>age. >current book. >your thoughts on it

>age
>current book
>your thoughts on it

The Kind of Tired That Sleep Won’t Fix Shirt $21.68

Tip Your Landlord Shirt $21.68

The Kind of Tired That Sleep Won’t Fix Shirt $21.68

  1. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >34
    >The Complete Fiction of H.P. Lovecraft
    >Finally made it to The Call of Cthulhu after 400 out of 1100 pages or so, and it is awesome. Excited to get to the other known classics, and being anon I do appreciate all that old-timey racism replete in most of his stories, including, but not limited to, Black personman the cat.

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      bullshit. The story where they ram a commercial fishing boat into an elder god to defeat him? Really? That's awesome?

      • 5 months ago
        Anonymous

        Call of Cthulhu specifically, is awesome. The rest of his shorts thus far range from good to decent.

        • 5 months ago
          Anonymous

          I enjoyed at the mountains of madness far more than cthulu

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      I should have done that. I read the ones I wanted and then random short stories so I'm now fricked trying to remember if I read The Outsider and Dagon or not.

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      based. i have that right next to me and read some. I liked the dunwich horror and redhook a lot.

      https://i.imgur.com/MdFoQFm.jpg

      >age
      >current book
      >your thoughts on it

      >31
      >Gormenghast
      >really enjoying it. a slightly sarcastic gothic novel with fun characters.

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      The one that stuck with me most was the one about Antarctica (At the Mountains of Madness)

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      >34
      >Lovecraft
      What's it like being a complete manchild?

      • 5 months ago
        Anonymous

        Has its moments! Just got into full-time reading recently so I'm going through a great deal of more than obvious classics.

        • 5 months ago
          Anonymous

          >full-time reading
          the frick is that?

  2. 5 months ago
    shit thread

    19
    giles goat boy
    not bad, unremarkable, so far

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      Havent read this but Sot-weed factor is pretty kino.

      I’m 29, The Ambassadors and If on a Winter’s Night a Traveler. The former takes an incredible amount of patience, but it is well worth it, style is simply the English language meticulously perfected. The latter is okay, easy read, interesting but a little too vague.

  3. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    Mid 20s
    Alejo Carpentier - The Chase
    >Took some time to get used to the rich language.Almost gothic in its detail.Yet it paints a whole picture.
    The plot and the characters head has kept me intrigued as well, I foreshadow a collision later on.

    Annie Ernaux - Happening
    >Just started, enjoying the simple yet exact prose.Nice look at Paris at that time.Subject matter might get darker later on( abortion)

    Alternating between these two for now depending on my mental bandwidth and energy.

  4. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    30
    Divine Comedy
    Atrociously tedious christgay apologism. Poetry is almost unreadable in translation too (I know, I started it years ago before I was aware of never reading translations)

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      >28
      >Cunk on Everything: The Encyclopedia Philomena by Philomena Cunk
      It's funny
      >The Murders in the Rue Morgue by Edgar Allan Poe
      It's atmospheric. I read along with the audiobook
      >Art and Visual Perception by Rudolf Arnheim
      This doesn't quite fit this board, but there are considerations on the border between philosophy and design theory.

      Read about historical and political context in which this work was created
      https://youtube.com/shorts/UKhY2kD4jxI?si=eAA7wILJ9hz4utVE

      • 5 months ago
        Anonymous

        I‘m very familiar with the Italian late medieval and Renaissance eras. That doesn‘t make it good.

        • 5 months ago
          Anonymous

          I am talking about Dante's views on the conflict between secular and ecclesiastical power. Alighieri sides with the Emperor and the concept of the primacy of imperial power over any other. Then, secular rulers became similar to the clergy in appearance and behavior. The separation of secular and religious power is unique in history. That's why SPOILER is in the last circle of Hell. So it's not school historical knowledge, but more political and ideological knowledge.
          Probably also the fault of the translation. A lot of classics in English translation are terrible shit. For example, I have not read Dostoyevsky, Gogol and Bulgakov in the original, but comparing the translation into my language and into English, it is like heaven and earth (that's why I consider loud American fans of Russian literature grifters)

        • 5 months ago
          Anonymous

          The Commedia is deeper and denser in meaning than even something like Ulysses. You'd be missing 80% of it in Italian. In English, you'd better have a good guide to go along with it or you're just wasting your time.

          • 5 months ago
            Anonymous

            >In English, you'd better have a good guide to go along with it or you're just wasting your time.
            gonna be pretty hard to get Virgil to get along with this tbh

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      Do you find it objectionable aesthetically or just morally? Trying to discern whether you are completely moronic or just obnoxious.

      Not a single obscure book ITT. Sad.

      lol

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      The atheist is unable to enjoy good art. Many such cases!

      • 5 months ago
        Anonymous

        Christcuck cope

        • 5 months ago
          Anonymous

          Stop being illiterate

          • 5 months ago
            Anonymous

            Illiterate? What even is that response? Lmao omega christcope

          • 5 months ago
            Anonymous

            I’m sorry your parents made you go to church. I will pray for you.

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      >Poetry is almost unreadable in translation
      So read and listen to it in Italian...

      20
      The Odyssey
      I'm having fun. I want some bronze-era weaponry and armor now.

      I genuinely think this is the only way to appreciate literature. You get a lot out of generating similar things to the experiences being described.

      26
      Reading Moby Dick for the first time right now

      I just finished chapter 3 last night and met Queequeg. Loving it so far, absolutely captivated. I don't know why I thought it was going to be a difficult boring (but rewarding) book, it is so captivating and easy to read. Can't wait to keep going

      I kinda drifted off a few more chapters in. I find it very rare for a piece to keep me. That said, I listened to the entirety of The Water Margin.

      25
      Don Quixote
      funny

      It's like reading an insane IQfy greentext from the outside.

      24
      Hadji Murat
      Definitely Tolstoy’s most difficult work of fiction I’ve read so far because the language is more verbose than usual and he uses a lot of Caucasian terminologies that aren’t translated. But so far, it’s still sublime. So efficiently written and spectacular. The opening pages are beautiful especially, where he narrates how he got the idea for the novel and then segways into the story itself

      What has stuck with you from Tolstoy?

      https://i.imgur.com/HTRQzxo.jpg

      35
      Pic
      I think I bought a shit translation
      This is dreadful hippie shite

      My experience with it was already having the psychological shift, and then discovering this text that matched.
      I think it's more like "Oh shit someone else has experienced this psychology".

      • 5 months ago
        Anonymous

        There is nothing that hasn’t stuck with me. I’m deeply invested in everything about the man and his work. The sincerity of his soul is greater than most other artists that I have encountered combined.

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      23
      Stoner
      >Damn, this homie is dumb as frick

      reddit is that way son, Inferno is genuinely hilarious fanfic about hell with genuinely interesting fancanon and great worldbuilding.

      • 5 months ago
        Anonymous

        I don‘t know why I would listen to your worldbuilding critique if your read on actual mental communities is that dilute judaism is awesome because some annoying morons on another site said it wasn‘t like 15 years ago.

        • 5 months ago
          Anonymous

          you win the internet today sir! have a gold
          upbote

  5. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    32
    Serotonin by Houellebecq
    Enjoying it so far, has the usual Houellebecq feel which I am completely in love with

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      I think it's my second or third favourite of all his novels. I've read it twice. Quintessential Houellebecq.

  6. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >31
    >The Pale King
    >it's some kind of clever meta-fictional titty-pincher

  7. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    20
    The Odyssey
    I'm having fun. I want some bronze-era weaponry and armor now.

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      >I want some bronze-era weaponry and armor now.
      based

  8. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    feet

  9. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    39.
    Poesía completa (the complete poetry) of Alejandra Pizarnik.
    I'm not a poetry reader, but I can relate with the imagery created by Pizarnik. She was a poet of the night, the silent despair, the loneliness. Her work is quite minimalist but linked with surrealism and the french literature from the 60s. Pizarnik was and argentine writer, lived in Paris and killed himself at the age of 36.

  10. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    41
    Hugh Trevor-Roper “Crisis Of The Seventeenth Century”
    Comes off as an entire refutation of conflict theory in historiography, taking apart the thesis set forth by Max Weber on the origins of capitalism and proceeds to point to the causes of discontent in the early modern period to be motivated more so by political and ethnological considerations than anything remotely having to do with money or even materialism at writ large. It’s a good clear pill cleansing after Christopher Hills book.

