https://www.theregister.com/2024/06/13/version_256_systemd/
The latest version of the systemd init system is out, with the openly confrontational tag line: "Available soon in your nearest distro, now with 42 percent less Unix philosophy." As Lennart Poettering's announcement points out, this is the first version of systemd whose version number is a nine-bit value. Version 256, as usual, brings in a broad assortment of new features, but also turns off some older features that are now considered deprecated. For instance, it won't run under cgroups version 1 unless forced.
Around since 2008, cgroups is a Linux kernel containerization mechanism originally donated by Google, as The Reg noted a decade ago. Cgroups v2 was merged in 2016 so this isn't a radical change. System V service scripts are now deprecated too, as is the SystemdOptions EFI variable. Additionally, there are some new commands and options. Some are relatively minor, such as the new systemd-vpick binary, which can automatically select the latest member of versioned directories. Before any OpenVMS admirers get excited, no, Linux does not now support versions on files or directories. Instead, this is a fresh option that uses a formalized versioning system involving: "... paths whose trailing components have the .v/ suffix, pointing to a directory. These components will then automatically look for suitable files inside the directory, do a version comparison and open the newest file found (by version)."
no one cares, nerd.
>filtered
of course
this is /misc/ saar
Hvis du ikke kan programmere er du ikke hvit så sug pikk al-Suedi.
The latest function, which The Reg FOSS desk suspects will ruffle some feathers, is a whole new command, run0, which effectively replaces the sudo command as used in Apple's macOS and in Ubuntu ever since the first release. Agent P introduced the new command in a Mastodon thread. He says that the key benefit is that run0 doesn't need setuid, a basic POSIX function, which, to quote its Linux manual page, "sets the effective user ID of the calling process." [...] Another new command is importctl, which handles importing and exporting both block-level and file-system-level disk images. And there's a new type of system service called a capsule, and "a small new service manager" called systemd-ssh-generator, which lets VMs and containers accept SSH connections so long as systemd can find the sshd binary -- even if no networking is available.
https://0pointer.net/blog/announcing-systemd-v256.html
https://git.kernel.org/pub/scm/linux/kernel/git/torvalds/linux.git/diff/Documentation/cgroup-v2.txt?id=v4.5&id2=v4.4
https://www.freedesktop.org/software/systemd/man/devel/systemd-vpick.html
https://mastodon.social/@pid_eins/112353324518585654
https://man7.org/linux/man-pages/man2/setuid.2.html
https://www.freedesktop.org/software/systemd/man/devel/systemd-ssh-generator.html
That sounds like they are streamlining a way to cuck linux.
that's the argument
>look how convenient this is 🙂
Hard Fork incoming. Lulz, you want to sudo right now? lemme run that through this blackbox for you...
Systemd is a massive clusterfrick for the same reason the US government is.
Makes it easy to hide nefarious shit.
hahahaha..
run0 is literally very good idea. It has the potential to be much more secure than sudo. I am glad sudo is being replaced.
switch to a Linux distribution that doesn't use systemd, there are several out there, i been using Slackware since 1998 and been happy with it ever since 🙂
did Slackware not succumb to the systemd plague?
nope, Patrick Volkerding refuses to use it
Slackware still uses the old school startup scripts found in /etc/rc.d it always uses
Good to know. Slackware was my first distribution. I used it for years. systemd is an offense to humanity. I wanted to check some logs for a service a co-worker had made. The only way to do it was with journalctl(?). wtf is that. That was exactly the kind of thing that made windows such garbage back in the day.
They implemented their own binary logging format because Black folk can’t just log less. They _need_ to log as much as possible.
I've followed this systemd debacle since 2015. I don't understand it so please explain in caveman terms why an init system that's so hated is present in almost every GNU/Linux based OS.
What was even wrong with the old school startup scripts for systemd to be created?
> don't understand it so please explain in caveman terms why an init system that's so hated is present in almost every GNU/Linux based OS.
Becuase it is superior. It's not perfect, and many criticisms against are valid, but it solved problems that sysvinit among others were plagued with for decades. They needed to be replaced by something, but there were no really good alternatives. The momentum of all software that started adapting to systemd finally caused a tipping point where most distros and software just made it the default service manager to support. Systemd is also one of few service managers/init systems that have strong financial backing, being supported by redhat, making it a safe choice. That's basically it.
It did not solve a single problem that wasn't already solved ages ago. Sysvinit was not the only thing that existed before. In fact anything beside slackware was already using something else long before systemdick was a thing, be it openrc, runit/s6, upstart, or whatever.
Stop with this bullshit propaganda talking point.
Even then pure sysvinit is infinitely superior to the crapware cancer that is systemd.
Mah homie!
>switch to a Linux distribution that doesn't use systemd, there are several out there
Devuan is fantastic. Been using it for about 4 years now.
yes but which one can run Kerbal Space Program tho
Pretty much every distro
Installing steam will install everything you need to run steam games on linux
Non-steam games you’ll be looking at heroic games launcher or lutris
Are you me? I've been wondering this for the past week. Tried popOS and manjaro and both of them ran KSP but the scatterer mod doesn't work on either, can't figure out why.
any with wine or if you can be arsed qemu+2nd gpu
This. I have a gpu passthrough setup with qemu using the integrated gpu on the CPU for the host. Works great.
Void is clean too
I use mx-linux because nuGentoo is trannified, but gentoo was great until then.
This but FreeBSD instead of linux
>China has developed more secure operating software for its tens of millions of computers and is already installing it on government and military systems, hoping to make Beijing’s networks impenetrable to U.S. military and intelligence agencies.
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2009/may/12/china-bolsters-for-cyber-arms-race-with-us/
>In April 2006, it was said that the Kylin operating system was largely based on FreeBSD 5.3. An anonymous Chinese student in Australia, who used the pseudonym "Dancefire", carried out a kernel similarity analysis and showed that the similarities between the two operating systems reached 99.45 percent.
https://web.archive.org/web/20060505183531/http://www.dancefire.org/article/Kernel_Similarity_Analysis.html
systemd is EEE
I remember asking someone what's an alternative to systemd and what does it do better and I'm yet to see a good answer.
sysVinit = thats short for "system 5" it worked for years on every major distro and still works today
there is a few other startup systems that run things at boot time,
runit
it's small and simple
openrc, dumb Black person.
More like you ignore all answers and cry about your precious little troonyware
Ayo wtf this is some glitch in the matrix.
I'm a dumbass who is trying to learn about operating systems and I just finished learning about init and systemd - which is (if what I learned was right) the first process that runs after kernel initialization (its basically the top-level process from which all other processes derive).
Damn thats crazy bro wtf
> init and systemd - which is (if what I learned was right) the first process that runs after kernel initialization (its basically the top-level process from which all other processes derive).
Init is just an initialization system, as described by the name. Systemd is supposed to be the Linux version of a total boot system that wraps all the hardware as well.
