is hell moral?

As the subject suggests, what your take on the idea of hell? Religious and irreligious answers welcome. I'm personally kinda up in the air about it as I'm not uber religious.

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  1. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    finite crimes should not be answered with infinite punishment

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      By what standard?

  2. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    Yes, absolutely. Read up on St. Aquinas' explanation.

  3. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    Ignoring all of the "if there is an all powerful god why is there evil" arguments, I dont think anyone, even the most vile piece of shit, is incapable of reforming over a timeframe of LITERALLY ETERNITY, so torturing them forever seems like nonsense. Not to mention that its really not hard to get sent to hell, being consistently rude or a prostitute or not following the right religion for a few decades on earth is all it takes for ETERNAL punishment more extreme than anything anyone on earth can imagine, and this is from a supposedly loving being.

    Imagine if your kid shouted and threw toys around for 30 seconds so you locked them in a room full of angry scorpions for 99999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999 years. This is that times INFINITY.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      Think of the greatest joy you have ever felt and realize God created it and allowed you to experience out of the goodness of his heart. Does that seem like a God who will burn you forever for being rude? If God was evil you wouldn't have been allowed to feel a single second of joy or happiness or pleasure ever in your life. Yet you are even allowed to experience sex, a pleasure so nice and satisfying it almost feel like you're taking advantage of life.

      There are different degrees of punishments and most punishments are to refine you and clear your debt. The Light of God will shine over all of us and expose all that is inside on the outside, so nothing can be hidden after that day, minds, thoughts, desires, emotions, memories, it will all be public and laid out for anyone to see. For most people their hell will be their own shame and humiliation from everyone seeing all the fricked up and shameful things they did, said and thought about others. All secrets will be revealed, all the innocent will be redeemed and all the guilty will be condemned. it will be worse because not only will your evil be naked and exposed to humans, but to holy beings who are pure. People who don't have a single blemish and have not sinned in the eternity they have lived so they have the full justification to point fingers and shame and rebuke literally anyone. And the righteous people who suffered on earth will be made holy too, and God's light will shine from them too. So they will also rebuke and give orders at will. People will try to seek darkness so they can hide their wicked hearts but darkness will no longer exist.

      The burning hell is for the worst of the wicked, those who have no redeeming quality at all.

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        That's not what it says in the book

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          Read Enoch.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            Also read Daniel.

            >And there will be wailing and gnashing of teeth and your worm dieth not

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            >Multitudes who sleep in the dust of the earth will awake: some to everlasting life, others to shame and everlasting contempt.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            >Doesn't say anything about the worst of the worst
            Anon your citations don't support your argument. D-

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          Also read Daniel.

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        Blah blah. God let's you have a tiny taste of what's good so the torture is better.

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          Your suffering is never your fault. You never deserve it, you are good and perfect and the meany God is unjust and unfair. You have nothing to change, nothing to fix, nothing to pay for, you dont need to rebuke or correction. You dont need discipline. You're already deserving of the greatest's of joys and pleasures and God refuses to give it to you because he's evil.

          Your dad never spanked you and made you a better person? It shows.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            Physical punishment has the demonstrable effect of making you a worse person. Slapping or hitting your kid just makes them into a sociopath who's better at not getting caught

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            Only undiscipline brats and victims of literal abuse believe this.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            It's been demonstrated in psychological studies, it's not an opinion

            I can tell because you're a homosexual and you admit you were slapped around by your dear old dad

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            Oh Psychologist. How could they ever be wrong.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            >Yeah science exists but not if it disproves my warped worldview
            I'll just accept your concession here and stop wasting my time trying to teach a chimp how to solve a puzzle box

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            This is something you can witness with your own eyes. It is very easy to tell when a kid has never been smacked. Everyone around that kid wished they did.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            There was a cop at my last Thanksgiving dinner. Total douche. He had two boys, absolute empty vessels. One of them kept farting on his little sister and pushing her around even after being smacked or slapped and growled at by his dad. I know for a fact that he slapped him around when he got home. I've witnessed the inefficacy of physical punishment in real time.

            You're just plain wrong. Maybe I should whip you with a belt until you stop being wrong since it's the only way apes like you learn.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            Smacking is useless if the one doing it is as twisted as the kid.
            If he's a total douche then what else will the kid learn if not doucheness?
            The first rod of discipline is example. The smacking is to correct. It is not the main tool.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            Humans go about their life, as their nature commands them to do. As all life does. There's no "fault" in this.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            Being given intelligence puts you above the rest of the animals in nature so you have no excuse to behave like the rest of the animals of nature. They are excused for being dumb, but you know right from wrong. You simply choose to do wrong.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            So what is good and evil? Give me a rational explanation for what it is.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            Good is when you do, say, think and desire things for others that you would want for yourself. Evil is when you do, say, think and desire things for others that you would not want others to do to you.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            That's a statement, not an explanation for that statement. Reason why this is what good and evil is.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            >Why is it good to do good to others?
            Lol.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            >It's good because it's called "good"
            You know that the concept of what is "good" depends on when, where and with who you speak? Besides, yeah. Why is is it good to do good? Can give a reason, outside of a tautology?

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            You're just looking for a way out of doing good to justify choosing evil. Nobody can give you a detailed and philosophical explanation of what is right and wrong therefore there must not be a right and wrong and you can justify your choice to do what is clearly wrong. But never what is right. You don't need a good reason to choose the wrong way, only the right one. You need to be thoroughly convinced to do what is right, but what is wrong you willingly choose and justify.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            Use your intelligence which as you said is necessary and derive your knowledge. Good and evil is not knowledge, unless you derive it. If you can't do it, I don't see why "good and evil" exists and I won't recognize that I'm more accountable for what I do than an animal is for what it does.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            Then dont do it. Doing good and rejecting evil will only benefit you when you stand before the One who will judge you. When you see all the goodness that all the good ones are being rewarded with, you will wish you had done good too. And then you will see the punishments of evils, and you will double down on that wish.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            You said, we can know "good and evil". Now you don't want to derive the knowledge? Apparently, we can't know it.

