How did the conquistadors win when they were so badly outnumbered?

How did the conquistadors win when they were so badly outnumbered?

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  1. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    Guns
    Germs
    And Steel

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      Superior tech. They built catapults to siege the city out of wood taken from their dismantled and burned ships.

      Also everyone hates the Aztecs because they were the dominant power in the region for a century at that point. Not because they were le HECKIN meanie sacrificial cannibals. That's a meme cooked up by the Spanish to get a pardon from the governor and sweep it under the rug that their Indian allies were also a bunch of heathens who sacrificed their enemies.

      can you cite your sources please?

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        No

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        Guns
        Germs
        And Steel

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      At first, they were able to rout native armies by taking advantage of the fact that they had cavalry while the injuns didn't, later on they simply weren't outnumbered at all, with many thousands of native allies on their side.

      Guns were entirely a non-factor in the conquest of Mexico, and steel wasn't really all that relevant either, it was all about the horses.

      Superior tech. They built catapults to siege the city out of wood taken from their dismantled and burned ships.

      Also everyone hates the Aztecs because they were the dominant power in the region for a century at that point. Not because they were le HECKIN meanie sacrificial cannibals. That's a meme cooked up by the Spanish to get a pardon from the governor and sweep it under the rug that their Indian allies were also a bunch of heathens who sacrificed their enemies.

      First of all, people need to stop equating the conquest of Mexico to the conquest of the Aztec Empire. Once you get that out of the way, the notion that the spanish got allies because the Aztecs were uniquely mean becomes quite ridiculous, after all the spanish continued to wage war against other indian polities after Tenochtitlan fell (including against former Aztec vassals) and they continued to get new native allies in most of those wars.
      The way people talk about the conquest on the internet, you'd think every single native american within the borders of modern mexico immediately desintegrated into dust and was replaced by mestizos the second after Tenochtitlan fell, when in reality it was a whole lot more complicated than that.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      in other words
      >morale
      >morale
      >morale
      they intimidated Aztec Empire into total submission and dissolution.
      their will to power was greater than the Aztecs'
      Neither guns nor germs nor steel (combined even) could ever make the conflict remotely even between the Spanish conquistadors (like, fricking 200 per expedition) and however many tens of thousands of Aztecs were left after* disease.

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        >nono you see i REALLY WANTED to win so that willed it into existence
        moronic

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      *God, genes, and balls of steel

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      thread/

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      I could get all of those things and 200 frens, I don't think I would be able to succeed that easily

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        Gotta replace yourself and imagine instead 200 Taliban armed to the teethe invading the North Sentinel Islands. Iberians were among the most radicalized Christians to ever exist due to how long and brutal the Reconquista was

        • 2 months ago
          Anonymous

          Realistically what's stopping 20 men in full suit of armor and taking over that island?

          • 2 months ago
            Anonymous

            Nothing. But I don't see why you'd want to conquer an island with now valuable resources that'll be under water in a few decades anyway. And that's something that rarely gets mentioned about the Sentinelise. They're living on borrowed time.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      >thinks ambition, human emotion, betrayal, or anything other than geographic and resource determinism determines anything.

      Actually no guns germs and steels main points would side with the Muslims.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      Superior tech. They built catapults to siege the city out of wood taken from their dismantled and burned ships.

      Also everyone hates the Aztecs because they were the dominant power in the region for a century at that point. Not because they were le HECKIN meanie sacrificial cannibals. That's a meme cooked up by the Spanish to get a pardon from the governor and sweep it under the rug that their Indian allies were also a bunch of heathens who sacrificed their enemies.

      Because there were 20x as many allied natives fighting the Mexica as there were Spanish you fricking plebeians.

  2. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    Superior tech. They built catapults to siege the city out of wood taken from their dismantled and burned ships.

    Also everyone hates the Aztecs because they were the dominant power in the region for a century at that point. Not because they were le HECKIN meanie sacrificial cannibals. That's a meme cooked up by the Spanish to get a pardon from the governor and sweep it under the rug that their Indian allies were also a bunch of heathens who sacrificed their enemies.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      >That's a meme cooked up by the Spanish to get a pardon from the governor and sweep it under the rug
      it was not, the tenochtitlan temple had tens of thousands of people murdered at its consecration

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        True, they killed 8 trillion babies in three days n shiet
        Source: viva el spain, a Hispanic account on how shit happened ese

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        >tens of thousands people sacrificed every day in a stone age civilization with primitive agriculture that could support 100,000 people at most
        So true, Jose Guadalupe Sanchez de la Goblinez y Masapan.