I honestly couldn't even begin to describe how much of a fricking cancer it is.
I've argued with people @ google about it (used to have IRC access b/c I was an outside dev at another large company) and was proven right time and again.
It's just fricking cancer and "Lennert" is NOT writing it-- he is being paid by the CIA to act as a front for their cancer and systemd is being written largely in secret by Red Hat along with CIA and NSA goons, Lennert is passed the code and he "pushes the update", each one invariably making the system less secure and introducing new backdoors and issues.
Frick Linus and Frick Lennert.
Is there a way to install a previous version?
You can use versions of linux without systemd, but the main ones that are ez2use™ like ubuntu and linux mint only have their new versions shipping with systemd.
If you DON'T use those, basically nothing will fricking work, and using other distros is very hard™ for normal people.
trips of truth
The [it just werkz] distros to set up as daily drivers use it, but there are still options out there. My AV machine runs mxLinux and it's been exceedingly stable, zero issues recording multiple-hour long sessions.
The irony is that the "just werkz" distros stopped being able to work around 2014. Even their installers are fundamentally borked with unironic race conditions during partitioning in ubuntu for example, and even if you get these systems installed you find crap like the apt GUI having been broken for basically a decade now.
>The irony is that the "just werkz" distros stopped being able to work around 2014.
you know what, its all about UEFI
Linux "just works" if you disable UEFI in BIOS and use Legacy only, and then you install Linux onto MBR style disk scheme (SATA SSD)
Unfortunately MBR does not function as a boot media when you use PCI bus connected drives so you cannot boot from PCI without using UEFI
Most modern computers since 2014 actually have NVME SSD drive because its real fast and if you do, you must boot from PCI which means using UEFI because MBR wont work
(MBR is mature tech it was invented in 1989 while BIOS is even older than that)
>ubuntu and linux mint only have their new versions shipping with systemd.
What's the most recent version without systemd?
Check devuan
broken trash, cant even use gnome
No one uses gnome because it sucks
everyone uses gnome except gayyymers because it just works
might be why every distro comes with it
the fact that they cant even get gnome to work on their distro isnt a good sign for the rest of the project
I don't know anybody that uses gnome. When I have been cursed to use ubuntu/systemd for ROS, about the first change is a move to xfce.
I have one of the librem linux phones. the absolute worst part about it is the gnome / wayland / systemd software stack. I'll be the first to admit it can look slick, but it laggy and slow. X on a 486 with 8mb was snappy. What the frick people. I don't understand in 2024 how this entire stack can be so bad - but the answer is probably shit engineering.
ROS is the same cancer as systemd. It's just not systemd's poor engineering, it's the smugness of the adherents I can do without.
>ROS is the same cancer as systemd.
I'm not going to argue that point. Rviz is just useful enough for me to keep using that stack. The trick seems to be to keep virtually all of your code independent from ROS.
I don't know anyone who uses gnome except those stuck with work devices with gnome preinstalled. Even then they constantly b***h about it.
Never got devuan to work even once.
Use mxlinux.
I'd also like to know
Looks like a VERY long time ago.
Added in April 2015 (v15.04)
Upstart option removed in Yaketty (16.10)
Any thoughts on nvidia jetson linux? Nvidia has been pretty awesome in terms of windows software support and I assume their custom linux version is also high quality, but I am not familiar enough with linux to know if there's some red flag. I know it's a huge question to ask but if you have some sense of it, it would help.
https://docs.nvidia.com/jetson/archives/r36.3/DeveloperGuide/index.html
https://mxlinux.org/
https://nxos.org/
These are my recommendations if you want to use linux and don't want systemd.
Honestly this is beyond most people in the first place.
>nxos
>~~*appimage*~~
yes.
tho since you are new it easier to learn gentoo (burger made)
what are military protocols?
what is nsa?
its all so tiresome.
I love debian though ... how do you expect me to give up an OS I love and am comfortable with just because it uses systemd?
Because Linux isn't about comfort.
It's about interoperability and transparency between you and the devs.
You can check if it works the way the devs say it does by reading the source.
The source code and the configuration preferences are also designed to be user-extensible and mutable through needing to use the least amount of resources possible. Configuration is done by editing strings in text files in the fricking file directory.
The system library is supposed to be easily accessible to you as the programmer, and if you use languages like C or C++, your entire OS is designed with your workflow in mind.
Systemd breaks that whole paradigm and introduces fricktons of inconveniences where they didn't need to be, for the benefit of large private corporations and against you the user. That's why it's bad.
well do a fork of debian without systemd then and I'll consider switching
I'm with you on the autistic urges to actually build the software yourself from the ground up. too bad I have mouths to feed (my own). but that's why I code in C anyhow
So this just means systemd linux distros are going to become worthless to anyone who isn't a control freak.
Anyone who actually cares what their computer does is going to search for sudo forks.
And why exactly are you "right" other than a backwards demand for complete system compartmentalization? There are instances where this is useful, but why even use an O/S at that point when it pulls so much from hardware. If you make your O/S impossible to write programs for nobody will develop programs for it, making it useless. Google certainly isn't above criticism but systemd is much bigger than google and allows better access by non-google companies to use linux, which google now has 90% marketshare through andriod. systemd will reduce google dependency.
It's also not written in secret. You can download the source code and I have because, in my job, I actually can't use systemd or any unix systems made after it's introduction because it messes with our 'frame's boot process.
That's quite a claim. Hard to (dis)prove, but I'm willing to believe it for now.
germans attend shcools of evil to screw up world on daily basis,systemd is made by germans, particular german fron face behind this is working for microsoft now, bill gates is 1/3 german
do not use german products for they are imbued with malice and pure evil
Cool story, erev rav mixed israeli trash
How hard is it to get BSD running on a laptop these days?
depends on the laptop and how badly var fricks up the oems. openbsd has a list of what works
Thanks anon.
Depends which BSD. FreeBSD is troonware, netbsd is very buggy, openbsd is slow, has little hardware support, and is stupidly insecure (least secure OS currently in active use by far). None of them have a properly working linux compat layer, they all have a different linux compat solution though. FreeBSD has the best overall software compat while netbsd has the best overall hardware compat.
It's really easy, if the laptop is commonish. I installed OpenBSD on an old laptop just the other day. Whichever BSD you choose to install, read the official docs and follow them. It's easy.
Thanks anon, I'll look into it. I used to run BSD but when I switched to using laptops years ago it seemed unpossible. Linux is starting to get on my nerves.
Yeah...Linux chads...I'm not going to keep up with you and neither is industry let alone normies. Yet me saying so here invites all sorts of verbal abuse for not giving you all my moral support for something no longer feasible.
