Why does he have the reputation of being virtuous 'n shiet when he was basically a serial backstabber?
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Why does he have the reputation of being virtuous 'n shiet when he was basically a serial backstabber?
Why does he have the reputation of being virtuous 'n shiet when he was basically a serial backstabber?
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Ape Out Shirt $21.68 |
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Firstly the main primary source of the 3 Kingdoms Period was made by Chen Shou, a Jin Dynasty scholar who was born in what used to be Shu territory, so you can guess what he thought about its founder.
Secondly Luo Guanzhong (Romance of the Three Kingdoms Author) b***hed and moaned about living through the Post-Yuan Dynasty chaos where rebel armies backstabbed each other after felling the Mongol Rulers. He pined for virtuous & loyal Confucian-friendly heroes like muh Liu Bei who cared more about the people than politics
Did Liu Bei actually punt his infant son or was that an invention in ROTK?
It was in the Romance. In the Records, what happened was Liu Bei was not told to wait for Zhao Yun as he might have gotten killed/defected to Cao Cao during the Battle of Changban. To this Liu Bei angrily threw his precious sword to the ground and said "I don't believe Zilong will abandon me."
As to why the baby throwing, author Luo Guanzhong was a fricking dramatic Opera playwright by profession, rarely a novel writer. So everyone is exage as frick in his version of the 3K.
>To this Liu Bei angrily threw his precious sword to the ground and said "I don't believe Zilong will abandon me."
No. He threw a hand ax at someone who claimed Zhao Yun had gone north to surrender while screaming that Zhao Yun would never abandon him.
>As to why the baby throwing, author Luo Guanzhong was a fricking dramatic Opera playwright by profession, rarely a novel writer.
Luo Ben was compiling from older stories. It's not certain that he necessarily invented it. Whether or not he invented it or took it from an older source, there were numerous similar other stories since "sacrificing your family for the greater good" was a popular trope in the stories of the time. Several others stories from around the same time actually feature heroes outright murdering their own families "for the greater good" and it being treated as a good thing.
Yeah I read it was also an intentional link by folklore stories to tie Liu Bei to the Han's founder, Liu Bang, who also threw babies & sacrificed relatives for the greater good of his rebellion.
The famous stories surrounding Liu Bang are not throwing babies or sacrificing relatives. The stories are that he tried to kick his children out of his carriage to lighten the load while fleeing but was stopped by his charioteer, and that he ignored the threats to his father's life when his father was a hostage against him. In both cases his family actually survived, and it is perhaps worth noting that during Han itself these stories were not considered flattering.
Invention.
Historically, Liu Bei fled abandoning his son/wife/concubines during Cao Cao's invasion by fleeing ahead of them and making sure he got away first. Zhao Yun was in charge of the rest of Liu Bei's household and managed to protect them. None of Liu Bei's close family died during the retreat from Changban. A romanticized, and I can believe it, story is Zhao Yun himself carried baby Liu Shan during the retreat. Liu Shan mentioned it in one of the memorials honoring Zhao Yun when he died I think.
Funny enough, this is parallel with Liu Bang, who allegedly kicked his family out of his carriage after his disastrous defeat at the Battle of Pengcheng.
>The Records of the Grand Historian recounts an event during this conflict, an event omitted from Liu Bang's own biography but present in the biography of Xiang Yu, where Liu Bang pushed his own children out of his carriage three times to lighten it in a desperate attempt to escape Xiang Yu's men, and it is only the repeated intervention of Xiahou Ying that secures the children's escape
Liu Bang never portrayed himself as anything other than a rascal
>never portrayed himself as anything other than a rascal
I don't agree. I think the rascal moniker is more recent invention, compounded by operas/plays/future dynasties trying to add drama/flair/personality to a peasant-turned-emperor. He definitely tried to make himself seem more legitimate like when he told a bunch of starving prisoners and bandits that he killed a white snake on Mount Mangdang and declared rebellion.
Like, was he a rascal and seem like a fricking disinterested NEET for the first 40 years of his life? Yeah. Did he see himself and wanted to portray himself as that way? I don't think so.
>Like, was he a rascal and seem like a fricking disinterested NEET for the first 40 years of his life? Yeah. Did he see himself and wanted to portray himself as that way? I don't think so.
he literally didn't give a shit.
>Secondly Luo Guanzhong (Romance of the Three Kingdoms Author) b***hed and moaned about living through the Post-Yuan Dynasty chaos where rebel armies backstabbed each other after felling the Mongol Rulers. He pined for virtuous & loyal Confucian-friendly heroes like muh Liu Bei who cared more about the people than politics
Don't forget the southern state we-wuzzing that happened during Southern Song.
But that was from before Luo Guanzhong's time.
Luo Guanzhong was compiling from older Song stories. Plus as a late-Yuan early-Ming figure he was we-wuzzing toward Southern Song which we-zuzzed Han.
>Don't forget the southern state we-wuzzing that happened during Southern Song.
Wu >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> shu
craftiness in Chinese culture is a pseudo-virtue. that's why we love Ping Pong so much. On top of already sounding like our language, ping pong emphasizes ways to sneak the ball past your opponent while confined to a tiny table. you couldn't ask for a better sort of game for Chinese to dominate at. As it is within our national legends.
Is Ping Pong your Aristotle?
I am awesome. Take my word for it.
t. Liu Bei
Backstabbing is a Chinese virtue.
Dying for Israel is an Amerimutt virtue