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        They murdered captured warriors, not civilians en masse like hollywood depicts. When the Aztec unification war ended they actually set up an agreement with their fiefdoms do have mock skirmishes and collect X number of warriors to sacrifice at the capitol city. Apart from steel armor and guns the Aztecs were not prepared for the Spaniards war strategy. The whole Aztec military logic was based on capturing enemy soldiers, it was actually considered a faux pas among Aztec warriors to kill a potential sacrifice in battle. It was alien to them to go to war with the Spaniards and watch them kill warriors en masse.

        • 2 months ago
          Anonymous

          >When the Aztec unification war ended they actually set up an agreement with their fiefdoms do have mock skirmishes and collect X number of warriors to sacrifice at the capitol city
          Not at all. First of all, Flower Wars were only ever fought against a few very specific states: Tlaxcala, Cholula and Huexotzinco. These were not Aztec "fiefdoms" but fully independent states, enemies of the Aztec Triple Alliance, against whom "real" wars were also commonly waged against. Secondly, Flower Wars likely had actual geopolitical purposes, not purely ritualistic, as is made obvious by the fact they were directed against their major rivals (NOT against their vassals, as is commonly believed amongst internet pop-his circled) and the fact that flower wars against Cholula and Huexotzinco ceased as soon as they stopped being enemies of the Aztecs. By setting up battles between professional noble warriors, hostilities could extend beyond the Mesoamerican campaign season, when the peasants that made up the bulk of armies would have been busy with agriculture.

          The notion that the Aztecs aimed only to capture enemies for sacrifice instead of just killing them is likewise false. Captive taking mostly took place after a battle was done, when the enemies were already fleeing the battlefield, and it's mentioned in the accounts that Aztec commaders would sometimes command their men to just not even try to take captives at all and just focus on winning and killing.

  3. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    >raise an equally sized army of natives to the one you're attacking
    >supplement it with technology the opposing army has no access to
    >???
    >profit

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      >raise an equally sized army of natives
      All of you that tell about the txacaltecas helping the Spaniards seem to forget that the txacaltecas had 3 enormous battles against the Spaniards and they were defeated and that is why they finally joined them.

      So the Spaniards not only had to defeat the aztecas but ALSO the native armies that helped them. And in one of the battles against the txacaltecas the Spaniards and Cortes almost died.

  4. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    >show up with a horse
    >natives think it's an alien god
    >throw their weapons down and flee

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      How moronic can you be? Why are you even on a history board with takes so stupid?

  5. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    They had cavalry.

  6. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    We don't know. There's an ~~*official*~~ narrative, but just read the posts in the thread. It's so silly and blatantly propaganda.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      Schizophrenic spic

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        Not even close. Who's paying you?

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      >conspiracyshit
      Its like this board can't understand nuance. No, a few hundred Spaniards didn't single handedly defeat the Aztecs like it was 300 nor was it just disease that caused the Aztec's downfall. It was a variety of circumstances and reasons from technological superiority, to horses, to Cortes' shrewd diplomacy and more. If you guys actually bother to read any books it comes to these conclusions as well. The Spanish conquests were multifaceted and complex and weren't anything like hollywood or pop culture told you.

  7. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    disease did most of the work, and they had thousands of native allies, mostly Tlaxcalans.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      yes, the diseases concocted in the underground laboratories by remnents of the Rephaim, that were used for germ warfare.

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        Why were the Rephaim working for the Spanish?

  8. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    They were mostly israelites. They went into civilised society, concoct some war justification, turn them all against eachother, enslave them, and then claim they were the innocent victims all along hated for no reason... Mainline European reactions to New World civs were curiosity, optimism, diplomatic... Reaction to S*anish barbarity that followed was horror and outrage.

  9. 2 months ago
    ࿇ C Œ M G E N V S ࿇

    YOU CAN ANSWER THAT QUESTION EVEN BY READING THE «WIKIPEDIA» ARTICLE ABOUT THE CONQUEST OF TENOCHTITLAN.

    READ A FRICKING BOOK.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      Silence, chaparrito

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      You will never be Spanish.

  10. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    Through the power of friendship.