>I'm not going to keep up with you
you've got that backwards
systemd is an example of changes that someone would need to keep up with
now they're changing sudo, did I read
like they dropped ifconfig
hopefully there remains a sufficiently large group of people who enjoy simple functional systems to keep that ticking over nice and cozy
>be moron
>hired to run computer being used keeping the lights on
>"hey boss I can't do anything on this computer!"
>boss asks if I'm a midwit
>just run sudo!
>lol boss, you wanna try?
>"WTF ANON DID YOU HACK IT!?"
>no boss it's the linux updates, you guys are windows now, you didn't update last month did you?
sudo can't be disabled by systemd, the only way sudo would stop working is if distros remove it. systemd is proposing an alternative and suggesting that distros do that, but they cannot force this change.
and even if your distro follows through with this, nothing prevents you from reinstalling it yourself. The setuid functionality is built into the kernel and the kernel doesn't break backwards compatibility.
Systemd has since its inception been a political ploy. Distros WILL change because the few leaders who said no stepped down around the systemd debate. All distros have been working in lockstep to adopt all systemd crappery ever since.
it's just like i always say
what servers need more of
is ways to elevate privilege
the future looks bright
No its gay to post linux shit like an autist and not be engaging or facilitate an exchange. Isn't there an actual board for gay af clued out clowns like Lassi anon from Smelsinki?
Sooo what’s the controversy here ?
griping about systemd
it's an aesthetic thing
you either like it or you're an unjabbed heterosexual
one or the other
the controversy is: poetteringware/red hat/microsoft/linux found has been turning linux into windows for at least 17 years now and most maintainers are dumb enough to follow suit
That sucks. So tired of microsoft forcing these new windows versions where half the stuff is broken on release. The photos app on windows 10 was missing basic features present in windows 7 picture viewer, even up to the point where windows 11 was released. This coercion shouldn't be allowed, the EU has the right idea putting a stop to a lot of this stuff.
general argument is that systemd has now grown too big to be audited by the end user, and that it ''does everything for you'' as in taking on more and more responsibility for services under its scope. It's the Windows-ification of Linux.
Systemd is dogshit, and Poettering is taunting people who hate his philosophy.
Had systemd bugs bring down a system of mine twice so I had to disable some of its components.
Of course the bug hasn't been fixed yet. What a pile of dogshit.
Building from source.
Will it give me an EXE?
continue OP
please do go on
(not sarcasm)
politically and technically speaking,
what are our options?
Time to leave arch
I was going to soon anyways
I didn't read the thread cause I already knew systemd is bad
so then Alpine??
If you don't use BSD, you're gay. Linux has been comped for a while.
If you had installed gentoo like we told you to, you wouldn't have this problem.
Both of these are correct.
I just checked my gentoo and there is a systemd-utils installed, although I use openrc
Open RC chads rise up!
Dat boi looking like nerdy fignon fr
Fignon is cooler tho
Did the fiorotgay go full frog and realize he was gay?
Maybe just a little. Super Costanza was a cute frog stud and I'm tired of pretending otherwise. Tommy Mommy will have to be put on the back burner for now
i fricking knew it. francophiles get the rope
>go full frog
yes he surrendered
alpine is safe
I'm simply going to use the systemd and wayland.
Some kinda poetry when the lord of the rats and the rat lord meet.
>wayland
This fricking shit became default in debian 12 which I had to upgrade to yesterday (long story) and it broke teamviewer and anydesk for me (yes I'm moronic again long story).
No option to default to x11. You just choose on login and it's a mystery if that's going to be the default or not. Probably not. With my luck. I would have appreciated being asked rather than having a tiny little option added to the login screen and frick you that's all you get.
Every day I use my computer I get one step closer to hunkering down and learning to code and spending the rest of my life having autistic arguments about programming conventions in mailing lists.
Well I hope you did manage to restore x11 in the end, did you anon?
Yes I did, thanks for asking. Currently rechecking all my seeding LINUX DISTRO ISOS and haven't yet restarted my xmr miner, but I'll do that sunday when the checking finishes.
I wish I had the time and patience to just get good with CLI but for now I'm stuck fighting GUIs and trying to keep multiple qbittorrent instances from crashing.
i've been meaning to migrate back over to slackware for a while anyway. all the more popular distros have been unstable piles of shit for years now, i use them out of sheer laziness and need to stop.
Threadly reminder that the last major backdoor (XZ exploit) would only work on a systemd environment, same with the other recent ones that made into the news.
systemd is a huge blackbox that makes vital parts of your system to work in a "standard way", this makes malware development for linux much more viable, that's their end game.
Make glowies seethe by using of systemd-free projects to increase their demand.
Reminder that you're brown and your opinion is worthless. The xz backdoor only worked on deb/rpm distros, not systemd in general.
Wrong board homosexual
The fact that anyone who criticises systemd or asks about alternatives gets attacked & raped confirms all I needed.
Good point.
I’d just like to interject for a moment. What you’re referring to as Linux, is in fact, systemd/Linux, or as I’ve recently taken to calling it, systemd plus Linux. Linux is not an operating system unto itself, but rather another free component of a fully functioning systemd system made useful by the systemd corelibs, shell utilities, glibc and vital system components comprising a full OS as defined by POSIX.
Many computer users run a modified distro of Fedora Linux every day, without realizing it. Through a peculiar turn of events, the version of systemd which is widely used today is often called “Linux”, and many of its users are not aware that it is basically the systemd system, developed by Red Hat.
There really is a Linux, and these people are using it, but it is just a part of the system they use. Linux is the kernel: the program in the system that allocates the machine’s resources to the other programs that you run. The kernel is an essential part of an operating system, but useless by itself; it can only function in the context of a complete operating system. Linux is normally used in combination with systemd: the whole system is basically systemd with Linux added, or systemd/Linux. All the so-called “Linux” distributions are reskinned rehashes of Red Hat's offerings.
frick this guy and frick wayland.
if you lived in a first world country you could buy tech that wasnt made in 2008 and then youd be able to run wayland without issue
>run wayland without issue
Things that have never happened for 500
i can run wayland without issue but it's also without functionality compared to X11 which will still be maintained for decades as there's industrial and medical software built on Motif and junk like that that people actually need. I don't mind anyone calling my systems 'legacy'.
Isn't gnome just a gui? You can probably modify it how you want it to be
> You can probably modify it how you want it to be
Hahahahahahaha
You have to download a bunch of extensions to give you basic functionality like tray icons, and all the extensions break when gnome updates. The devs are a bunch of wiener suckers too. It's shit.
the only good thing about the devs is they manage gtk for free and gtk is awesome because you can make GUIs coding natively in C and it's actually easy and straightfoward
royal tier bait; chef's kiss
Wrong board
>bullshit
>bullshit
>bullshit
amazing, so many words and nothing real said
frickass kde cultists i swear
>devolving into desktop arguing
noobs lurking this thread: use cinnamon or xfce or gnome, just get some time in using the system. It does not matter that much especially when trialing a distro, many of them have multiple DE options for a reason
can tell IQfyentoomen have arrived, don't derail it into 404
NOT my problem.