    Ezra Pound - “Selected Poetical Works”
    Very indicative of postmodern poetics, I can see parellels to Joyce’s wordy style

    Leo Tolstoy - “What Is Art”
    Just started. Nothing jumps out at me yet

    John Locke - “Two Treatises Of Government”
    Reads more like literary criticism than political philosophy proper. Starting to understand why Wittgenstein saw philosophy as word games, the meaning of phrases wholly dependent on interpretation. Helps I read a work of hermeneutical theory before this.

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      Not being facetious, seriously asking, have you read a ton of political philosophy so that people who are widely disregarded today like Locke are still on your radar simply because you’ve read all the others? Or are these more of boomerism you’ve clung to for a long time?

      • 5 months ago
        Anonymous

        I’ve never really fit into the left honestly. Always felt alien to me. As far as “widely disregarded” it really depends on whom you ask. Likewise, I’ve never truly an affinity for people like Debord or Deleuze so the feeling is mutual. I find Freud and Schmitt illuminating and feel that a syncretic union between the two could shed light on the current sex crisis the west is facing. Likewise I also find interest in Nietzsche, Weber, am looking into checking out symbolic and interpretive anthropology like Geertz and Turner.

        • 5 months ago
          Anonymous

          >I find Freud and Schmitt illuminating and feel that a syncretic union between the two could shed light on the current sex crisis the west is facing
          huh, please explain anon

          • 5 months ago
            Anonymous

            In Civilization And Its Discontents the driver of neurosis is a state which acts as a mitigating mechanism to ensure that sexual activity does not cause the state to fall, unfortunately, these neuroses end up directing the behavior into other means, often violent to which in order for the state or community to increase its health, the sovereign government must oppress the urges of female sexuality and loosen up the sexuality of males, with all things considered that women are birthing sex to ensure birth rates rise to above replacement levels

          • 5 months ago
            Anonymous

            the subtext is that men are just naturally predisposed to violence, so letting them have unmitigated sex with respect to the properties of other men, again directed by the sovereign leader, would at least attempt to lower the chances of violent behavior by men by giving them and outlet and a purpose for life outside their own, instead of causing upheavals like civil war or revolution or mass murder.

            in short: women need less rights not more and in order for this to happen men's sexuality must stand unopposed considering that women turn their anger inwards and it would be no cost to anyone but themselves if they acted upon it. men do not, so if the sovereign allows a pressure value to release on sexuality, there is a chance physical violence on a mass scale will be reduced.

          • 5 months ago
            Anonymous

            Well, how do you explain the myriad warlike periods of history where whoring was a commonplace social institution?

          • 5 months ago
            Anonymous

            Not exactly the point I was making, it's not the act of sex itself but the institution of institutionalized reproduction that is the suggested teleology. Without the incentive to reproduce we are faced with unproductive labor. Like fine art, the penis is a paintbrush on the canvas of the womb, it must not be used to create abortive Hackson Pollock paintings but something on the level of Michaelangelo, and not only that, something of use to society. Sex for pleasure only benefits the two people engaging in the act. I'm aware that orgies exist but again, that's just something that is a fleeting experience. Procreation benefits the community and tribe.

          • 5 months ago
            Anonymous

            the subtext is that men are just naturally predisposed to violence, so letting them have unmitigated sex with respect to the properties of other men, again directed by the sovereign leader, would at least attempt to lower the chances of violent behavior by men by giving them and outlet and a purpose for life outside their own, instead of causing upheavals like civil war or revolution or mass murder.

            in short: women need less rights not more and in order for this to happen men's sexuality must stand unopposed considering that women turn their anger inwards and it would be no cost to anyone but themselves if they acted upon it. men do not, so if the sovereign allows a pressure value to release on sexuality, there is a chance physical violence on a mass scale will be reduced.

            That’s sounding eerily similar to the impact tiktok is having on people 35 and under.

            There is so much allusion to sex but actual pursuit of it is forbidden. They’re trying to reshape our natural instincts to lower birthdates to a sustainable but reduced rate for the state, and control all avenues of social interaction. Soon it will be more normal to meet a girl on tinder than to just talk to one on the sidewalk.

          • 5 months ago
            Anonymous

            I'm 41 like I said so I have no interest in chinese spyware

          • 5 months ago
            Anonymous

            I imagine that in 20 years, after we've lived through the revolution of the west, we'll all look back on this time and say
            >"How did we not see it coming?"
            This sort of thing that the west is attempting (social engineering of basic biology) isn't possible.

          • 5 months ago
            Anonymous

            >This sort of thing that the west is attempting (social engineering of basic biology) isn't possible.
            How are you so sure? We live in unprecedented times... plastic in your blood-brain barrier and all that.

          • 5 months ago
            Anonymous

            Before plastic it was lead and before lead something else

          • 5 months ago
            Anonymous

            >before lead something else
            >he doesn't know about the industrial revolution and the before time

          • 5 months ago
            Anonymous

            Were humans some unprecedented kind of “pure” before then? I understand money and capitalism have enslaved us all but that doesn’t mean everything before it was pure Elysium either

          • 5 months ago
            Anonymous

            Your argument was that changing our biology is not possible when it quite clearly is possible and has occurred many times throughout history--one of which times we're living through.

          • 5 months ago
            Anonymous

            I’m not the anon you’re replying to, I’m the one he replied to. I do believe changing our psychology is possible, our biochemistry as well. Just wait until DNA editing takes off.

          • 5 months ago
            Anonymous

            Sure, but it will never, ever be anything but bad.

          • 5 months ago
            Anonymous

            >I do believe changing our psychology is possible, our biochemistry as well.
            Lamark called it the "iinheritability of acquired traits".
            Ludovici wrote on it extensively.

          • 5 months ago
            Anonymous

            You can "change" someone by beating them with a baseball bat, but that doesn't mean that the change made is constructive or useful. These people want transhumanism so bad that they haven't realized that we don't have a pathway to changing our nature in any constructive or useful direction. Labotomizing people with pharma, castrating them with ID politics, and pumping them full of microplastics (on top of the million other ways the modern world is expirementing with its people) isn't changing human beings or our nature at a fundamental level. All of these methods are a corruption of the basic human state, not an adaptation.

          • 5 months ago
            Anonymous

            If this is what you meant then I concur. Well put.

          • 5 months ago
            Anonymous

            [...]
            That’s sounding eerily similar to the impact tiktok is having on people 35 and under.

            There is so much allusion to sex but actual pursuit of it is forbidden. They’re trying to reshape our natural instincts to lower birthdates to a sustainable but reduced rate for the state, and control all avenues of social interaction. Soon it will be more normal to meet a girl on tinder than to just talk to one on the sidewalk.

            I know it’s probably considered omega trite around here to bring up (I’m new to IQfy) but in 1984 they treated sex the same way: cold and clinical. The only difference is in our reality you get all of that but alongside the sexy titktok dancers selling nude videos on Onlyfans as a commodity. Try to talk to them, to have them and hold them for yourself, and you may as well be a hideous ogre trying to ravage them or some such nonsense. Everything is backwards. I’m all for free love and some of what the zealous would call degeneracy, but for all the accusations that our world is corrupted by sex, I’d say we have at least 2.5 generations of ultra-prudes right now

            i try to completely devote myself to whichever text i feel more inclined to read that day which makes the ideas and concepts of that text play through my head for the next few days and i try to connect these ideas with the other text/texts that im reading.

            That might work for me but only if the two books were close enough in topic, and then if they were TOO close, my brain would think “well why bother reading two things that are essentially the same at the same time”

            But I’m crazy ADD brain as well so YMMV

          • 5 months ago
            Anonymous

            I wasn't just referencing sex with my original post. The modern world is attempting to alter human beings through a variety of means. I don't believe that the world is full of sex-having people anymore. There are many studies showing that Gen Z and Millenials have way less sex than previous generations. I believe this is a reflexive response to the free-love culture as well as beauty standards for both sexes that have become absolutely impossible to achieve for many people (not to mention the social stultification of younger people caused by a laundry list of social and technological factors).
            >What people really need right now is more sex and intimate relationships, not fewer
            We also need a good war to break people out of this inhuman and decadent culture, but that opinion is controversial. What I think people need right now more than ever is
            >To fight
            >To frick
            >To love
            >And to believe in something worth doing the above for
            Basically, the end of nihilism.

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      >John Locke - “Two Treatises Of Government”
      It''s the second one that matters.

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      >four books at once
      Are you INTJ, INTP, or just ADHD?

      • 5 months ago
        Anonymous

        ENTP, Gemini Sun, Aquarius Moon, Cancer Rising, Kelto-Nordid phenotype and autistic but not a troony or a homosexual.

