Is it true the Old West is the national myth of America?

Is it true the Old West is the national myth of America?

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  1. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    The American frontier was the most violent between 1848-1875. It was actually pretty tame after that.

  2. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    It definitely the national myth of the boomers.

  3. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    My little brother shot himself while we watched Destry Rides Again.

    He was just playing. Had no idea it would kill him. My dad gave us guns so we'd "internalize gun safety".
    He "internalized" it, alright.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Wow I'll be sure to le downvote your heckin dadderino

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Wow! Guns are SO dangerous. Think of the children!

        Real fricking cute.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Wow! Guns are SO dangerous. Think of the children!

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >My little brother shot himself
      aw man that sucks
      >while we watched Destry Rides Again
      great movie tho

  4. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    It's definitely mythologized. IRL it was a lot more hard work and tedium and less gunslinging.

  5. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    yes, but still the most kino period of american history, besides the 50s onward

  6. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    No the national myth of America is the War of Independence

  7. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    If you had to live during the wild west era, would you rather be an Indian or a settler?

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Settler 100%. Life as an injun didn't get good until a few tribes managed to accumulate enough capital to open the first casinos in the mid 20th century.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        based feathers
        >steal white man money
        >buy firewater

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Settler, natives would be sent to Central America or the Caribs. The tribes would be better off if they were all sent to the Caribs.

  8. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    it was until the holocult

  9. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    If Americans had any balls it would be, and it was during their ascent to being a superpower. Uplifting the heroic and the frontier man, the rifleman. Now since Amerikkka is moronic they'll want to make the mythos all about some gay shit about 1700's new england or stuff about black people -- cringe!

  10. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    It was between WW1 through to the 1960s. Today the national myth of America is WW2.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >Today the national myth of America is WW2.
      *Pukes and dies of cringe*

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Hey, I don't like it anymore than you do! But it's worth watching WW2 media in the aftermath of the war and compare it to more recent stuff. Compare the adventurousness of The Great Escape to the nearly religious reverence of Saving Private Ryan.

        National myths are stories that a regime uses to justify its current rule. That doesn't really apply to westward expansion anymore, but it does apply to "defeating fascism".

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          It's arguably the same thing depending on where in the country you live in. Out west, ie places with cowboys, the airplane plants and electronics factories that replaced the farms and ranchos are a direct example of cowboy culture ascending to something greater. Silicon Valley is, itself, proof of this.

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Silicon valley is dystopian

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      It was a myth even during its heyday. Shootouts between cowboys, outlaws, and Indians was the experience but a fraction of the people living in "the West". You were far more likely to be murdered in family feud or dispute over cattle grazing rights, but of course that doesn't sell newspapers.

      Most in "the West" made a boring living as farmers, same as most of the rest world at the time.

      >Today the national myth of America is WW2.

      You're thinking of Russia buddy.

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >You're thinking of Russia buddy.
        No, I'm thinking of every single lib who posts pictures of Normandy beach and will claim they're following in the tradition of those men. They do not post pictures of cowboys.

        What war does our current leadership venerate more than than WW2?

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          >leftists starts crying about liberalchads out of nowhere
          No one cares about WWII since the Soviet Union fell. Were in the post-neoliberal dominant order now. The Cold war was much more significant than WWII ever was in terms of cementing American power.

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >No one cares about WWII since the Soviet Union fell.
            Vladimir Putin explicitly cited de-Nazification in Germany as his justification for invading Ukraine in his Tucker interview, which he knew would be seen by a primarily English audience.

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            That's because Russians have a giant hard on for WW2 largely do to how many people died in it and Soviet propaganda
            Why do you think they call it the "Great Patriotic War"

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >some morons made up some shit to justify an invasion
            Woah.

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          Two of America's most important allies are Germany and Japan, the two former leading Axis powers. Moreover the Pacific War has been almost entirely memoryholed in the American public consciousness outside of Pearl Harbor, Iwo Jima, and the atomic bombs because the violently racist rhetoric that defined the narrative of that war is seen as a massive public embarrassment now.

          I would go further and argue that the contemporary perception of WWII vets has gradually started to become increasingly negative, hence why "you betrayed the white race gramps" and similarly-worded statements have become more common and even normalized to a degree.

          >I'm thinking of every single lib who posts pictures of Normandy beach and will claim they're following in the tradition of those men.

          If you think that's bad, you've clearly never watched Russian coverage of a Victory Day parade.

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >Two of America's most important allies are Germany and Japan, the two former leading Axis powers.
            They're colonies, not allies. Allies have their own armies, colonies have your armies.

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >homies keep seething over America's relationship with it allies
            90% of people who say shit like this are seething Euros and Russkies who want our allies to get into autistic spats with us

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            [...]
            This just a simple reality. If you are occupied by a foreign army you are not a free state.

            Japan got full sovereignty back in 1952 with the Treaty of San Francisco and German in 1990 with the Treaty on the Final Settlement with Respect to Germany and this was very explicitly laid out in the text of both agreements.

            American troops remain in those two countries because they WANT us there. It's economically beneficial in more ways than one.

  11. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    yes? op what country are you from

    did you even look at /k/ once in your entire life? there is an entire category of guns here

  12. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    [...]

    This just a simple reality. If you are occupied by a foreign army you are not a free state.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >Be small country that has hostile neighbors on it's border
      >Allow larger military to be stationed their to deter your enemies

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        I hope the American military is eventually able to catch whoever was brazen enough to bomb the Nordstream pipeline like that.