>h-heh! gotcha!
That’s what I thought, pussy b***h. Go get your frickin shinebox
use BSD you homosexual
>bsd user talking about touching women
>A stop job is running (10min 42s / 48 hour 149999999 minutes NANs)
just learn the new shit
initd needs to go away
supporting both sucks
you can't learn it
by the time you learn it the whole thing has changed again, that's the whole point is to sell ibm support contracts
Its more than that. It is the wrong model. Most machines have a very simple configuration, particularly now since VMs became a thing. Just run the few services you need. Edit a small number (maybe 6) number of configuration files, and thats it. There is no need for a 1.4 million line pile of steaming shit that actively makes changes behind your back.
Those config files are each 500,000 lines long and not annotated well requiring an expert to figure out, and don't even try talking between config files or using outside directories to manage important system functions as a lot of gaming peripherals do. In a system crash the stalled program cannot be compartmentalized and, because config files were edited, the system stays fricked until the user reinstalls. This wasn't a problem when the O/S was manually reloaded into memory every time a program was changed but nowadays it causes the softlocks that turns people away because windows doesn't do this.
Vice versa, having one big neatly organized warehouse full of readable well documented code can be easily used by anyone that needs to copy the warehouse's contents into a separate file that they can use for their program. So in the event of program failure, the entire system doesn't crash and the user can quickly recover it without needing to get VMs and hardware management involved. Ultimately this is the more stable, more usable system that has everything organized neatly and doesn't shit itself.
It is certainly a carryover from windows as system32 does many of the same functions which is why it's a meme to delete it. In normal -unix systems, deleting any random config file causes system32 levels of destruction. With systemd it can be compartmentalized.
All I know is I had my first ever Thinkpad, an X40, set up so nicely with TLP and everything, and unloading drivers (which *usually* shut down the associated hardware) that I could rock a fricking 16 hour battery life. In those days Linux also supported per-thread priority on the CPU for interactive processes (this was later removed) so it felt fast as frick even though it was a weaker computer. Then when Debian moved to systemd all my custom jazz stopped working and it got slower feeling and had a shittier battery life too.
And nowadays, you can still do that with systemd but faster and integrated into the battery drivers themselves so it can just do it automatically. Which is the point of systemd, you would be able to use non-lenovo batteries without trouble as you could reliably write programs to preform all power management functions from them. Or use alternative power setups like power tool batteries, UPSes, etc. All of this is made better with systemd.
Also, there is no "slower feeling". You can run tests right now to determine if that is true or not. For most people, there is no meaningful difference. For people where there IS a difference, it's because they use a zillion different gaming devices, printers, or network devices that use non-systemd references forcing systemd to convert it first. But in that case, you'd just use an OS like OpenBSD that is completely incompatible with systemd and always will be.
Which is why these threads are so shit, if you hate systemd so much use an O/S that literally cannot handle it and is 100% Unix Philosophy Certified Fresh. And takes 3+ hours to configure. Tons of servers still run SunOS and it is still a popular Oracle product.
>And nowadays, you can still do that with systemd but faster and integrated into the battery drivers themselves so it can just do it automatically.
I already did everything automatically. I had auto-mounting for certain devices (by serial no less), I had ntp, the real ntp, I knew what my user directory was, etc.
Yes, but not the average person or third party battery manufacturer. Using your case as an example; a consequence of systemd, the user is freed from having to use a specific battery brand. This is already so for UPSes and will eventually be so for audio devices and non-keyboard controllers like streamer decks that windows handles better because all of it is managed by a single file.
It does. 1 file vs 20 that each distro author changes for stupid, often selfish and shortsighted personal reasons. Pottering is no saint either but putting everything into one location is just a simpler, better philosophy than having everything spread around. And since Unix Philosophy is just fricking stupid unless you're running an embedded system or a server, this is the better path for all non-embedded applications.
Though, with IoT becoming a thing embedded distros will eventually have their own systemd or adopt systemd too because it's too useful. The main thing holding IoT back now is a lack of standardized inputs and references inside OSes, when systemd or similar does this IoT devices will become much more usable and not susceptible to vendor lock-in or vendor determined death when they kill software support.
>Those config files are each 500,000 lines long
bullshit. an exports file would have a single line per share. cat -n of /etc/sshd_config is 116 english language lines - and there is a man page for it.
This stuff is simple. The layers of complexity are being built into the obtuse and unneeded layers above it.
It isn't simple to a company that is making a product to use that file, and that file is different across the top 5 main linux distros. The company then doesn't make a linux port in the first place because nobody wants to look through 5 different man pages and write 5 different versions of the same program.
systemd fixes this. And if you don't like it, why are you using a shit, user-hating OS like linux in the first place? BSD is older and better in every respect because it doesn't do any of this. BSD also has far better hardware control so you can actually stop telemetry from individual programs or monitor it in real time. It also uses the same config files across all distributions, unlike linux which is why systemd exists in the first place. Which is why BSD is the foundation for most servers.
>systemd fixes this
no it doesn't
More servers run on linux. Stop spreading FUD.
I may eventually move to a BSD. Rn as long as Pat V. keeps on keeping on, I'm pretty happy with his judgements. Where computing is going to go as things move to one trillion transistors per package by the end of the decade, I don't know. Linux has made a reasonable abstraction for hardware that scales up to 100's of cores. We are getting more than that per cpu package right now. System D is hot garbage, but the entire technology stack it is ostensibly built to serve may be disappearing soon enough; being out competed by hardware evolution.
I'll admit that systemd could be completely killed by google/microsoft forcing everything into the cloud and forcing everyone onto a timeshared mainframe. Zero point to systemd if there is only one software manufacturer that has complete control over all devices, as AT&T did. This is at least possible.
BSD is the better OS, by the way. You don't need libreoffice to write or email a document. And with zoomers being morons that do everything through texting and facebook messanger, a small IRC-like program built to talk to the PSTN would serve most use cases. Dunno how you'd play video though but moving images is not part of the unix philosophy anyway, unless it's on a VHS tape which is the era in which pre-systemd utils were created in.
BSD still can't do what tlp did but it's better in the sense that you're back in control. And they accept patches, it's possible to support more things if people bother figuring it out or even porting stuff.
Computing should directly serve the people. That's what the PC revolution was about; pulling control of computing away from IT departments and mainframes and putting into the hands of the dirty plebs.
But the empire has struck back; now you pay thousands for devices that are spyware and you can't even fully control. Systems that should be about as Liberal and open as can be made are locked down by DRM. The corporatization of Linux is that same rot expanded into a new domain.
Maybe it is just time for something newer and better.
The government is about to step in and break up microsoft and google, presuming it doesn't happen naturally.