        • 5 months ago
          Anonymous

          >ENTP
          I knew you had to be a type similar to mine (INTJ). I'm also reading four. I don't follow nor have any deep understanding of astrology--because I'm a Christian and the Bible expressly forbids its practice, but I'm a Swiss-Jamaican hybrid who probably has adult onset ADHD, but doesn't want to become drug dependent, so reads four books at a time (frequently getting up to unconsciously pace in circles and think) instead. I like women.

          Stick around sonny, you might learn something.

          I was just joking. I'm 36 myself.

          [...]

          >oddball
          LOL nice.

  11. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >23
    >Machado de assis - papéis avulsos
    >Alienista is kino

  12. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    19
    The Name of the Rose by Umberto Eco
    Still early in the book but I'm enjoying it so far. I'm kind of moronic so I'm not picking up on a lot of the history details but I'm really loving the characters.

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      Are you writing anything down? I found my grandfather's books were all full of schizo handwritten notes, I can't really read what they say most of the time but he wrote down dates and names a lot. With the benefit of the internet you can turn this research into a very rewarding hobby

  13. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    26
    Reading Moby Dick for the first time right now

    I just finished chapter 3 last night and met Queequeg. Loving it so far, absolutely captivated. I don't know why I thought it was going to be a difficult boring (but rewarding) book, it is so captivating and easy to read. Can't wait to keep going

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      Lol wait until you’re wading through those 100 or so chapters dead in the middle concerning nothing but the logistics of whaling itself. Still worth it though, book is incredible and those chapter honestly just serve to make it a right of passage. Only real MFers can make it through these kinds of books, gay as that sounds. All of this to say, don’t pussy out!

      • 5 months ago
        Anonymous

        My good friend who turned me onto lit many years ago said the same thing. It'll be a good run

      • 5 months ago
        Anonymous

        >100 or so chapters dead in the middle concerning nothing but the logistics of whaling itself.
        Black person, that's the best part!!

  14. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    23
    Ulysses
    Have barely dented it yet. I'm excited to see what awaits. I think I'm finally ready for the challenge

  15. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    30
    Mistborn
    Seems alright, normal genre fiction.

  16. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    > 20
    > finishing Moby Dick
    Ishmael is literally me bros
    Loving it. This was one of the GOATs by the very first chapter

  17. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    35
    In between books at the moment and reading some shorter stuff like Dickens: The Two Scrooges by Edmund Wilson. Either reading The Golden Ass, Great Expectations, or Victory(Conrad) next

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      So which one should I read?

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      good taste brother

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      >Great Expectations

      So I started this, about 70 pages in. Only other Dickens I’ve read is The Pickwick Papers. I’ve heard that his later books are more bitter and depressing, but so far GE is pretty funny though the bitterness is lurking under the surface. That bootblacking incident really made Dickens a writer and traumatized him. GE touches on some social issues early on, but I think that that representation of Dickens is unfair. From what I understand he was critical of the Industrial Revolution, middle class, upper class, he was critical of many things. Of course the characters are great. They are caricature like but they have life. Dickens is up there with Shakespeare for characters from what I’ve read of each

      Dickens seems to take a lot of criticism as far as his writing skills. That is true in a sense but his books are alive, which is a high complement. They are coarse but there are genuine nuggets of gold gathered here and there. Dickens seemed like an astute observer and there have already been some pieces of wisdom, heart touching parts, and what is called the human condition.

      I’ll also probably start Victory by Conrad later

  18. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    29
    House of leaves
    I really like the base story and critical analysis of all these different concepts. The Johnny sex scenes were kinda cringe and a he was too tryhard with some of the formatting though.
    Gonna do Arthur Rex next.

  19. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    24
    Brideshead Revisited
    Pretty gay

  20. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    24
    Penguin History of Europe
    Pretty good, thus far. Although it overlooks a lot of the classical era.

  21. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    34
    Infinite Jest
    I'd been putting it off for a while (a decade at least, at first for rather shallow reasons that were entirely justified at the time) and Moby Dick was delayed in shipping, so here we are. I've laughed out loud 4 times in 17 pages, it's a delightfully picaresque shaggy dog story so far. Something about it takes me back to when the internet was a finite resource that updated twice a month and while I'd rather pound nails through my dick than devote time to it like one would a novel of worth, I may use it in the capacity and space television took from my time when I last watched it in 2007.

  22. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >40
    >My Antonia
    >Beautiful prose. Plot is somewhat threadbare, but the little vignettes throughout are lovely.

  23. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    Not a single obscure book ITT. Sad.

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      >I MUST OBSCUUUUURE!!!

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      22
      Currently reading Jude the obscure. Very comfy so far, about halfway through. Thomas Hardy writes good rural characters, a lot of authors wrote rural folks as a romantic ideal or as urbanites in a field. The naturalism still retains some of the romantic themes which makes it less dry than some other naturalist books of the era.

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      22
      Currently reading Jude the obscure. Very comfy so far, about halfway through. Thomas Hardy writes good rural characters, a lot of authors wrote rural folks as a romantic ideal or as urbanites in a field. The naturalism still retains some of the romantic themes which makes it less dry than some other naturalist books of the era.

      Hehehe

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      kys

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      lmao I actually said this going through the thread. There really are only like a couple thousand authors of literature that are known while the other 99% are utterly forgotten and ignored. I understand a bit about why it's rare to see people try reading obscure authors, like it's hard to know where to start but it's still disappointing to see just how narrow the selection of authors that actually get read and discussed compared to the total amount. Most of the books in this thread are commonly taught in classes

      • 5 months ago
        Anonymous

        That’s how most mediums are. Very few artists become fondly remembered in historical memory. It’s not easy for most people to find time to read so if they’re going to then of course they’d focus on famous authors instead of obscure random books

        • 5 months ago
          Anonymous

          yes and there is similar behavior in every other medium but the fact that most people only consume media that's popular doesn't explain why there is a common hatred towards anyone sharing stuff no one has heard of. I've been called pretentious, snob, poser, hipster, elitist many times simply for sharing stuff that's unknown. The sheer hate put on display towards anyone that mentions they like media that most people haven't heard of is often extreme and entirely uncalled for, I see it so much in forums for books, music, games or any art. Its surely a large part of why most people never hear about unknown works in the first place because whenever anyone tries to share they get met with a wave of backlash for....*checks notes*.....trying to share cool stuff so it can become better known.

          • 5 months ago
            Anonymous

            It’s the fact that you keep defining yourself as reading shit that no one else is. That’s why you get hate. I’m guessing you’re the anon from the other thread. If someone says “here are my favorite (list of books/movies/songs), they’re all obscure. I like obscure stuff”, they will get an eye roll. If you can’t figure out why, then you probably never will

          • 5 months ago
            Anonymous

            It seems pretty crazy to hate someone just because they said they read obscure books. Why would a sane person care about someone "defining" themselves as an obscure book reader. This guy reads obscure books and speculates about why he likes them more, crucify him!

          • 5 months ago
            Anonymous

            It is less about the obscurity and more the condescension. There is a lack of social grace in how you conduct yourself. It invites resentment. Constantly telling people that their taste is boring and that they should read 'obscure' authors is never going to ingratiate yourself to them. You are essentially trying to undermine the validity of their favorite books on the basis that the book is popular and therefore not worthy. You can try to argue that that is not your intent but it is the effect your words have. It is as if you walked into a classical music recital and asked someone why they're listening to Mozart instead of Assmachine 300. Your probably not going to find much conversation about Assmachine 300, and you probably shouldn't lament over how much better Assmachine 300 is in the middle of the Mozart recital

          • 5 months ago
            Anonymous

            What it comes down to is that it's pointless to hate someone for acting like they're cool for reading books no one's heard of, why would you care? the only thing a person who likes obscure books does is share them in hopes more people will read them. Past that you're just hating on someone's personal opinion about (canonical) books and projecting malice onto them where none exists. It's the same in every medium, people who really really hate anyone that claims they engage with stuff that isn't mainstream. Some people have a different opinion than you, get over it.

      • 5 months ago
        Anonymous

        Most of anything is just bad.

  24. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    27
    10 little Black folk
    liking it so far. First mystery novel I've ever read

  25. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    30?
    Seapower States
    Lambert's knowledge and understanding of history eclipses his ability to convey it coherently.

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      >Seapower States
      i have a copy of "the influence of sea power upon history 1660-1783" by a.t mahan. it seem to be a really good read if you havent checked that out yet. might be in the vein you want.

  26. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    Old.
    The Age of Titans: The Rise and Fall of the Great Hellenistic Navies.
    Boats.