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          >Still seething over Nordstream
          Please just admit to being European
          We get we cucked your empire

  13. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Playing fallout new vegas made me view the old west in a new light and really fall in love with westerns

  14. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    It was, until the Rural Purge scrubbed it from popular consciousness and replaced it with the Civil Rights Movement

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      This. I don’t know how people can even claim this when the dominant westerns in pop culture right now are all revisionist. No zoomers have seen anything with John Wayne.

  15. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    It was, now it's not. Billy the Kid got replaced with Spiderman

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >oh no, kid from New York got replaced by fictional kid from New York!
      So, are you arguing that US myths are no longer based on reality or are you just malding because your favorite youth delinquent got shot?

      • 3 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >are you just malding because your favorite youth delinquent got shot?
        Nah he deserved to be killed. I'm not one of those Brushy Bill truthers.

        >So, are you arguing that US myths are no longer based on reality?
        Partially yes. Billy the Kid was to Boomers and the older generations what Spiderman is to Zoomers -- a young vigilante. Surely an actual historical figure is superior to a fictional one, created for children and owned by a corporation?

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          > an actual historical figure is superior to a fictional one, created for children and owned by a corporation?
          You do realize that Billy the wanna-be pirate wouldn't be as famous if it wasn't for a book written about him? For profit? By the sheriff who killed him?

          • 3 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >You do realize that Billy the wanna-be pirate wouldn't be as famous if it wasn't for a book written about him? For profit? By the sheriff who killed him?
            technically it was Walter Noble Burns' book that brought him national attention, but still, unlike Peter Parker, Henry McCarty was a real person. Moreover, Billy the Kid isn't a trademarked character. Artists can portray him as a morally good and righteous hero, others can portray him as a murderous "wanna-be-pirate" villain, and others, like Sam Peckinpah can portray him as a tragic figure. This type of interpretation is not possible with Spiderman, as he is "owned" by the Disney company and can only be morally analyzed this way through indirect parody

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          You know Boomers also liked comics as well?

        • 3 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          >created for children and owned by a corporation?
          Do you know what a dime novel is? 99% of the horse shit you believe about wild western outlaws was made up by tenderfoots out east who never set foot on the frontier.

    • 3 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >Billy the Kid got replaced with Spiderman

      As much as I'd hate to admit it, Spiderman is a vastly better role-model than Billy the Kid. One fights criminals terrorizing his community, the other WAS a criminal who terrorized his community.

      >because Wild West stories (just like Treasure Island) were written well after the era had passed
      A lot of frontier fiction in magazine and dime novels was written during the era, and fed into a meta meme where people emulated a sensationalized version of their world, similar to how bikers, mafioso and black gangstas try to act like media characters. There’s a famous incident where Kit Carson was tracking a band of Indians who had kidnapped a white woman and came across an abandoned camp where he found a dime novel depicting the heroic deeds of Kit Carson the Indian Fighter and he felt like a total fraud. By the end of his life, Congressman David Crockett was rolling his eyes at the magazine adventures of “Davy Crockett”.

      >By the end of his life, Congressman David Crockett was rolling his eyes at the magazine adventures of “Davy Crockett”.

      Crockett literally lost his seat in the House of Representatives because of his opposition to the Indian Removal Act, so I imagine he found the label "Indian fighter" to be incredibly annoying.

  16. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    About the same as Treasure Island being about real pirates.

    Did pirates (gunslingers and wild Indians in this case) exist? Yes.
    Was it like the book? No.
    Was there some points of congruence? Sure, but a book/myth is designed to tell a story, not to be historically accurate.

    A lot of this is not helped because Wild West stories (just like Treasure Island) were written well after the era had passed, and by strangers who generally wanted to entertain. The dime-store Western is the foundation of all later myths & fiction about cowboys and indians.

  17. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Also, for boomers...From the 1920s and 30's (start of movies) through the 1950's and 1960's (start of television), Wild West stories made up a HUGE amount of Hollyood production. Look at lists of movies/TV shows through those years and count how many were some kind of Wild West thing and compare it to now, where you see maybe 1 or 2 "modern" western or a re-make every couple of years. Boomers grew up playing cowboys and Indians.

  18. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >because Wild West stories (just like Treasure Island) were written well after the era had passed
    A lot of frontier fiction in magazine and dime novels was written during the era, and fed into a meta meme where people emulated a sensationalized version of their world, similar to how bikers, mafioso and black gangstas try to act like media characters. There’s a famous incident where Kit Carson was tracking a band of Indians who had kidnapped a white woman and came across an abandoned camp where he found a dime novel depicting the heroic deeds of Kit Carson the Indian Fighter and he felt like a total fraud. By the end of his life, Congressman David Crockett was rolling his eyes at the magazine adventures of “Davy Crockett”.

  19. 3 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    The interesting party about the west wasn't how crime ridden it was, it was how in the absence of any central authority everyday men kept the peace with an unstated but ever-present threat of violence. The original american stock like the idea of personal autonomy that comes with that level of authority. When the US was first settled it consumed more flintlock rifles per capita than any other european country, which still relied on pikemen. Every man needed to be a one man army to decimate the enemy, which were usually native guerillas armed with their own flintlock rifles. The "wild west" used to be the Appalachian mountains filled with mountain men and the settler spirit simply shifted further and further west.

    The idea of the man with the gun distributing almost divine justice probably comes from tribal europe, even the word Sheriff, which is highly respected, comes from tribal administrators of rural areas.

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