  11. 2 months ago
    Radiochan

    behind 200 conquistadors were 20k mesoamericans the aztecs really, really pissed off

  12. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    supplies of underaged brown bussy had dried up with the reconquista, and the spanish crown was desperate to keep the brown bussy -> vatican pipeline going

  13. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    Moor genes, think about it, despite being vastly outnumbered the moors managed to turn the iberian peninsula into a massive cumdumpster

  14. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    Native auxiliaries

  15. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    In order of importance

    1. Leader quality
    2. Military organization
    3. Horses
    4. Steel
    5. Native allies

    The allies clearly werent the biggest reason since they defeated vast native armies alone (the native allies didnt just submit on contact)
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Otumba
    https://es.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Batalla_de_Centla

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      I agree that leadership quality is the most important but the allies were extremely important

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        Sure, 5th most important is still important obviously. But like I said, the Spanish proved they could defeat far superior numbers to their own before they agreed on any alliances with the natives. It wasnt THE reason for them prevailing.

        • 2 months ago
          Anonymous

          But even one of those battles you posted had natives in them. I also don't think they could have taken tenochitlan without help

          • 2 months ago
            Anonymous

            Insignificant numbers. 800 vs an army of 10.000+

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      You seem to forget the enormous cojones and courage that Spaniards have demostrated all their History in all places in the world. Since celtic times to roman times to against islam times, almogavares time, Reconquista times, Tercios times, civil war times, or even during Wolrd War II times (despite Spain not being directly involved both republicanos liberated Paris "La Nueve" and "Division Azul" was the most powerful nazi allied division in the Eastern Front).

      You can also see this fight spirit in modern sports where Spaniards have won: European and World Championships in all sports for the last 20 years (football, basket, tennis, f1, motogp, moto2, moto3, superbikes, enduro, rallies, waterpolo, volleyball, and a long etc.)

      People still don´t get that Spaniards (the good ones) descend from Atlantes (Atlantida).

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        You named like 7 sports you moron. There's a lot more than 7 sports

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        literal cheerleader/hooligan

  16. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    How the hell could they let Spaniards escape Tenochtitlan

  17. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    1. natives hated the aztecs for the mandatory nobility human sacrifices required
    2. spaniards were willing to frick anything that was also catholic
    3. spaniards guaranteed natives completely free and unrestricted entrance to heaven if they worshipped jesus, which was a pretty good deal considering point #1

    It's an excellent case study in why christianity spread so quickly, because it doesn't demand money, sacrifices or people.

  18. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    Experience fighting the Moors. 5 foot tall Stone Age Mongoloids posed zero challenge.

  19. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    >Experience fighting the Moors. 5 foot tall Stone Age Mongoloids posed zero challenge.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      these people raped modern iberians into existence

  20. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    Just more proof that even a small alien invasion could conquer the entire planet.

  21. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    The natives were no match for fully automatic machine guns and helicopter warships

  22. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    hundred millionth garbage thread about the conquista this week

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      the garbage threads will continue until posting quality improves

  23. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    They were superior men, who had read if Plati and ansorbed his power.

  24. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    For the most part they weren't outnumbered since they had thousands of native allies but disease and horses played a significant role as well

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      the "native allies" didnt become their allies out of nowhere

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        Well yeah since everyone hated the Aztecs

        • 2 months ago
          Anonymous

          to the point of submitting to people of a different race and religion who were mere hundreds?

          • 2 months ago
            Anonymous

            The alternative was to continue being under the heel of the Aztecs. Besides they didn't know what was going to happen to them after the Aztecs fell

          • 2 months ago
            Anonymous

            Yes. The Aztecs were extraordinarily cruel and violent rulers of their empire, not only for the famous human sacrifices but also general slave-taking and extortion. When the Spanish arrived, many natives thought, essentially, “wow, these guys are so much stronger than the Aztecs, and they want to take over their empire: they can’t possibly be worse, so we should take our one chance and join them.”

        • 2 months ago
          Anonymous

          But they didn't go on crusade against Aztecs because they perceived their chances to win as weak. But seeing Spaniards on their side they now perceived themselves on the wining side. You don't join losing side in the war.

  25. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    Faith, steel swords and fencing skills.