  27. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    28
    Simulacra and Simulation
    The chapter on cloning was pretty prescient but otherwise wtf was this guy smoking? And this is coming off the back of having read society of the spectacle

  28. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    23
    Iron Gold
    Not as much of a snoozefest as I was expecting from what I had heard people say about it. Easily the weakest in the series but a strong setup so far for the rest of the series.

  29. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >24
    >hind's kidnap
    >heifer

  30. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    26
    The gallows pole
    It’s pretty good so far I really like the setting. Only 1/4th in though

  31. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >32
    >White Noise
    >It's good, I feel like I have read it before but I am certain I havn't.

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      >It's good, I feel like I have read it before but I am certain I havn't.
      The Heart is a Lonely Hunter did that to me.

  32. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    s

  33. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >28
    >Red and Black by Stendhal
    >Just started, looks decent so far. From the first pages I was like, "yep, the dude is gonna shaboink that French milf in the middle of the book"

  34. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    25
    Don Quixote
    funny

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      in spanish?

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      25
      Don Quixote

      Weird that someone already posted this exactly.

      I'm absolutely loving it especially since I just finished L'Morte D'Arthur which is exactly the kind of book it is parodying. I've read about a third of it in the past few days since I haven't had to go in for work much.

      • 5 months ago
        Anonymous

        It's a good book. Something about it is extremely fresh and modernist even though the style is very early as far as novels go.

  35. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    21
    The Death of The Gods
    Funny fellow

  36. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    22
    Just finished Notes From Underground
    Equal parts funny, dreary, and thought provoking

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      You found Notes from Underground funny?

      • 5 months ago
        Anonymous

        In places, in the way an incel greentext is funny. The section where he goes on a long rant about how he worked up the courage to brush shoulders with a stranger instead of moving out of the way, for example.

  37. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    24 (soon to be)
    Harrow by Joy Williams
    One of the best, strangest books published this century. The reviews had eco-fiction plastered all over them but this is if Kafka did environmentalism.

  38. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    25
    Typee
    it's good! i've been a big melville kick lately and it's definitely on par with his other major works. also, the fact he wrote this at my age makes me want to kill myself

  39. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >18
    >The Great Short Works of Herman Melville
    >I read Moby Dick last year and it became one of my favorite books. I decided to took at some of his other works before revisiting it, and it's been pretty good. I had read Bartleby the Scrivener once before, and it's still my favorite up to this point. I liked particularly liked Rich Man's Pudding/Poor Man's Crumbs, the Lightning Rod Man, wiener-a-Doodle-Doo and the Two-Temples, Which is pretty much everything up to this point, now that I think about it. The only story I haven't liked so far was the Enchanted Isles, which I didn't think was awful, just a little bit boring. I'm excited to see how Billy Budd is, I've heard good things about it, but it's towards the end.

  40. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    29
    The Green Man
    The longer I read the more I enjoy it. I liked where the main character talked with God.

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      Is this the Kingsley Amis book? I have it but haven't started yet. Liked the Anti-Death League though.

  41. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    32
    Cyclonopedia
    It good

  42. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >21
    >Holly by Stephen King
    >Only 30 pages in so far and it's a long book but I'm enjoying it. I really like Holly Gibney as a character and I'm glad she's got a long book of her own now.

  43. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    69
    Goldfinch - Donna Tard
    Enjoyable so far, but some things aren't explored enough or just passed over as a seeming plot device.

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      Shit you not, a friend of mine got the cover of that book (specifically the bird coming out of the page) tatted between her breasts. She loved it that much.

      • 5 months ago
        Anonymous

        >The Goldfinch centers on 13-year-old Theodore Decker, and the dramatic changes his life undergoes after he survives a terrorist attack at the Metropolitan Museum of Art that kills his mother and results in him coming into possession of Carel Fabritius's painting The Goldfinch
        Heard this book’s title a lot but didn’t know the premise was so strange

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      https://i.imgur.com/KDFqUFR.png

      Shit you not, a friend of mine got the cover of that book (specifically the bird coming out of the page) tatted between her breasts. She loved it that much.

      checked.
      >Reading a book by "Tard"

  44. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    30
    A Fire Upon the Deep
    Just started the thing. Looks interesting. A lot of hype around it so I feel a bit intimidated.

  45. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >32
    >Moore's Utopia
    >I just finished book one and it's a bit forgettable. Hopefully book two will be more dense.

  46. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >22
    >The Plague by Camus
    About 70% done. Seems to do well in its intention of describing the "absurdism" of being caught up in a shitty situation where you can't do much else than count the days and bodies. However, I'm already looking forward to finishing this one and picking up something a bit more interesting.

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      >The Plague by Camus
      by weird coincidence i read that a few months before covid started. i liked it a lot.

  47. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    30
    fahrenheit 451
    shit book.
    i want to slurp her feet so bad

  48. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >25
    >All This Could Be Different: Sarah Thankham Matthews
    >It was blurbed by a writer I really admire, so I picked it up from the library. Tad overwritten at times, feels like she's really trying to push political relevancy, but that's not necessarily a bad thing -- just a tricky one. About 80 pages in. Like it so far.

  49. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    19, Spring Snow - Mishima
    Very glad I picked this up before I age out of Kiyoaki. Very tender book and had me crying at one point.

  50. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >30
    >A Confederacy of Dunces
    >It's actually funny

  51. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    [...]

    >kind of wild that we have it
    Tolstoy was one of the only artists who was honest about the artistic process and readily acknowledged that art should be a public service enjoyed by the masses. Almost all other artists are coy and hide like pussies behind their prestige and secret intentions. For me this quality is what makes him the supreme artist of modern times. Total sincerity about everything, even his faults and hypocrisies. His soul demanded he create art and so he wrote a book about what art means and why he creates it, because he loves art and eagerly wants to express his soul. It's pathetic that you can't say the same about 99% of other artists.

  52. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >22
    >Stephen Hero by James Joyce
    >its actually really satifying to read a somewhat radical, unorthodox statements

  53. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >31
    >illiterate
    >wish I wasn't homeschooled

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      >illiterate
      How did you write this post then?

      • 5 months ago
        Anonymous

        dictated to my handler

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      sounds like you got more 'home' and less 'school', bro.

  54. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >21
    >Cannery row - Steinbeck
    >Amazing and incredible cozy

  55. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    40
    Gilead by Marilynne Robinson
    I've read it before many years ago but I'm rereading now because I just read Home by her which feature some of the same characters and events from a different perspective and didn't remember it that clearly. I'm struck again by the beauty of it. It's simple but subtle and a really lovely portrayal of a kind of Christianity I wish I was a part of.

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      Fellow oldgay.

  56. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    20
    Just finished The King in Yellow
    It felt quite ahead of its time. The worldbuildin was strangely developed for how briefly it referenced it. I also enjoyed the prose. Would recommend it as a good book to read in a single sitting since it's less than a hundred pages. It also influenced Lovecraft and a recent game called Signalis.

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      20
      Some plays by Euripides
      Alcestis was great, made me think about the morality of sacrifice and the value of life more than any other Greek tragedy. Plus it was translated by my favorite translator, Lattimore.
      Medea so far is surprising me with how modern it feels considering it was written in a time where feminism as we know it didn't exist.
      Also reading Romeo and Juliet for the third time.

      I've considered reading this after watching True Detective season 1.

      • 5 months ago
        Anonymous

        >considering it was written in a time where feminism as we know it didn't exist.
        Orestia goes in the opposite direction and is still good.

        • 5 months ago
          Anonymous

          Absolutely. Apollo's arguments during the trial at the Areopagus are confounding as a modern reader but I can appreciate it within the context of ancient Greek religion. It's not like Clytemnestra didn't have it coming anyway.

          • 5 months ago
            Anonymous

            I found it to be extremely deep and beautiful, you can take issue with how his use of symbol and archetype translates into our individualistic paradigm but you'll get a lot more out of ancient literature if you can really appreciate mythological thinking.

            20
            Some plays by Euripides
            Alcestis was great, made me think about the morality of sacrifice and the value of life more than any other Greek tragedy. Plus it was translated by my favorite translator, Lattimore.
            Medea so far is surprising me with how modern it feels considering it was written in a time where feminism as we know it didn't exist.
            Also reading Romeo and Juliet for the third time.

            I've considered reading this after watching True Detective season 1.

            Which other tragedies have you read? Imo they get a lot better than that but to each his own.
            Agree about Lattimore although he makes some puzzling choices at times, perhaps they're just based on textual emendations though idk.