Older and better. If we just give up "the modern web" and "AAA modern gayming" we can literally just use the mountains of older computers, or even new computers, to do everything we did 30 years ago, which is functionally identical to what we do now but maybe not in HD.
IQfy used to run on the oldest computers that could access the web until https was required for some reason, then it could still run on most older computers until it needed captcha and then cloudflare. A chan could easily be made to run on older computers by simply getting rid of https and using a simpler html-style post captcha. I think the Japanese chans still allow you to post over plain http with no JS needed at all.
And then the entire site can be filled with hurtcore cp as 1chan was until ham549 instituted a google capatcha. His mod tool was a cellphone he bought and people would have to text him with the post number so he could login and delete it. This is the Unix Philosophy and it fails completely when put under stress. Unix Philosophy assumes trust in the user, which is completely wrong and not how the modern web works. The regular www at least.
But technology marches on. A billion transistors is a smallish chip today. I guess I have guiltily had a sip of the kool-aide. Modern tech is mind-blowing and it isn't slowing down. Don't believe for a minute that moore's law is dead - it just slowed for a little for new packaging tech to get invented.
I just think it is critical that the new systems and software that gets created should serve us. Otherwise, that's pretty dystopian.
>forcing everyone onto a timeshared mainframe
That was the Soviet model. Thin clients (serfs/plebes) connected to a fat central system (Politburo/govt/bureaucracy/nannies/wardens).
It's also the model that completely fricked them because their gay systems were never able to adapt.
There is a need for it - it's so you don't know what's going on, and if you audit it, the whole thing has already substantially changed by the time you're done.
It's a giant con on the computing world.
You can know what's going on by going into the file and looking at the code yourself. It's easier now because it's 1 file instead of 200+ that were made by different people in different times for different reasons. It reflects how personal computing software is actually used, not how someone wants it to be used. It also hasn't substantially changed, which is the entire point of consolidating all these redundant programs into 1 file. If you can't keep up with pointer changes or can't write programs to handle it, why are you using an OS with a GUI in the first place? If your programs are so hard coded to require very specific program addresses then you're not writing consumer software that the average person will buy. You're writing software that can't exist outside of a limited, fragile ecosystem.
I write such software to the point where my references are all to specific memory addresses because the hardware is only allowed to load programs a certain way allowing for maximum user control. This is shit, it takes hours to configure properly, and nobody normal does this. The average user is a moron that will buy an apple phone that just works if their email client can't find their emails because they didn't add in the right settings.
>The average user is a moron that will buy an apple phone that just works if their email client can't find their emails because they didn't add in the right settings.
your argument seems to boil down to ''we should cater to morons because that's the majority of people out there using computers'' -- not the majority using linux, but ''cell phones in every hand, Chromebooks handed out like candy, we must simplify everything for them!''
pass
Yes we should because they're already 90% of linux users via andriod. Might as well go where the market is, especially when doing systemd prevents google from writing google OS and forcing it down everyones' throats as apple did. The perfect should not be the enemy of the good.
If you need something more advanced use a real OS that isn't undercut by it's communist shareware license. BSD is the core of most servers for a reason.
>Yes we should because they're already 90% of linux users via andriod.
I meant ''people consciously choosing to use linux on their PC over windows/a mac'' and you know it Black person, frick off with your cell phone horseshit
neckbeards created Linux for themselves and made something so awesome it has been co-opted by the fortune 500. Whatever these companies are creating for their own interests aren't needed by the people that created or could create the system today. Linux and other OSS is ours, not theirs. The generations of people that have worked on developing it did so for their own benefit and those that would walk in their footsteps; not for google or Redhat.
Unix was made by AT&T, the telephone monopoly. It was never coopted. It was always evil. Unix is not TempleOS and if any of you had bothered to listen to Terry's criticism of Linux, Unix, and the Unix Philosophy you wouldn't be whining about systemd you'd be running some god awful variant of templeOS.
I know the history of Unix; It absolutely was co-opted. That was Linux itself. The BSDs were there first, but Linux got popular and introduced a generation to the ideas behind unix and implemented in Linux. (errr. GNU/Linux)
If only templeos had networking, a gui and some guides.
If terry just wasnt a homosexual that died and instead made youtube videos on how to us his shit more.
>You can know what's going on by going into the file and looking at the code yourself.
What file, what code? A unit file? I mean the whole thing uses (now) multiple databases and formats depending on the various functions. Linux is already losing mindshare even on Orange Reddit. Alpine is the most popular distro these days. No systemd. BSD mailing list activity across the family has tripled in 5 years.
Nobody "has" to keep up with a moving target which doesn't even define its true goal (replacing every bit of Linux) other than people wage slaving for some faceless megacorp.
I mean those people working on linux they are in a way noble (minus the deranged trannies but some of them are ok).
I just dont like your scene, i personally think all this crap is for deranged autists and i do not want to be a part of that.
Alpine isn't the most popular linux distro, even just for PCs everyone uses Ubuntu/Mint because there's no extensive configuration or messing around with man pages getting users lost and having them reinstall windows.
>Nobody "has" to keep up with a moving target which doesn't even define its true goal (replacing every bit of Linux) other than people wage slaving for some faceless megacorp.
I agree but everyone who uses non-systemd systems has to spend more time just getting their system and programs running than those without. This is the only thing that matters. Computers are speed calculating machines, calculators that require hours of extensive setup and specialized programming are inferior to ones that don't.
>Alpine isn't the most popular linux distro
It is. It's the most downloaded and most deployed Linux. Has been for a couple years. Mainly because of containers and vms, it's a favorite for both.
>everyone who uses non-systemd systems has to spend more time just getting their system and programs running than those without. This is the only thing that matters
Those people belong on Macs or PCs.
>Using your case as an example; a consequence of systemd, the user is freed from having to use a specific battery brand.
This was never the case with sysv-init, are you an AI yourself?
>since Unix Philosophy is just fricking stupid
Nah it's perfect, Unix is a text processing environment made for group computing. Always was. And since text is the interface between the brain and knowledge, it should always be focused on that. Unix is about having small little tools you can put together to do what you want. Each tool should be relatively simple, easy to use, but by connecting them you can accomplish whatever you like, and in a flexible way. You don't need to master every tool to start to see the benefit of the environment.
>Always was.
Since V6, to prevent autism.
>Nah it's perfect, Unix is a text processing environment made for group computing
There is no reason a Unix workstation can't have a gui too. There is nothing wrong with a little evolution.
GUIs have their uses for sure, drawing a pepe from the command line is a pain. But renaming 100,000 files with a GUI could take a year.
You're looking at like, browser aggregates. I'm talking about Amazon instances and etc.
>Those people want an OS they can control. systemd does that.
No it doesn't because you will never figure it all out again before it's, again, substantially changed.