  26. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    Vastly superior technology helped a lot, but the main reason is that huge numbers of the natives supported them. The Aztecs were extremely brutal and cruel rulers of their empire: the subject tribes all hated them, and jumped at the chance to overthrow them alongside the obviously-stronger Spaniards. The conquistadors would not have been able to bring down the Aztecs without the other natives’ manpower, and the other natives could not have brought down the Aztecs without the armored and mounted conquistadors acting as the spearhead.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      The alternative was to continue being under the heel of the Aztecs. Besides they didn't know what was going to happen to them after the Aztecs fell

      Yes. The Aztecs were extraordinarily cruel and violent rulers of their empire, not only for the famous human sacrifices but also general slave-taking and extortion. When the Spanish arrived, many natives thought, essentially, “wow, these guys are so much stronger than the Aztecs, and they want to take over their empire: they can’t possibly be worse, so we should take our one chance and join them.”

      As has been said hundreds of times on this board of this point, that's a pop-his meme, nothing more. Every single culture in the region practiced human sacrifice, nothing the Aztecs did was unusual by Mesoamerican standards, and the spanish got native allies in just about every single campaign they fought, the Aztecs were not an unique case.
      Overall, the fact the spanish got native allies had absolutely nothing to do with the practice of human sacrifice or anything moralistic like that, it was entirely a matter of political opportunism.

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        >not only for the famous human sacrifices but also general slave-taking and extortion
        Just because your tribe does human sacrifices doesn’t mean you’re going to like it when another tribe shows up and starts sacrificing you. The point is that the Aztec Empire was aggressive and rapacious in general. They dominated the conquered tribes and extracted resources (human and otherwise) while providing little in return. Any “stability” their empire offered was outweighed by the fact that they could show up at any time for some good of fashioned raping and pillaging, even if you had already been conquered. They were very much hated, not for moral reasons but for practical ones.

        • 2 months ago
          Anonymous

          >that they could show up at any time for some good of fashioned raping and pillaging, even if you had already been conquered.
          They didn't do that though. You're making assumptions based on pop-his knowledge, not actual history. States (not tribes) that had already been conquered were left one as long as they didn't rebel, something that did happen fairly often, not because the Aztecs were not violent than anyone else but simply because of the way Mesoamerican hegemonies worked, they were always extremely hands-off, and never did much at all beyond extracting tribute.

          You, and people like you, also focus far too much on the concept of rebellious "conquered tribes" when the main allies of the spanish during the conquest of the Aztec were never tributaries at all, but a rival hegemony.

  27. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    This is somewhat unrelated but how did the Inca fell? Was it for the same reasons the Aztecs did?

  28. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    they had other native allies you know

  29. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    >outnumbered

    They weren't, the Spanish chronicles conveniently leaves out the thousands of native allies they had.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      >conveniently leaves out
      They don't, it has never been controversial whatsoever
      Go buy yourself a brain

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        Point is they would have never had a shot witthout their allies

        • 2 months ago
          Anonymous

          >had a shot witthout their allies
          LOL. Spaniards defeated the "allies" too and also the aztecs and also the incas, and also all the other native american tribes, and also the moors, the ottomans, the french-dutch-english in the war religion for 150 years with the tercios, and a long etc.

          You low quality humans don´t want to acknowledge superior genetics and that is why you keep telling to yourself "it were the allies" or the "smallpox" or any other stupidity. NO. It was the smartness and cojones of a superior breed of people.

          • 2 months ago
            Anonymous

            >You low quality humans don´t want to acknowledge superior genetics
            Stop being moronic

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      >Spanish chronicles conveniently leaves out the thousands
      Fricking moron. If they are chronicles....they tell about what it happened. If not they were not chronicles. If you know that the natives "helped" the Spaniards it is precisely because of the Spanish chronicles idiot. If not you would not have known about it.

      ANYWAYS what people don´t get it is that the natives that "helped" the Spaniards WERE in war against the Spaniards 3 times before they joined them. Also people seem to forget that if the natives were such a fundamental part in defeating the aztecs because of their "huge numbers" why those natives with "huge numbers" could not defeat the aztecs alone in the previous 200 years before the Spaniards arriving???

      It is obvious that it is the smartness and cojones of the Spanairds what did the most.

  30. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    Pathetic and illiterate replies on His once again.