          • 5 months ago
            Anonymous

            Yeah, I try not to apply modern standards to this stuff. It's not too useful for my enjoyment or understanding of a work. The editions at my library have supplementary essays but even then I think I miss out on some of the stuff you mention. But I do appreciate how the trial served as a reconciliation of the cthonic with the Olympian religious traditions.
            I do think that there's better tragedies than Alcestis, it's just the one that got me thinking that way the most. It got me thinking about how one's life is not worth less than another just because they have less life left to live, in the case of Admetus's father. The mechanic of dying in another's stead is thought provoking. It's unconventional ending also makes it stand out.
            I've also read the Theban plays and the Oresteia. My favorite is probably Oedipus at Colonus. I like Lattimore because there's this "fullness" in his language if that makes sense, which I especially like for the epics. I don't know enough about the Greek to comment on the fidelity of it.

          • 5 months ago
            Anonymous

            >reconciliation of the cthonic with the Olympian religious traditions
            Yeah that’s the main thing, and you also seem to understand how those correspond to feminine and masculine archetypes, so afaik you’re more or less up to speed, I was referring more to attitude than any problem of interpretation. Look into Frazer’s The Golden Bough if you want to learn a lot more on the topic.

          • 5 months ago
            Anonymous

            Thanks for the rec.

          • 5 months ago
            Anonymous

            Personally it's one of the most interesting concepts I've ever come across, and I think it gets at the core of humanity and how we've developed. There's so much stuff that connects to it.

  57. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    24
    Hadji Murat
    Definitely Tolstoy’s most difficult work of fiction I’ve read so far because the language is more verbose than usual and he uses a lot of Caucasian terminologies that aren’t translated. But so far, it’s still sublime. So efficiently written and spectacular. The opening pages are beautiful especially, where he narrates how he got the idea for the novel and then segways into the story itself

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      >Hadji Murat
      quite good imo. i liked his other stuff more but that was a good read.

      20
      Just finished The King in Yellow
      It felt quite ahead of its time. The worldbuildin was strangely developed for how briefly it referenced it. I also enjoyed the prose. Would recommend it as a good book to read in a single sitting since it's less than a hundred pages. It also influenced Lovecraft and a recent game called Signalis.

      >Just finished The King in Yellow
      good choice too. i finished that one recently and went into lovecraft. check out machen if you havent either. i read him before king in yellow and really liked the great god pan and a lot of the short stories.

      >30
      >Anna Karenina

      And I feel like I’m being filtered. I’m just about into Part 8 and I’ve been sitting here trying to understand what the point of all this is. Is it just a pretty comprehensive reflection of the times of Russian life back then, or is there something deeper?

      Loved Crime and Punishment, but this is my first Tolstoy. I’m feeling like I just don’t *get* him.

      weird. i though dusty was boring and lame while tolstoy drew me in immediately after a few pages. its about a love and families that go well and bad.

  58. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    20
    Birth of Tragedy - my first Nietzsche, im really liking it so far
    Infinite Jest - some chapters are amazing but others seem incredibly boring, probably because i haven't progressed enough yet

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      I don’t get how you can read two books, especially two lofty books like those, at the same time. What’s your juggling process? I can maybe, MAYBE, read two books simultaneously if one of them if significantly lighter, easier read

      • 5 months ago
        Anonymous

        i try to completely devote myself to whichever text i feel more inclined to read that day which makes the ideas and concepts of that text play through my head for the next few days and i try to connect these ideas with the other text/texts that im reading.

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      I started with Birth Of Tragedy

      • 5 months ago
        Anonymous

        *too

      • 5 months ago
        Anonymous

        how did you find it? i didnt expect to enjoy it as much as i am enjoying it right now

        • 5 months ago
          Anonymous

          It was decent, though On The Genealogy Of Morals is my favorite by him

      • 5 months ago
        Anonymous

        how did you find it? i didnt expect to enjoy it as much as i am enjoying it right now

        20
        Birth of Tragedy - my first Nietzsche, im really liking it so far
        Infinite Jest - some chapters are amazing but others seem incredibly boring, probably because i haven't progressed enough yet

        great idea to start with it.
        the themes and ideas in this book will follow nietzsche in quite literally every single one of his books.

  59. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >22
    >Got about 3 books on the go rn (yeah, it's called multi-tasking, us zoomers can do it)

    Main book I'm reading that has my attention is A Canticle For Leibowitz, a few chapters in but that shit is tight, yo.
    Reminds me of those 'deterrent spikes' for nuclear waste thousands of years in the future but if they made a whole book about it.

  60. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    3O
    >House of Leaves

    Interesting main premise spliced with some bullshit but it is growing on me. I was getting annoyed with the Jonny segments until I read his mother's letters in the appendix and damn it does give some context to his mental state.

    I kind of wish I had read it when it was first recommended to me at 19 but then again I doubt I would have been as critical.

  61. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    35
    Pic
    I think I bought a shit translation
    This is dreadful hippie shite

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      >dreadful hippie shit
      So is most eastern philosophy kek

  62. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >30
    >Parmenide
    >wut

  63. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >30
    >Anna Karenina

    And I feel like I’m being filtered. I’m just about into Part 8 and I’ve been sitting here trying to understand what the point of all this is. Is it just a pretty comprehensive reflection of the times of Russian life back then, or is there something deeper?

    Loved Crime and Punishment, but this is my first Tolstoy. I’m feeling like I just don’t *get* him.

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      There’s not much to get, Tolstoy is boring as all frick. And a dumb commie.

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      You are being filtered. Read Nabokov's analysis of the book. A ridiculous amount of puzzles and details are layered in it. And the ultimate message is "God is love"

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      >19
      >Mao II
      >i've nearly finished the novel but i'm unsure if i'm sold on delillo's prose style just yet. his characters and dialogue are pretty weak but there's some powerful scenes in here that illuminate the bigger picture for me and bring all of his themes together in a satisfying way.

      try to stick with him, but don't feel bad if you decide to put it down for a while.
      tolstoy had a way of capturing the minutia of our most intimate relationships. it's a level of detail that no other writer has gotten close to for me. his writing is sublime and such a joy to read, i'm certain i'll be rereading his works for decades to come.

      https://i.imgur.com/gZ96XNb.gif

      >19
      >Swann's way
      It made me have a very uncomfortable dream adaptation of a memory from my childhood last night and gave me newfound insights into that memory (if I choose to believe them). The prose is, due to the subject of the book, painfully haunting. I'm only 100 pages in and I've already gone back to reread certain sections a number of times.

      One thing I'm worried about: Since I'm so young, will I be able to fully enjoy the later volumes? Will it not be a search for lost time but moreso an exploration of things to come?

      >Since I'm so young, will I be able to fully enjoy the later volumes?
      unrelated to your question but i'm hesitant to begin reading philosophy for this exact reason.

      19
      Gravity’s Rainbow
      It’s ok but I think I like V. better

      i'd like to begin reading pynchon quite soon, hopefully in the coming months.
      many people recommend the crying of lot 49 to new readers, however i've read excerpts from mason & dixon and i really adore his style and use of language in that book.
      will i get filtered if i don't read his earlier works before reading mason & dixon?

  64. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    [...]

    Ya the thing about James is he has an amazing way of literally saying nothing with the most elaborate sentences that somehow amount to “the thing was caused by the thing which caused it to react.” Lol like bro you didnt need to say that. But at the same time, NOBODY can reach such specific little niches of feeling that he worms into. It is almost disturbing reading someone who is not only relatable but downright invasive. I think “why is his writing going here? Is he afraid of something happening? Where am I in this character’s head and why is he so paranoid over a nothing?” But when you are patient with it and you pick up the little imaginary diamond he has pressed together there for you, it is like magic. I could go on and on about him. He was basically an insane genius who played with dolls in his writing. And it is absolutely, almost disturbingly, beautiful.

  65. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    23
    The Shadow of Torturer
    very enjoing it and looking forward to read more

  66. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    27
    BNW
    Why does it remind me of hitch hikers guide to the galaxy so much

  67. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    -35
    -Das jagdliche Vermächtnis Herzog Albrechts von Bayern
    -Times were different, eh?

  68. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    31 next week
    The Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe
    Read it when I was young and liked it, it makes me happy reading it again.

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      A great book. I’ve read the Narnia series at least 4 times through.

  69. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >29
    >Before the coffee gets cold

    Coming from e-girlta this feels like it was written for teens. Not vibing with it honestly

  70. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >27
    >the capital
    it's interesting and more entertaining than I thought.
    >hegel's philosophical propaedeutic
    this really is a great intro to hegel's philosophy in general. interesting, challenging but comprehensible.
    >hobbit

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      I thought capital kinda slapped too, very polemic, seemed to be about efficiency more than equality, but still communism is super gay and dumb and based on bad economics of the time

  71. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    29
    Finished submission by houellbecq last night. Interesting concept, and I think houellbecq makes a good point. There is no "soul" in western society, and because of that we're particularly susceptible to collapse, or domination by another cultural or relgious force. We can only trade houses, vacations, and iphones back in forth for so long. There needs to be something else, and its clearly sorely lacking in the West.

