted Melville to his hero, Nathaniel Hawthorne, to whom he wrote: “You have sunk your northern roots down into my southern soul.”

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      >Melville’s reflections on our own species still reverberate. Days after 9/11, the Palestinian-American writer Edward Said compared George W Bush’s pursuit of Osama bin Laden to Ahab’s obsessive hunt for the white whale. The current tenant of the White House draws comparisons to Ahab’s crazed mission, too: Trump’s desire for a wall
      Holy mother of god, what an absolute, steaming piece of shit of an article. This is orangeman-is-voldemort-reddit-tier levels of midwit on display.

  31. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    Was Melville gay? Pussy shit. You want a real thread question?
    Was Oscar Wilde gay?

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      He wasn't. He was a womaniser as well. But gay rights activists co-opted him to fit their narrative.

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        He was so gay that he was the first English translator of Petronius.

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          He fricked loads of women. He was a hedonist like Sade.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            Petronius Arbiter was a libertine from antiquity who wrote lots of crass, sexual stories centered around three pansexual friends visiting brothels and places in the ancient world. It is really telling Wilde was the first person to dare translate his crude and fragmented novel into the English tongue.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            It’s crazy how I’ve memorized this lust-provoking pic from maybe years back also on IQfy, I think also on IQfy, having saved it for my spank bank. I guess a few pictures are just favorites here.

  32. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    I found MD very funny and I always interpreted the gay moments as played up for comedy

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      This is the obviously correct reading. If you read that paragraph and can’t see how tongue-in-cheek it is you might be moronic

  33. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    In any country where homosexuality is punishable by death/extremely taboo, you will witness heterosexual men engaging in public displays of intimacy with eachother. Holding hands, grooming, kissing, etc. Only In countries where homosexuality is accepted, is this range of behavior categorized as homosexual. To look back and think anything like that is homosexual is like seeing an adult walking and holding a kids hand and thinking, "oh he must be a pedophile". An absurd conclusion to draw, but honestly one that I wouldn't put past these brain melted phds who can only conceptualize the world by projecting their latent need to shove their dick in the shit hole of other men.

  34. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    stop bringing your sick fetishes into everything. you've never experienced true male friendship. probably because you're gay and cant act normally around other men.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      > get into gay furry porn when I'm younger (thanks illuminati)
      > no problem, they're not human so it doesn't translate in person
      > find true male friendship
      > get an erection

      He's right fellas, watch out for this. Gay stuff is basically incest for the global brotherhood

  35. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    tldr but very nice handwriting from grandpa
    wish I wrote like that

  36. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    Nothing wrong with two dudes just hugging it out

  37. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    The passage is clearly describing the close nature of their friendship by comparing it, humorously and facetiously, to that of a married couple. People who read gay shit into everything lack media literacy unironically

  38. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    Steven Seagal has the gay.

  39. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    I think this is the kind of thing you have to experience or witness first hand to understand. I never understood being prison or sailor gay until I started working in strip mines in the absolute fricking middle of nowhere Nevada. You had it good if you were a married guy who could go home for two days every 6-8 weeks to get some hole and wake up outside of a rank smelling mining dorm. If you were a single guy all you got was a 6 hour drive hoping to get some of the disgusting, worn out, pro and amateur pussy of old mining towns like Ely, Elko, and Battle Mountain. If you're an old timer in the mine there are guys you've spent years with almost every day and almost every hour of those days. You work together, you eat together, you drink together, you share almost every facet of your life together. While it's too macho of an environment for it to be openly acknowledged there are these kind of relationships going on it's just a fact of life there. We even called one of the shop store rooms 'the cum closet' because of how often it was used for sexual liasons. Humans need intimacy and that need is strong enough to overrule a person's sexuality over a long enough and isolated enough period.
    Luckily I was ostracized and called a book reading homosexual so I could keep my heterosexuality is intact.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      An actual interesting post for once, thanks anon.

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        Thanks fren, I almost never get (you)s for my posts about being a miner.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      >Battle Mountain is an unincorporated town in and the county seat of Lander County, Nevada, United States.
      Americans are so weird.

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        Here's a view of the sprawling metropolis known as Battle Mountain. The whole county outside of it is mines and public land, the next largest town has a population of 113. The 98% of Nevada that isn't Reno or Las Vegas is the American equivalent of far northern Siberia.

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          My bad

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        What is weird about that?

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          Without context I can see how a town with no government being the seat of the county government sounds silly.

  40. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    Bumping for insightful debate on homosexuality in literature

  41. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    its a neg0-bed.the1stpartaei.
    yer wan at the END uis only a sinner.
    nobody inrthe right myned w/o pur3 love likes shareing a morning!.
    lie is lie is lie is lie is lies is.
    #buddhism
    koopa troop a stanger from a pram or ur un-actual 1st time in a synagouge/church/temple/theathre.
    yer man melvile must love knut b4 wiener eit a name elike that or elsee went overboard with amailman G.P.
    toffeechateau

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      Are you Dutch?

  42. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    read this for the first time recently, and blud could just not stop yapping about whales damn

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      I thought I was in the HxH thread on IQfy when I read this, kek

  43. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    Every great writer should have at least a little bit of the gay.

  44. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    what was the white whale supposed to be a symbol for

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      God, Satan, Nature, Science, Capitalism, Race, Nothing

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Semen

  45. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    Me and my homies love chatting in bed together while naked.

  46. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    I can't imagine having sex with my male friends but kissing and hugging and sleeping together seems perfectly normal. Even the letters Melville wrote to Hawthorne seem like the playful homosexual ribbing, my friends and I would engage in.

  47. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    It's been a long time since I read it. Do we know 100% that Queeqs was a man?

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >Do we know 100% that Queeqs was a man?
      Yes, we 100% know that Queegs was a man. We *don't* know if he had a vegana though.

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