    To actually answer your question, you should really read and inform yourself by usage of the best source material. Namely, Olmedo, Bernal Diaz and some Mexican descendants that contributed later in Spanish (one from the neighbouring city of Texococo as there became native people of status which learned Castillan)

    A brief explanation however is that the military technology of Cortes were far superior. Whilst the majority of the Spanish forces did not possess steel cuirass, a sizable portion did, add to the fact they were fully clothed and later supplemented their apparel with native cloth to create more defence against blows. (Any type of non artificial cloth, from wool to linen can be pretty effective against sharp material if moulded correctly); the Mexicans by an large did not wear much, the higher echelons of warrior did possess a huge variegation of clothing, some dense wool and multiple articles, the horde in general was unkempt, poor and with little but cloths covering vital parts of the body (The Mexicans of Tenochitlan were exceptionally insular and cared little for their tributaries except if they gave tribute in manpower or material wealth)

    The Spaniards also possessed the horse and a finer appreciation of the art of war. The way in which war or battle in the anahuac was undertaken was by its nature, ritualistic, brutal and prone to exercise of emotion. Cortes as well as his contemporaries were almost all trained soldiers or knew some degree of military science. They almost always would position themselves favourably, utilise formations where the superiority of the steel sword would eviscerate the thronging masses and peformed cavalry charges with precise motion. An example of this is the great battle of Otumba in which, arrayed against forces almost 20x their number, used the cavalry to assualt and maim many of the leading nobility of the Mexican forces and essentially rout them.

    Continuing>

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      Secondly, the Spaniards achieved success through none other than an exceptional mind in Hernan Cortes, in my view one of the great men of history and sorely under-appreciated considering the immensity of his aims, defeats and success.

      Cortes was, from the moment of landing instilled with almost a pre-natural ability to work out, design and put into effect the best ways to navigate this almost impossible mission.

      They were assaulted almost immediately upon embarking, having to fortify in an abandoned town, when they realised their port was a morass of all malaria and other conditions, they began the march inwards, along the coast to nowadays Vera cruz, once there, once again assailed by one of the powerful tributary kingdoms of the Mexicans, having defeated their force (to be clear, in every single engagement of the conquest they were outnumbered, significantly, even modern revisionist historians don't deny this) they performed a sweep of the surrounding towns and chevauchee. The chief of the kingdom therefore entreated upon Cortes and began the model of the conquest.

      Cortes from this point on was met with several delegates of Moctezuma, knowing of him and vice versa. Cortes was exceptionally tactful and skilled in this regard, because he both managed to disarm Moctezuma from seeing him as enemy but not embracing him as lord of his realm, therefore giving him means to manoeuvre into conquest. He managed this by both intrigue of diplomacy and (despite what modern revisionism hates) utilising the mystical power the Spaniards conjured to the common mass. For much of the early part of the conquest, the Mexicans perceived the Spaniards as more a force of nature, a supernatural foe than one of mere human malice. The combination of horses and the destructive military power, advanced weaponry and their pale skin gave them this effect (for there was much destiny given to the return of Quetzalcoatl, who under the their mythos- continued

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        (Who under their mythos, was emblazoned with pale white skin, had travelled eastwards across the Ocean and came to teach them civilisation); all this gave the Spaniards, to the comman mind, the apparition of spiritual power if not envoys themselves of their lord. This was a power Cortes did not abandon, and he used it for all its worth, for as long as it had currency.

        His march up to the anahuac (the actual plain at where the great lake was and where the true Mexicans were, the city states) was incredibly arduous. Mexico is a beautiful land with probably the greatest bio-diversity of flora in the world. It was alien, there were no real roads and they had to manage all this with bare victuals. They later survived a supposed assassination attempt at Cholula (this part is contentious as Cortes' party claim the inhabitants invite them in, then pen them in a square as they begin to muster to slaughter them, some historians have later revised this to a disagreement and that the Spaniards merely sack and massacre the city); they then continue, and at this point are no longer assured in their belief of supernatural power to dismiss enemies, so traverse Tlaxcala, the only remaining and formiddable mountain kingdom of the anahuac.

        Here they battle with foes as mastered in warfare as the Mexicans themselves, outnumbered severely and almost find demise in the repeated assaults but battle on and manage to rout them, (Cortes actually has his hand maimed in one of the battle and essentially is made lame in it for the rest of his life); whether by luck, gods will or fortune, the chiefs of Tlaxcala see the Spaniards for the allies they could be and so begins the only true allies Cortes has. The Tlaxcalans join Cortes and note only a few thousand, the whole motley crew is barely more than 8000 strong, the Spaniards being in hundreds.