    Started Fidel and Gabo (I know I know this isnt peak literature, but whatever), so far a fluffy book about the friendship between Fidel Castro and Gabriel Garcia Marquez but interesting enough to keep reading.

  72. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    34
    The Green Man
    Enjoying it so far but I shouldn't really read books from 50 years ago written in a language that's not my mother tongue

  73. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    [...]

    >familiarity with Nietzsche helps with Baudrillard quite a lot
    I have some nietzsche on my shelf, but haven’t gotten around to him yet. Guess I’m reading these out of order

    After this I was going to shift gears into something either occult or new age science. It’s a tie between the quantum and the lotus and some of the grimoires I have

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      NTA but good to know, I have some Baudrillard works

      • 5 months ago
        Anonymous

        What do you have?

        • 5 months ago
          Anonymous

          Comsumer Society and Symbolic Exchange & Death

  74. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    [...]

    >Death Comes for the Archbishop is an American classic.
    Agreed. For a relatively plotless novel it's surprisingly gripping, and Cather's landscape prose is second to none.

  75. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >25
    >The Librarian by Mikhail Elizarov
    Shite. Complete shite. Full of Quasi-nostalgy for soviet times, resentment on fell of USSR. (No fricking surprise that author went full Z supporter) Story about gangs of libraries who read specific old, shitty and boring socialist literature about workers on factories, kolkhozes that happened to give them feeling of drug like happiness, or rage, or self-confidence, or memories of life that they didn't have. And now this "librariesbook clubs" sometimes made of old lonely people, sometime out prison's low-level scum, sometime out of literally old hags from hospices - all fighting each other to death with cold weapon to get more books and find "Book of meaning". This is dull, simple written bullshit that not even interesting as metaphor for Russian society. I only started it because i knew author as bard musician with good and funny songs, he became more popular and somehow they made tv-series out of it.

  76. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >age
    33
    >current book
    Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep?
    >your thoughts on it
    I just finished it today and I absolutely loved it. It clearly went deep into my psyche as I started having extremely vivid dreams revolving around empathy. They were so convincing that I went to turn them into a novel some day.

  77. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >19
    >Swann's way
    It made me have a very uncomfortable dream adaptation of a memory from my childhood last night and gave me newfound insights into that memory (if I choose to believe them). The prose is, due to the subject of the book, painfully haunting. I'm only 100 pages in and I've already gone back to reread certain sections a number of times.

    One thing I'm worried about: Since I'm so young, will I be able to fully enjoy the later volumes? Will it not be a search for lost time but moreso an exploration of things to come?

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      Don't worry about not being able to fully enjoy something right away. If you're getting something from it now it's worth it. You can always revisit it when you're older.

  78. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    Just finished the first book of the lord of the rings trilogy. It’s good for what it is but referring to Aragorn as “strider, the ranger” repeatedly is cringe eventually and “strider” is a pretty eye rolling-worthy name to begin with. But at the time it was written this wasn’t cringey edgy cliche it was new and fresh and I tried to keep it in mind. Im 37 live under a rock never seen any of the movies or read the series before so it’s all new to me. I’ll either read the next book in the series or the copy of Mason&Dixon I got for Christmas next

  79. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    19
    Gravity’s Rainbow
    It’s ok but I think I like V. better

  80. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    31
    Ulysses
    Don't get me started because I'll just end up pissing a lot of people off. I don't care for it is the nicest thing I can say about it.

  81. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >19
    >Conversations with Goethe and Critique of Pure Reason
    >CwG mentions a lot of plays and productions I am not familiar with, but hearing about Goethe’s life through the words of Eckermann who is super likeable is interesting.
    >Critique of Pure Reason is my favorite philosophy book so far. I am about to start the Dialectic. Life changing experience to be honest.

  82. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >50's
    >The Yearling
    Other than Ma Baxter being big/fat, it's pretty much just like the movie so far. A nice break from my usual anti-semitic reading.

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      What are some of your usual antisemitic reads? Asking for a friend

      • 5 months ago
        Anonymous

        Kevin MacDonald's Trilogy
        Uncle Adolf, of course
        books on Usury (Calvin Elliot and Zippy Catholic- I damn near sold my rental property after reading Elliot)
        Henry George (although he drops the ball)
        Which Way Western Man, which led me to...
        Anthony Ludovici
        Shakespeare/De Vere (Oxfordian here, b***hes)
        Savitri Devi
        GLR
        ...
        that' a pretty good start pack.

  83. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >26
    >The Doloriad
    >most of the book is describing the fricking sky

  84. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >19
    >The Unfolding of Language by Guy Deutscher
    >guess he has to explain the basics for people who aren’t obsessed like linguistics like i am. i know what a sound change is get to the good stuff already, but i like his writing style

  85. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    25
    The Castle by Franz Kafka
    Almost finished with chapter 2. It's playing out a bit more comedic than I thought it would going in. "K" seems like he isn't fitting in that well with the townsfolk, which is no surprise for a Kafka story.

  86. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    28
    1Q84
    Pacing is slow as frick but the JK is cute.

  87. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >35
    >The Perfect Storm by Sebastian Junger
    >It's good

  88. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    Pushing 60
    Hakluyt's Voyages
    Fascinating read.

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      Do you often read travelogues? Where did Hakluyt go? Did you like any similar books?

  89. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    27
    Cioran, Fall into Time
    I feel like on the heights of despair was more methodological and just better structured overall. This one is just him complaining about man obtaining awareness and suffering as a result. It feels a bit repetitive. Hopefully it picks up later on.

  90. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    42
    documents of the Council of Trent
    we were so much more based, worthy of salvation 500 years ago

  91. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    23
    Wonderling by Mira Bartok
    After Reading many "Classics" and non fiction its a nice Change. im only at 175/460 so i cant really say tocmuch except that i really Like how she builds the world :3 The End

  92. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    30
    The master of Go by Yasunari Kawabata
    It wasn't boring but it wasn't exciting either. I guess I would have enjoyed it more if I actually knew about Go

  93. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >27
    >Paradise Lost by John Milton
    >I like it a lot more than The Divine Comedy so far, but it's got the same problem in that I'm moronic so I have to read an explanation of the books as I finish them. The prose is wonderful but I assume it's because it was natively written in English unlike older epic poems.

  94. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >34
    >Oblivion collection by DFW
    >it's excellent

  95. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    24
    Doors of Perception (Huxley)
    The single best description/depiction of the psychedelic experience in any piece of media I’ve ever seen. Not incredibly well written or anything but a super fun read if you’re in the know

  96. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >28
    >The Thirst for Annihilation
    Lemme go off

  97. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >24
    >valis
    >i think im a schizo because everything my man Dick is saying sounds exactly like the stuff i've been pondering about since i was 15

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous
      • 5 months ago
        Anonymous

        im not joking a lot of what he is saying just sounds perfectly normal to me because i had those ideas since i was a teenager, he just put it into comprehensible words

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      Dick is good at that. I read Ubik in inpatient while strung out on downers and thought he was fishing around in my head. Read The Exegesis if you want more insight into how actually insane PKD was.

      • 5 months ago
        Anonymous

        valis comes with his exegesis, i dont know if its the full thing though, he did lose me with the aline stuff though in his exegesis (in the story i dont mind it) but who knows maybe in a couple of years it will sounds reasonable to me

        • 5 months ago
          Anonymous

          Idk I'm reading the 400 pg tome detailing 2-3-74 that's called The Exegesis of Philip K Dick I never read Valis I read most of his other stories but this comes across as the most mainline of his psychotic ramblings next to doing actual lsd regularly.

  98. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >19
    >The Thirty Years War. Europe's Tragedy'
    >I'm on page 16. Although I don't care too much on the makeup of the HRE, the author does a great job on illustrating its complexity in an easy to understand manner.

  99. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >21
    >Goethe's scientific studies
    The methodological musings in the first part of the book were interesting, the actual scientific studies are not because I don't have enough knowledge of botany, zoology, etc. Feeling pretty mogged

  100. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    19
    Schopenhauer's Die Welt als Wille und Vorstellung
    Amazing so far, I got an abridged version and the third book is going down like water. After reading the greeks, the scholastics and Kant's Critique it's amazing to finally get to the point that someone stops categorizing and instead writes something concrete (Kant filtered me, took close to 4 months to finish Pure Reason)
    As an aside I'm for some reason reading Sagan's Pale Blue Dot, complete shit until now, very close to dropping, guy keeps spewing bullshit after bullshit, managed to say "church bad", "old people dumb" and "my israeli grandparents were oppressed" in the first 30 pages

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      Am I the only person who found Kant easy?