Look at it this way. Systemd's source code, with all the bells and whistles, is bigger than the OpenBSD kernel, userland, compiler suite, and X + 4 window managers.
>I'm talking about Amazon instances and etc.
raw instance count is less important than actual utilization as, by utilization, z/os wins. z/os is also extremely simple to use and is a better application of the unix philosophy anyway. It also doesn't have any graphics support besides ascii text.
>raw instance count is less important than actual utilization as
That could be argued either way, let's ask how many cycles are executed in each? Containers and VMs in cloud providers do more cycles.
I could get by with ascii even memes, I have software which makes ascii and ANSI graphics from images and even plays movies that way.
>But technology marches on.
Oh I'm not arguing against better, smaller, faster devices. But there's no reason to exclude older devices just for the sake of the slop that is the modern web either. Both can coexist. Here I am typing on my Thinkpad T520, which is extremely weak and old by anybody's standards on the modern web, but it still does just fine, and if I need more resources I can kick off a job on my wife's fancy Apple M2 machine.
For reference, a Raspberry Pi has 8x the RAM and is 100,000 times more powerful in terms of MIPS than the IBM RISC system that ran my whole University back in the '90s and served 10,000 simultaneous users.
>It is. It's the most downloaded and most deployed Linux. Has been for a couple years. Mainly because of containers and vms, it's a favorite for both.
not sure where you're getting this info but it's not any mainstream, normal linux site pic rel. The other 39% is BSD. I don't even dislike alpine, but it's not popular because it's not nearly as easy to use as ubuntu/mint.
>Those people belong on Macs or PCs.
Those people want an OS they can control. systemd does that. You might now like how it does that, but it works well for the job it sets out to do: a stable, consistent place for programs to interface with the OS.
>Those people want an OS they can control. systemd does that.
just another "few millions" line of code of pure bloatware
alpine is popular because of docker and that's about it.
i'm not very computer literate, but i've been running linux since 2015 or so, ubuntu and mint distros mostly. i've read some of the replies in this thread explaining things, but i don't think i'm grasping the privacy implications. could someone point me to an article or essay that can help me understand?
>Benereal diseases
All benereal diseases are greated on gombuter ::DDD
>It's an android knockoff.
Gnome existed before Android. Android is based on Linux/NetBSD.
Gnome2 was great, gnome3+ is the problem. Gnome3 was released in 2011. Android in 2008.
Can someone explain to me the difference between rolling release and stable?
Frequency of updates. Stable will go a lot longer between updates than rolling.
rolling release: typically update overnight as windows does unless you disable it, which is fine
stable: mostly for servers, stable releases go 24-36 months between updates depending on the nature of the update. No big changes between updates either so programs don't get messed up
rolling release means updates are released as they come. Stable means a fixed and presumably tested stream. Fixed updates are the thing that compares to rolling, not 'stable' which is more like a class that compares to 'testing', 'unstable', 'experimental', etc.
Does fedora use systemd?
Yes, but if you don't mind systemd it's a solid distro. I've been using Void myself for years, which uses runit, not systemd, but I have positive experiences with Fedora and have considered switching to it.
I’ve been using it and I like it, is why I asked
All the big mainstream distros use systemd now. If your distro didn't use it you would probably know it. Some other systemd free options include Slackware, Gentoo (though it can be used optionally if you really want), Devuan, Artix and GNU Guix System.
only debian derived (gommunist) FOSS distros use systemd
I would never trust a motherfricker that looks like Harry Potter and Ron Weasley at the same time.
I don't see any good reasons against this. Unix Philosophy in of itself is not useful and this allows for better modularity so third party software vendors ie normal businesses can write programs for linux. This needed to happen 40 years ago.
>Unix Philosophy in of itself is not useful
It is, you just don't understand what it's for.
Here, watch this short video. It'll explain why Unix and its philosophy of small tools you can connect up with each other, is an evolution of the old knowledge augmentation goal which was formulated during WWII and expressed in the paper entitled As We May Think. Bear in mind that the video you are watching predates the Lisp machine, Unix, and other modern idioms. Lisp and Unix might be very different but they both attack the same general problem of human computer interaction through text, the language of knowledge, and processing it and its knowledge.
Bear in mind, this is almost 60 years ago and it's actually more advanced in many ways than what we're currently doing.
My distro doesn't use systemd.
Is this any different than the systemd that has been in most production systems for the last 10+ years?
it has grown even bigger, dunno if this otherwise worse than previous
As long as they fixed the bugs... it can't really be too worrisome the userland applications take 10000x more than it does. Whats annoying were the bugs.. there was some funny stuff I had to deal with. But I do like that fact that it serves a useful purpose other than just starting a program and forgetting about it.
imagine using a worse os when there are HARDWARE LEVEL BACKDOORS LMAO
my family told me about the nsa backdoor in like 06 rofl
i can see using linux for servers but your dumb as frick if you think linux spys any less than windows
if you dont want to be spied on use windows offline as in rip the wifi card out
or dont use internet connected electronics
All I know is knoppix is neat.
ultimately redhat are the only ones bringing any meaningful progress
Just play amongst yourself.
I liked opensuse until i found out it occasionally deletes files that were just saved on my nas. No solution and nobody at red hat cares.
I'm off to apple, linux will always remain a promise.
You mean ~~*progress*~~.
>Computers are speed calculating machines, calculators that require hours of extensive setup and specialized programming are inferior to ones that don't.
That is an argument against systemd, moron. Sane systems work out of the box. Systemd is the cause of literally 3/4 of the fricking issues in our issue tracker. It is a huge time wasting pile of shit.
>I don't understand it so please explain in caveman terms why an init system that's so hated is present in almost every GNU/Linux based OS.
Because almost all the big linux distros have been run by the NSA for 20+ years now. Any commercial linux distro is NSA backed. Linux has not been for users since the days of slackware and yggdrasil.
what a fricking homosexual
I'll just stick with windows. I mean I'm not a pedo or anything so I don't give a frick if they spy on me
Not political Wrong board
I could not care less about troony-subverted linux that has gone from 5% market share of personal computers to less than 2% since it came out with the troony-loving code of conduct that chased out all actual talent around that third-world piece of shit OS. And no, Linux is not the leader in ANYTHING chip-for-chip. “Most websites hosted” only means the vast majority of websites are hosted on a few shared hosts while the VAST MAJORITY of actual servers are all windows based. The more you learn, the more you know, homosexual. You pay for your OS or you are the product.
go back to india
This isn’t about desktop linux, which is indeed a pile of crap. It’s good to have alternatives but it didn’t work out at all here. Nobody wants to spend hours fixing their wifi every couple of months.
Android is Linux. All big-ass server systems in companies, science and the like run Linux. I don’t have a Linux machine anymore but interface with Linux servers daily. So yes, this is relevant and perhaps political.
android doesnt use systemd or init.d
Google has been taken over by pajeets. What keeps some pajeet manager at Google away from advocating for moving to systemd?