        The whole episode of their entry to Tenochitlan is too impressive and elaborate to explain but Moctezuma casts an (continued)

        • 2 months ago
          Anonymous

          Casts a superbly interesting shadow. This ruler of such an empire is impressively august yet incredibly naïve, he fails to crush Cortes in his power and instead pays for it by his own imprisonment and affords the Spaniards their lives by the fact the people of Mexico, in their supernatural beliefs, cannot or will not dare have their Emperor (more god-king is we are to be crude with analogy) harmed.

          This only falters once the fetters of foreign power mock Tenochitlan with a massacre of nobles, a particular conquistador called Alvarado performs this act, different motives are given but the result is the explusion of the Spaniards by almost complete annihilation and Moctezuma crumbled by humiliation and stoning by his own people. This period is the worst for Cortes, the Noche Triste (night of sorrows), whereupon a cousin of Moctezuma claims superiority of forces and the whole populace rise to kill them.

          Streets are barred, houses set aflame to pen them into corners. The great bridges leading out of the lake metropolis raised or desecrated. The Spaniards and Cortes almost perish entirely if not for the heroics of many men, some drowning under the corpses of those they slay, others hoisted away to be sacrificed, Cortes is injured as are many others. This leads to their escape to Tlaxcala, the famous battle of Otumba as I've mentioned and the eventual re-configuration of Cortes' forces.

          I won't go further here as this all served to illustrate how and why Cortes and the Spaniards were victorious. It was not mere chance, nor is it exaggerated. The particular individuals in these events shaped them, their weaknesses and strengths boosted their fortunes and it was both the superiority of Cortes, the Spanish spirit of adventure and their superior warfare that won them the empire. All against forces almost always 10x their number.

          If you want a great and complete understanding, read Prescott's "The Conquest of Mexico" it's the best work.

          • 2 months ago
            Anonymous

            Oh and in regards to claims of disease affecting and helping the Spaniards. The claim is spurious at best.

            The introduction of measles and disease to the new world is possible began in this campaign. In one chapter, where Cortes is almost defeated by a Spanish rival, come to usurp him of his reign as the conqueror, there is supposedly a Black slave aboard one of the ship who, already ill but not a threat to the Europeans, embarks and this is one of the many stories given about the introduction of foreign disease to Mexico.

            As for the Mexicans themselves, there is no sign of great disease up until the final assault of Tenochitlan, before this all the great battles had already been fought, being outnumbered by such figures you'd think it was impossible or betrayed or set upon by ambush whilst the Spaniards subdued the other surrounding cities of the anahuac. The siege itself is described as showing signs of severe infection, piles of dead but the city still musters many more forces than the Spaniards and its native forces can (by how much is arguable, this may be the only battle of the conquest where the odds are more even than not)

          • 2 months ago
            Anonymous

            Also there were proportionally more deaths of Spaniards from tropical diseases than of native americans from European diseases.

            You named like 7 sports you moron. There's a lot more than 7 sports

            Here you have hundreds of Spanish victories in the last 20 years in ALL sports:
            https://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anexo:Triunfos_del_deporte_espa%C3%B1ol

          • 2 months ago
            Anonymous

            >Hispanic wiki
            LOL. Where is that world cup Antonio? You were beaten by nafris

          • 2 months ago
            Anonymous

            >You were beaten by nafris
            and not only in brownball mind you, nafris cucked iberians for 600 more years than spaniards had control of latin america, up to the point that purely european iberians are basically nonexistent today while there's millions of unmixed natives in latin america

          • 2 months ago
            Anonymous

            2010 zoomer moron

          • 2 months ago
            Anonymous

            >You were beaten by nafris
            and not only in brownball mind you, nafris cucked iberians for 600 more years than spaniards had control of latin america, up to the point that purely european iberians are basically nonexistent today while there's millions of unmixed natives in latin america

            There is something for sure here: you both are brown (either brown chicano or nafris). And both seethe because of your own browness and are trying to project it into us white Spaniards (yes, 80% of us are fully white by any standard).