  101. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >25
    >Coinage in the Roman Economy, 300 B.C. to A.D. 700
    >Johns Hopkins University Press, Ancient society and history, 1996
    Kenneth W. Harl
    >also gunsmith cats.
    I really like learning about coinage/specie. not specifically the coins themselves (but that is interesting enough) but instead the environment they were created in. for example in the third century the crisis forced the roman government to debase the coinage from a gold and silver bimetallic standard to essentially fiat currency in the form of billions of brass coins that were worthless and the economy went to bartering.
    Silver and gold were hoarded in banks or buried and the worthless brass were discarded which means millions of these coins, bullion or brass, survive adn can be had for relatively cheaply. especially the brass. you can get a roman brass coin that is 2,000 years old for just a few dollars.

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      So you have you read the Naismith book from last year yet? Thoughts?

      • 5 months ago
        Anonymous

        no, which on is that?

        • 5 months ago
          Anonymous
          • 5 months ago
            Anonymous

            thanks for the rec, downloading now.

  102. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    21
    Mere Christianity
    It's good for what it is, but I am not really learning anything new. A non-Theist or baby Christian would get much more value out of it.

  103. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    32
    Portnoy's Complain
    Surprisingly good. There's a real creativity. I love the image of his father cooking up horrible leaves.

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      Yeah I really appreciated that one when I went back and skimmed it again. Some really nice emotional payoffs in there.

  104. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    32
    The Map and the Territory
    It's charming

  105. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    29
    just finished When gravity fails
    i like the arab scifi setting, maybe im gonna read the following books with marid audran too

  106. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >Age
    20
    >Current Book
    The third book of Gaskun's space opera: Two Phantoms
    >Thoughts
    It's surprisingly robust, albeit there are some infodumps that kinda take me out of the story at points.

  107. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    25
    The Reformation
    It's a little overzealous and wordy while being low on the actual details, but it's a subject I'm not very familiar with and am learning a lot.

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      By whom? I’m reading about the 17th century and this might be good background reading

      • 5 months ago
        Anonymous

        Reverend J. A. Babington
        Its some book my community college library was throwing away years ago. It was originally published 1901 and the author seems like a total nobody. He just wrote it to supplenent his seminary course, according to the introduction.
        Here's the isbn look up
        https://isbnsearch.org/isbn/0804611351
        Seems like amazon has copies for sale

  108. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    26
    Love is a Dog from Hell

    Been working out (Olympic lifting) and keeping good habits, but still feel like I am destined to be old, lonely and transgressive

    Is 26 too old annon?

  109. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >23
    >Dresden Files: Death Masks
    I'm enjoying it so far. I'm reading it as per the recommendation of my bf and I'm enjoying it a lot. But I suppose I'm more-so speaking on the series as a whole since I'm plowing through all the books night after night

  110. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >33
    >The Collected Letters of Gustave Flaubert
    I adore Gus and it would make a fine goal to read every word he ever wrote. It's fascinating to delve into the mind of a great writer. Flaubert is a hoot too, very stereotypically French, gushy, particular, obsessed with women; an overheated, passionate, sensuous creature that could almost be brought to tears over life's small pleasures. His letters are chock full of deep insights about the art of writing or les affres de l'Art and literature. At times he thinks like a philosopher. I appreciated learning that he was a NEET living with his mom while writing Madame Bovary.
    >At ten o'clock, when my mother came into my study to say goodnight, my nerves were so taut that I frightened her by giving a great shout of terror.
    You really get the sense why Flaubert is considered such a writer's writer. His dedication to it borders on the religious. "Without my love of form, I would have perhaps have been a great mystic." He's constantly documenting how he is on the verge of a nervous breakdown because he can't get a sentence right, and talks as though he were possessed by a demon. "I am keyed up to a high pitch-my brow is burning, sentences keep rushing into my head..."

    "But I know these masked balls of the imagination! You come away from them exhausted and depressed, having seen only falsity and spouted nonsense. Everything should be done coldly, with poise.

  111. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    29. Sons & Lovers by D H Lawrence. It's giving me a lot of nostalgia, and making me question whether or not I have been a good son to my parents.

  112. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >29
    >"Ödet och Hoppet" by Niklas Natt och Dag
    >It is good, written in a somewhat archaic language makes the medieval theme even more prominent.

  113. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    27
    George F. Kennan: An American Life
    It's been a good read. Kennan is a really fascinating and odd character. I was reading a different book that mentioned him a lot. And I needed to know more. He was very temperamental, melancholic, and smart. His writings became American policy despite all that.

  114. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >27
    >The Life of Graham Greene Volume 3

    A fantastic biography, Greene comes across as a fascinating man with some questionable morals. Some of the random throwaway details the author includes are hilarious, such as when Graham Greene called every other Graham Greene he could find in the phonebook and told them he found their novels to be morally disgusting.

  115. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    Feet

  116. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    32
    Henry Miller - Plexus
    it's pretty good, the best one from the Rosy Crucifixion Trilogy probably, the only thing I don't like too much is the length since I am a pretty slow reader

  117. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    28
    Re-reading Eco's Name of the Rose
    When I read it for the first time in my teens, I was like
    >"Whoah, so deep, so many things, so many themes, such erudition, so much passes over my head, what an abyssal glance into~"
    Now I'm like
    >"Dude is just rofling, flexing and winking at the audience non-stop. It's all one big gag."

    I no longer see them book as a serious literary doorstopper, and now it apperas more like a fat nerd having a lil' laugh with the boys - and it only seems better for it. None of the themes are very deep or complex, and I was legit dumb for not seeing their simplicity and humor.

  118. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >19
    >Mason & Dixon
    >Has some funny parts, love the prose but the plot is rather confusing. Will have to buy the physical copy to reread.

  119. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    69
    The Epic of Gilgamesh
    IDK, I have only read the introduction so far

  120. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    21
    Don Quixote
    Wanted a lighter hearted read after Blood Meridian
    Just got to the part with the Galley Slaves
    One of the most underrated aspects of the book is how profound the Don can be at times
    Like when he was holding up the acorns in the sky and started waxing about the times before Man learned lust and shame
    I think it's telling that while the Shepherds believed him to be mad, Don Quixote found Marcella, who they similarly categorize as cruel, to be an admirable soul worth following. That these are two great people rejected by their fellows for the crime of thought
    The Shepherds didn't even bother paying her speech mind, they would have gone after her after she told them the folly of loving her, if not for the Don's intervention. They are both truly free souls living their lives as much to their pleasure as the world allows, true colleagues in philosophy
    I'm starting to see why the novel transcends

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      He's not meant to just be an insane idiot commoner.
      I feel like the Spanish expresses him as both insane and unusually lucid, an idiot but unusually smart, common but noble. The language is at once cuttingly cynical and genuinely admiring.

  121. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    34, just started Book of the Long Sun. Its comfy so far, very curious to see where this thing is going

  122. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    68
    >dialectic of enlightenment
    kinda mid no cap

  123. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    22
    Brief Interviews with Hideous Men
    Pretty good. It's my first time reading Wallace and I'm planning on reading Infinite Jest after this. Am I doing the DFW's path right, IQfy?

  124. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    45
    Endured "The Fountainhead" on the advice of some folks. Rand's objectivism reads like a preachy self-help book for egomaniacs.

  125. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    22
    no longer human
    I do not enjoy it, he is such a b***h.

  126. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    25
    The Anarchy
    just finished the chapter about the bengal famine, now reading about how the East India Company is getting bailed out by the Bank of England. very interesting

  127. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >get rekt
    >ur mum
    >ur mum times two

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      Why don't you engage with the prompt sincerely instead of hiding behind bland cynicism
      Why post on a literature board if you don't want to discuss literature

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      post from 2013

  128. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >25
    >Jane Erye
    I’m only a hundred or so pages in and It’s not too bad. Gothic isn’t much my genre but Charlotte brings me in with her descriptions of Jane’s thoughts and Lowood

  129. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >21
    >Submission by Houellebecq
    I'd never read anything by him. It's very engaging especially as a European. I see it more as a tale about how Europe and Europeans are worn down and lead such pointless existences that they would rather hand over their identity and submit to whatever seems useful and gives them some perceived purpose. In that sense Islam in this book could just be replaced with some other ideology. Overall amazing stuff, though his sex scenes get way too graphic for my taste.