Most of modern linux (systemd, wayland, flatpak, dbus, desktop portals, gtk3+) is a bad imitation of android features made by people who are selected by red hat for politically loyalty over competence. All of those projects are a dumpster fire that don't have the security, reliability, features or ease of use of the android feature they're modeled on despite being developed as individual projects over the the same stretch of time that google delivered an entire operating system in.
>why an init system that's so hated is present in almost every GNU/Linux based OS.
Red Hat. Systemd was never supposed to be just an init system/service manager. It's designed to replace other software like your dns resolver, ntp manager, encryption tool, bootloader etc. to ensure that (1) Red Hat has a single homogenized target they can sell support packages for and (2) give NSA a single homogenized target for exploits since they can't get them into the kernel.
Ok but why are other Linux OSs using it? Debian, Arch, etc, none related to Red Hat. Could just have kept the old init systems and leave Red Hat's stuff alone.
Do you really not know the old drama? Those distros are full of red hat employees. Debian in particular notoriously had a bug report filed for having an "outdated" init system (sysv) which was then "resolved" by adopting systemd. This led to a massive fork called devuan.
Knew about Devuan before it was officially released, but didn't know those other projects were infiltrated with RH people, really smells like three letter agency shenanigans. What do you use?
Artix.
The Unix philosophy is outdated chud, modern software philosophy is all about bloatmaxxing
cgroupsv1 is not used anymore in anything by default, not in Docker/containerd, not in podman and not in kubernetes. Using cgroupsv1 and cgroupsv2 at the same time breaks the whole purpose of cgroups.
NEVER USE A SOFTWARE CREATED IN NATO COUNTRIES!!
>xz backdoor
gotta look out these days
Why is this on /misc/, use Artix, the dev is against trannies too
>with 42 percent less Unix philosophy.
Sounds like they reverted all their troony code. Based.
unix was made by white men
systemd is made by chinks and indians working for ibm
Windows was too.
There is no way a binary this large isn't riddled with vulnerabilities
>binary
Building systemd https://systemd-dhcpap-notes.readthedocs.io/en/latest/building.html
God i hate systemd and that homosexual so much it's unreal
I hate homosexuals who hate systemd.
"Unix philosophy" is total bunk, UNIX Haters Handbook for the win.
>100% bloated init system that metastates into everything is a actually good thing
kys moron
Why does OP suck so many black wieners dripping AIDS and syphilis every three minutes? Is it because he's homeless or is it because he's a homeless Marxist homosexual? If you killed him explain how much better society would be both generally and specifically for his mother. Does he know that he's a fricking homosexual or is he just moronic?
systemd is garbage
New to Linux, double digit IQ moron here. I'm currently running Linux Mint on an old, second computer and will fully make the switch once the new version comes out.
How does not using systemd make it easier for me to use my computer? Also, why do distros which don't use systemd look like shit? One particular distro, I think it's either antix or mx linux, is run by leftists if I remember correctly.
systemd won't be an issue for a normie, this is more of a philosophical (and security) issue. If you're normie/moron/goy just stick to Mint with systemd.
If you're a normie/moron/goy with a knack for experimenting or want to learn how to use a distro without systemd, install Virtual Box on your Mint machine and learn about the other distros in that safe space. Artix, Void and Devuan are the most convenient. Gentoo will give you total freedom and you'll learn a lot but it's inconvenient.
You can also try BSD.
Pic unrelated and only to catch attention.
Thank you very much, anons. I will look more into it as time goes by.
Antix is the communist distro.
Systemd makes your system more crash-prone. If you have disruptions like DNS going down, it will frantically ping scroogle and others behind your back, for example. If something breaks and you want to see the logs, you'll be far worse served with the binary trash logs used by systemd. You will also have a harder time writing services and debugging them. Additionally you will often come into bugs like services refusing to go up or down (with no logs). Systemd also routinely has issues causing it to use 100% CPU for no reason. That's just a few things that a regular end-user may care about. The problems with security and auditability are for more advanced users.
I remember there being a great upheaval about this some years ago. How come these centralizing idiots have so much to say in this? And isn't a viable solution to present a distro with and without a SystemD?
>And isn't a viable solution to present a distro with and without a SystemD?
There are already several distros without SystemD. The issue is that almost every mainstream linux distribution eventually went with SystemD. If everyone eventually starts using systemd than init freedom is dead because every program for linux will require systemd as a dependency.
Understood.
>If everyone eventually starts using systemd than init freedom is dead because every program for linux will require systemd as a dependency.
This sounds like it's building towards a break in the Linux community.
This is political. Quit shitting up my district saaaarrrr
>new version of systemd affects all linux
Nope.
>CPU temps: 666.6ºF
is FreeBSD a good alternative?
so if I have systemd am I actively getting spied on or is it just a 'security concern'
>am i actively being spied on
which of your ports are open?
That's literally not how networking works. You don't need any open port for a program on your device to exfiltrate data, only for the opposite connection to ping a listener which is not needed in this scenario.
>that's literally not how networking works...
i didn't bother to read the rest of what you wrote.
if someone can't tell me which of their ports are open, but they're worried about spying, that's a problem.
please, stick your foot farther in your mouth, though.
i could use a good laugh.
>only
>ping
>listener
Go be tech illiterate somewhere else thanks
or, you could explain to me how data could be exfiltrated from a system without using a port.
that should be good.
network taps aren't exfiltration.
i guess you could use a physical camera and take a picture of a screen.
given that the dominant paradigm for networking is the tcp/ip model, please explain your moronation.
>actually, er, um... i don't know what i'm talking about
>i just wanted to sound cool on the interwebs
>or, you could explain to me how data could be exfiltrated from a system without using a port.
That's easy, unless you want to be pedantic. Modern software has crazy build systems. Scripts download packages, dynamically setup python environments and patch things on the fly. We are a long way from easily inspect-able and auditable makefiles. Your build environment can easily read a mess of files from home, upload that somewhere, and just hide among the other build related network traffic. When the build is done, you delete the temporary files and no evidence remains.
I also worry about trojaned software that dynamically updates. Ostensibly somebody is auditing what you run as root, but xz got caught almost by luck.
Basically I think the dominant threat model has shifted silently from open ports and services being hacked to trojans. Can you explain all the packets going in and out over your network? Most modern software is written assuming that fat data pipe is always there so there is lots of clutter to hide among.
>That's easy, unless you want to be pedantic.
i am extremely detail oriented when it comes to computers.
>Modern software has crazy build systems.
irrelevant
>Scripts download packages
through a port...
>dynamically setup python environments and patch things on the fly.
irrelevant
>We are a long way from easily inspect-able and auditable makefiles.
irrelevant
>our build environment can easily read a mess of files from home, upload that somewhere,
through a port
>and just hide among the other build related network traffic.
network traffic going through ports...