          • 2 months ago
            Anonymous

            >yes, 80% of us are fully white by any standard
            You wish

  31. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    Let´s also remember that the natives had in their favour:
    -Obsidiana swords. that worked much better than steel swords in tropical climate.
    -Arrows. Centuries using this technology made them proper experts in this art.
    -Tropical climate. People who live in tropical regions are used to tropical climate. Spaniards were not and that is why their armours did not play a positive role but quite the contrary. They probably had to remove them during battles.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      >Arrows. Centuries using this technology made them proper experts in this art
      The Spanish had crossbows and guns though so skilled or not it's not like the Aztecs dominated ranged combat with them

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      You got everything wrong. Obsidian is just volcanic glass it's not strong like steel, it's fricking glass brittle and the statement that it could cut through a horses head clean in one swing from a fricking club is laughable it was a wife's tale for the nobility in Spain to offset the fact they just butchered stone aged barbarians.

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        Obsidian knives were used for human sacrifices so they were strong enough to cut the necks of any soldier or horse. And obsidian swords were more useful than steel sword in high humid climates.

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        Obsidian is sharp as frick and not as brittle as some people seem to think it is, it wouldn't immediately shatter upon contact with anything harder than meat or anything like that, and Macuahuitls were slashing weapons, not clubs, they were designed specifically to cut things.

        I don't see how obsidian would be magically more useful than metal in a tropical climate though, I think that guy is just making shit up based on the fact that the spaniards found the local Mesoamerican quilted armor to be more suitable for the local climate than steel.

        • 2 months ago
          Anonymous

          >more useful than metal in a tropical climate though,
          1/10th of the weight of a solid steel sword.
          In high humid climate any effort is tiresome so wearing high weight armors or swords make them less practical.

  32. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    Guns, Germs and Tlaxcallans.

  33. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    Btw, the most important battle of the conquest was Otumba, where there were only 800 native allies.
    600 spanish + 800 natives vs 10-20.000 aztec
    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Otumba

  34. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    Racial superiority.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      >had a shot witthout their allies
      LOL. Spaniards defeated the "allies" too and also the aztecs and also the incas, and also all the other native american tribes, and also the moors, the ottomans, the french-dutch-english in the war religion for 150 years with the tercios, and a long etc.

      You low quality humans don´t want to acknowledge superior genetics and that is why you keep telling to yourself "it were the allies" or the "smallpox" or any other stupidity. NO. It was the smartness and cojones of a superior breed of people.

      You will never have a real ethnostate.

  35. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    >conquistadors
    my understanding is that a big factor was that indigenous populations fought to capture and take as slaves/sacrifices while spanish just wanted to kill.. they also enlisted subjugated indigenous tribes in their fights

  36. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    By the time the conquistadors are in Tenochtitlan, the smallpox is already in the process of killing 95-99% of the population.

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      Absolutely not true. There's strong evidence pestilence is in Tenochitlan by the time the last siege begins, yes, we know from the actual Spaniards, the casualties are impossible to tell though. The Aztecs still fielded huge amounts of men to fight, likely it was ravaging the city but the 90-95% is absurd. It's also the first time its apparent. All the stupendous battles against impossible odds are before disease first erupts in Mexico.

      • 2 months ago
        Anonymous

        Well all estimates of small pox deaths are going to be questionable. But so are the size of Aztec armies.

  37. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    Because they had help from Aztec rivals.

  38. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    They had some help from the zacalteca allies that the aztecs used to kidnap and kill.
    But the real reason is that the Aztec was an evil empire, worshipping literally demons and with a culture of death, sacrifices and murder. So it was God's will that the mexican brothers got to knew Him. He overthrew that evil by the hand of the Spanish.
    All godless peoples will end like this.

  39. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    BWC

  40. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    May be the version where many locals saw them as liberators from a tyrannical overlord and just joined then

  41. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    They had a ton of help from native city-states that were rivals to the Aztec

  42. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    They were hardly outnumbered. Literally thousands of natives joined their side which was often decisive

  43. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    I always wondered if the great Aztec city is an exaggeration to make it all seem more epic than it really was

    • 2 months ago
      Anonymous

      No, it's legit extremely impressive, i'll post info later

  44. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    OP thinks the conquest of South America was some kind of battle in an RTS game instead of a long and historically complex process you can't summarize in a few IQfy posts.

  45. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    heard one of those spanish conquerors personally stabbed like a good amount of members of his army, so imagine what he'd do to the enemies

  46. 2 months ago
    Anonymous

    germs that's it. The guns and horses did not matter as much as people hype up to continue the dumb savage myth. Every fight's a victory when contact with your presence is all that needed to happen to win it even if you spent most of your campaign in the americas fleeing from combat. Luckily you can scrub out that part that no one but you and tribals know happened after plague does the job for you

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