            > Doing good and rejecting evil will only benefit you when you stand before the One who will judge you.
            I'll get a price? This what "good" is? I see. Reason why the price exists.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            >Go tell god
            Wow, somebody really did a number on you.
            Hope you get better soon.

            Suit yourself lol. Nobody will buy that you did not understand that you had to be a good person to others and not hurt them.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            I'd buy it, if you were able to derive it and reason it. But no amount of "We define this to be good, therefore this is what good is." is ever going to convince me.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            We aren't so smart that we can ignore our nature. There is a lot to us that acts on instinct outside of our conscious perception and most decisions are mad before you become aware you've made them.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            >There is a lot to us that acts on instinct outside of our conscious perception
            That is because you were not disciplined and corrected when you started doing what was wrong. Nobody was there to straighten your path when you started to go astray. It is still not an excuse, the job is now up to you to discipline and correct yourself.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            This is beyond mere discipline this is the core of the human being I'm talking about. There is a literal animal buried under your conscienceness and it does things like make you breathe, eat, it decides who you love, blink your eyes, it decides wat you want to some extent, and it can make decisions "gut decisions" without your conscious input. It is wise but not conscious.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            If a mere dog can be trained, a human can be disciplined. Even a Lion can be tamed. It just take someone who loves you and wants the best for you to give you discipline. Parents today are taught that they must be their kids best friend, they dont discipline because they dont want their kids to hate them.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            A lion can be tamed but afterwards it's a shell of it's former self. You don't reject your nature, you embrace it and learn how to use it for good.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            Taming an animal is an act of cruelty, because you're suppressing its nature.The taming makes it weak and sick and if you release to nature, it dies.

            Give this excuse to God in your judgement and see if he buys it. lol.
            "But God my impulses told me to rape and murder those women, I would be a shell of my former self if I control my impulses, dont suppress my nature!"

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            Read the Greeks they knew what we are better than Christianity.
            You are completely disconnected from yourself so you can't even begin to imagine your own nature.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            That's just an excuse to act like a beast.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            We are beasts and pretending we are some super special creation of God above all other living things is troony-tier delusion. You can only even attempt to become something more by accepting that you are a beast.
            I'm not a Christian so I don't think humans are special just because they are "created special" and it's self evident if you'd take a moment to think about it.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            You dont have to do good because you are a special creation, you have to do it because you are smart enough to understand it. The lion does no understand the shame of their actions and the suffering they cause, but you do. So you have no excuse.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            And yet if you were stranded in the woods hungry you would kill to eat and that doesn't make you evil.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            Humans didn't know the Abrahamic notion of good and evil for hundreds of thousands of years, either. Until you guys came along about at a comparatively recent ~3000 years ago and tried to meme it into a thing. Bullshit is what I call it.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            >might makes right
            So what's the deal with "morality", anyhow?

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            It will be called justice, not might, when he avenges the victims of your evils, and when he demands an explanation to why you did not help those in need who you were in a position to help.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            If even it were true, it would be "might makes right", because as I explained I would have had good reason to doubt that "good and evil" even existed.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            Go tell God that you did not understand why giving food you had in abundance to someone that was hungry was necessary. Or why insulting and humiliating others and stealing from them was wrong. See if he buys it.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            >Go tell god
            Wow, somebody really did a number on you.
            Hope you get better soon.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            >I don't give it to others, because those people deserve to die. They make place for people who are stronger and can live on their own. I'm improving mankind and the world. You are the "evil" one, because you're feeding those who are about to die and you're prolonging their suffering.
            See, I can play this game, as well.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            Its not me you have to convince of that.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            >my imaginary friend is going to win this argument for me

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            Taming an animal is an act of cruelty, because you're suppressing its nature.The taming makes it weak and sick and if you release to nature, it dies.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            You'll never be able to control your heartbeat, even if you were beaten day in day out. Same with psychology.

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        >If God was evil you wouldn't have been allowed to feel a single second of joy or happiness or pleasure ever in your life
        You have a simplistic concept of evil. What causes more pain, making people suffer, or giving them good stuff and taking it from them?

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          Behave and you wont be grounded again.

  4. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    if you're not religious you can't make any moral statements btw

  5. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    Everyone I've met who died or had an NDE says death is a gentle and pleasant thing with infinite happiness beyond so I have zero belief in hell tbh

  6. 1 month ago
    Radiochan

    if a Sovereign God commands it it is therefore moral

  7. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    no

  8. 1 month ago
    Garrote

    My take is that hell isn't real etc.

  9. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    Fallible humans on earth are more forgiving to criminals than this so-called loving God.

  10. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    The idea of hell (punishment in afterlife if you don't do what priest tells you) is part of monotheistic control system of fanatics.
    Specifically, the stick part.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      Monotheistic religions are control systems for people: about hell, see -->

  11. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    either you believe in god as the source of morality and thus anything he consigns you to, be it heaven, hell, or nothing at all, is moral
    or you do not believe that god exists and hell does not exist
    is this another false-flag bait thread in disguise or are you having a crisis of faith?

  12. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    God is holy, he and sin cannot exist in the same place. Hell is simply the complete lack of God who has been separated from you and never knew you.

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