  130. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >30
    >LOTR Fellowship
    I've enjoyed it so far...so much description of scenery and trekking, and it's nowhere near as charismatic as the movies, but I can see why it's so popular and revolutionary for fantasy writing: Tolkien invents multiple langauges, races, myths, landscapes, weapons, and describes those mostly ineffable forces that compel us to good and evil...brava!

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      You're not even to where he starts using dialect to define the different nations and has passages in blank verse (maybe some of the elf lines and bombadil) that are subtle. Two Towers is where all the good shit and charisma is, although book 4 of 6 is a slog if I remember correctly.

  131. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >38
    >Barsoom Omnibus
    I both like and dislike it. I like the general story but it is always slow and a slog to read.

  132. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    36
    Out of the Silent Planet

    Started off a bit tedious, too many characters. But after a chapter or two it became riveting. Lewis might be one of the most well read men in history, and he enjoys incorporating into his work.

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      Holy fook I mistyped. This should be That Hideous Strength. Out of the Silent Planet is the first book of the series.

  133. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    22

    Reading Breakfast of champions by Vonnegut. Really enjoying it right now, it's funny, easy to read, and has tons of pictures. Love Vonnegut.

  134. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    This thread has made me realize this is an oldgay site now...time to move on, I guess.

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      Bye, pedo!

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      Stick around sonny, you might learn something.

  135. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >29
    >John Dies at the End
    Bought it in 2012 and just now getting to it. Kind of Reddit at times, but also makes me mildly nostalgic for /b/. Definitely not high art, but it's a decent break from re-reading a bunch of Dazai.

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      I have fond memories of visiting cracked.com everyday until it fell off a cliff because it became super woke. I’m not even a chud, that’s how bad it got in like the span of a month if my memory serves me

      • 5 months ago
        Anonymous

        Are you me? That was also my experience with Cracked, it was insane how quickly the quality declined

        • 5 months ago
          Anonymous

          I think it was sold or something. I remember drama with the writers and in the comment section and there were a few writers brought on that did nothing but post incendiary flamewar type articles that were basically racebait. I remember one woman in particular was given a spot like every day or two and she would post stuff like 5 reasons white men are evil. Looking back that was probably one of the opening bells of the culture war and identity politics. It sucks as I hate all that shit and loved spending time on cracked. It had to have been no more than a few weeks where I realized the site wasn’t for me and it was making me mad. I also have fond memories of listverse from that era

          • 5 months ago
            Anonymous

            I remember an article series there where the author installed a spy-cam in his sister's apartment living room to monitor her love life or something that was hilarious, and it has been completely scrubbed from the Internet as far as I can tell.

            The old days of cracked, something awful, ebaums world, etc really were halcyon days, strange as it is to say.

          • 5 months ago
            Anonymous

            Those were the days when actual communities, forums, real websites existed before the internet took shape into something else and social media got absorbed into a few monstrous platforms. Times were more simple and fun then. Sadly I don’t ever see those types of days coming back, at least not for a while

          • 5 months ago
            Anonymous

            Message boards are actually making a comeback

          • 5 months ago
            Anonymous

            Something awful was always a shitty site with a repugnant userbase

      • 5 months ago
        Anonymous

        I can't remember, but I think I bought the book without realizing it was the Cracked guy. I got it alongside House of Leaves because I guess I had an interest in popular horror beyond King. I don't really remember, as I spent the past couple years in high school reading Ellis, Palahniuk, Welsh, the occasional Burroughs, Haruki Murakami, and Tao Lin. So Wong and Danielewski don't exactly fit, but I guess I was still transitioning from /b/ to real boards at the time.
        In fact, I think I stopped following Cracked when I got into IQfy in 2008, so I never saw much wokeness. I'm curious about newer books by this dude because he says "moron" and "gay" and "Black person" in this book, and I'm pretty sure he dropped the Wong name because yellowface.

      • 5 months ago
        Anonymous

        Their list on MRA is what caused me to never visit them again

  136. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >26
    >Phantastes by George MacDonald
    >I'm not that far in, but I'm enjoying it. It has that mature-child sensibility that Tolkien and Lewis are able to capture so well. I had been getting tired of reading Brits from the turn of the century, but this is just different. I could see myself reading this to my kids.
    That said, I'm scouring this thread for recs.

  137. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    > 27
    > DBT Skills Training Manual, Linehan
    > I've never read anything on dialectics before this, but how it's talked about in this book reminds me of Taoism (especially yin-yang, and ji ji mu ge). The whole mindfulness thing I'm not new to, and can appreciate - it always seems a good thing when I'm reminded to be mindful, and present in the current moment/flowing with each experience. In this book it's put forth as having more practical benefit than in those typical Eastern sources I'm familiar with (Zen). The Rational Mind, Emotional Mind, Wise Mind thing reminds me of Jung’s Thinking type and Feeling type, as well as the idea of individuation. For some reason I really dislike the name Dialectical Behavioural Therapy. I also dislike the association with BPD. That's all so far, though I just started today.

  138. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >20
    >Chevengur
    enjoying it so far. feels a bit like "What is to be Done" but a lot more vivid and enthralling overall

  139. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >22
    >Ignorance by Milan Kundera
    One of the best things ever written.

  140. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    -24
    -Count of Monte Cristo
    -this book is goated, easy 10/10. Already one of my favorite books

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      I hope you're reading the non-bowdlerized version with the LSD trip anon, IIRC, that would be the Penguin Black Classics one. It's the only full unabridged English version with the stuff that the Victorians took out in the name of public decency

      • 5 months ago
        Anonymous

        Yeah already past that part bro, but in the book it says Hashish not acid. Reading in German btw, since English isn’t my mother tongue.

      • 5 months ago
        Anonymous

        That scene was my first coom when I was 12

  141. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >27
    >The Catcher in the Rye
    It's quite enjoyable. I don't understand why this book is such a big deal for Americans, it's nothing special, but I like it.

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      >I don't understand why this book is such a big deal for Americans
      In the US, the novel is usually taken up in high school, right at the point in life when the themes of loss of innocence and the angst of growing up are most poignant. So it's often babby's first literary fiction for most people, and for non-literary types, one of the few books that really sticks with them throughout their lives.

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      Catcher in the Rye is in the same catalog as The Great Gatsby and To Kill a Mockingbird
      It's a book often read in high school literature class and it just good enough and clear enough to resonate with people during a highly impressionable time in their lives
      Though if people seriously bring it up as one of the best of American Literature it'll likely invite eye rolls as that's a rather immature stance

      • 5 months ago
        Anonymous

        Gatsby really is fantastic though. It's a shame reading it in high school turns people off to it. Fitzgerald's prose is really top notch.

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      The CIA uses it to mind control people somehow. There’s been a few high profile assassinations where the killer will pull out this book and start reading after committing the deed.

  142. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >26
    >Blood Meridian
    >From a technical standpoint it's a great read, but I may also hate it because it's so completely debauched. Toughy.

  143. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    27
    The Savage Detectives
    Really enjoying it, read a review spoiling the ending, which actually made it so much more interesting. I'm breezing through it because it's not difficult or dense, too. Can't wait to start 2666 after

    • 5 months ago
      Anonymous

      you're literally me except I read 2666 first.

  144. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    31 in a few weeks.
    Blood Memederidian
    This is actually pretty fantastic. It’s like a fever dream.

  145. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    30
    book of leinster
    fricking boring

  146. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >28
    >Orlando: A Biography
    >It's perfectly fine

  147. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    17
    the temple of the golden pavilion
    loving it, this is mishima at his best from what i've read so far: after this it's sun & steel and then i'll go about beginning the sea of fertility; hopefully all by february

  148. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >33
    >This is the Faith
    Pretty interesting it is about 400 pages laying out all Catholic beliefs with supporting scripture and catechism quotes. Nice to have it all in one book. Would recommend

  149. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    21
    Flowers For Algernon
    I chose to read it once when I was around 11 or 12 for an English project, but have been wanting to reread it for years now and really take my time with it.

  150. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    32
    The Makioka Sisters
    Absolutely wonderful, one of the best books I've read thus far. Surpremely comfy and warm.

  151. 5 months ago
    Anonymous

    >20
    >Getting Off: Pornography and the end of masculinity
    >Thought I'd like it more, but rather than commenting on the real world nagative cognitive effects that pornography has on the viewer, the author completely ignores these things for the purpose of painting pornography as a woman only problem, with (white) men as the bbeg in the grand story of victimization. There are a few good points made, however. D Tier

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