>When the build is done, you delete the temporary files and no evidence remains.
except your network logs...
>I also worry about trojaned software that dynamically updates.
through a port
>Ostensibly somebody is auditing what you run as root, but xz got caught almost by luck.
so, basically, you have no idea how computers work and just want to be a frickstick.
please, keep talking, though. it really is funny to see you keep mentioning potential ways that programs can use ports to exfiltrate data.
>I MEANT THAT THE PORT DOESN'T HAVE TO STAY OPEN
see how i steelmanned your argument?
i wish you would have done that when i explained that someone worried about spying should probably know how to check which ports are open...
Your rigid thinking is coming from old threat models of the primary threat being hacked services. Your entire system could be shimmed as a VM and what the OS sees is a lie.
Do you have some sort of adaptive/learning software running as root looking for suspicious network traffic from user space?
>Your rigid thinking is coming from old threat models of the primary threat being hacked services.
i am a practitioner.
>Your entire system could be shimmed as a VM and what the OS sees is a lie.
kay
>Do you have some sort of adaptive/learning software running as root looking for suspicious network traffic from user space?
"next generation firewalls" is the word you're looking for, and they're becoming more affordable every day.
you're not going to be able to catch every bad thing, anon.
but, you CAN log everything using a network tap and wireshark, so that you can sift through the wreckage.
also, suricata can catch a lot of weird things and its foss, so that's nice.
The only thing you practice is gay sex. You are the most illiterate zoomer I've seen in years and there is no such thing as a tech literate zoomer.
>er, um... "bind"
>"listener"
dumbass.
you don't need to bind anything or use a listener to use a port and send datagrams.
you use a listener to catch them.
you can use a listener for a bind shell, which is probably what you're confusing because you're moronic.
Well done on demonstrating you don't even comprehend concepts that are below 101-level. I hope for your sake your age is still in the single digits, in which case frick off. Otherwise, your clinical moronation is sadly terminal.
no more (you)s for you.
it's pretty obvious to everyone that you don't know what you're talking about
which is why you've resorted to adhom
frick off and go learn
I accept your surrender. Take your meds, tell your special needs nurse to wipe the drool off your face, and don't let the door slap you on the head again since there's not much left in there to protect your basic vital functions.
>but, you CAN log everything using a network tap and wireshark, so that you can sift through the wreckage.
That's not good enough. No way no how. The systems that we rely on every day need to have an absolute guarantee of security, and I'll be the first to say we aren't there. I've watched the IT department give joke explanations for an institution hack and showed them why it can't be what they say. It doesn't matter. The form has been filed. Their job is done, and the data is gone.
You are a practitioner? Up your game.
>absolute guarantee of security
impossible.
>up your game
every day
>impossible.
An ideology of failure right there.
>An ideology of failure right there.
no, it literally is impossible.
in order to design any computing system, you have to make assumptions.
so, what happens when those design assumptions are violated?
i've been using physics-based side-channel attacks for years at work to break things people have been telling me were "safe".
it's not a "failure mindset" to accept that you can't think of everything.
The only physics-based side-channel attacks you've ever used are the excrement you managed to drop on your face while trying to take a shit.
To say its impossible is to stop pushing the limits. Its also implicitly making failure somehow acceptable.
there's a difference between inevitable and acceptable.
you can put measures in place, train your guys, have the best playbooks in the world, but at the end of the day it is impossible to stop with enough resources--like nation states.
best you can do is make it too annoying for everyone else to bother using defense in depth strategies.
anyway, gotta go.
never stop learning.
You are a moronic schizo who couldn't tell the difference between a bit and a byte without looking it up
Only the listener has to bind a socket, stupid tech illiterate ameriBlack person. It's not fricking rocket science.
>Only the listener has to bind a socket, stupid tech illiterate ameriBlack person. It's not fricking rocket science.
you've just confused several things, so... i think i'm done picking on you.
go learn more.
Even toddlers are more tech literate than you.
I despise that german SJW Black person loving homosexual.
hey guise if the spooks dont knock it off(impossible) why dont we all just start using the operating system of the People's Liberation Army?
forgot pic
>released during gay month
>doesn't use systemdless linux
freebsd or openbsd?
net >= dragonfly > free > open
OpenBSD and DragonflyBSD are the only two that serve any purpose. NetBSD is broken garbage and FreeBSD is constantly trying to out-loonix loonix.
netbsd has the purpose of working on just about any hardware. It's also very fast and light. It is a buggy mess and the people who work on it are hostile to anyone trying to help improve the situation.
OpenBSD serves no purpose whatsoever, though, it's the least secure OS around. Even toy shit like serenity or templeos is more serious on that front. Meanwhile it's also slow as frick and supports next to no hardware, always super slow to support anything new.
>It is a buggy mess and the people who work on it are hostile to anyone trying to help improve the situation.
this always amuses me
>netbsd has the purpose of working on just about any hardware
And it doesn't, which is why it serves no purpose. Try actually installing it on any of the less common platforms, literally none of them work because the developers don't use the hardware they just use a buggy emulator.
>OpenBSD serves no purpose whatsoever, though, it's the least secure OS around.
Please stop being a moronic aidsBlack person. OpenBSD is objectively the least buggy and most functional BSD.
>Meanwhile it's also slow as frick and supports next to no hardware, always super slow to support anything new.
That wasn't even true when loonix homosexuals were trying to meme it in 2001, dumbass.
Found the RCMP agent
>the RCMP made our OS broken not us!111
kek
>please use the slowest, most broken, least hardware-friendly OS good goy. You're "secure" for using an OS with 0 security measures goy
>don't mind that everytime a security intern takes a glance over the weekend 50 year old privilege escalation and remote execution bugs are discovered by the dozen goy
>it's slow so it must be safe! Good good goy
use the slowest, most broken, least hardware-friendly OS good goy
No, I said not to use NetBSD. Pay attention moron.
>You're "secure" for using an OS with 0 security measures goy
Again, I said not to use NetBSD.
>>don't mind that everytime a security intern takes a glance over the weekend 50 year old privilege escalation and remote execution bugs are discovered by the dozen goy
You sound pretty bitter the way you keep projecting all these NetBSD problems onto OpenBSD. Surely you can link to these constant 50 year security holes interns keep finding, right? Has there ever been a single security flaw found in OpenBSD that didn't also affect NetBSD?
>>it's slow so it must be safe!
Where's your benchmarks? What is it "slow" at?
>new version of systemd affects all linux
Is this why John Titor had to come back to find an older UNIX OS un-pozzed by globohomo?
not my problem. my distro uses runit. frick lamefart and his homosexual software. pulseaudio sucks wiener too.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GendBuntu
>new version of systemd affects all linux
No that cant happen since all the cool kids use linux and they're smarter n shit.
also
Cant play games without been a nerd
Black person