Anybody got any good stuff/evidence for genesis being real for a deist worldview? EG evidence of noahs ark, the flood, or any of the other events?
Anybody got any good stuff/evidence for genesis being real for a deist worldview? EG evidence of noahs ark, the flood, or any of the other events?
Stories are written to teach understanding and not facts.
who the frick are you homosexual? go back to gaia
Keep your homosexuals thoughts to yourself, and i do not take commands from mere men.
Oh so you're some sort of hero wannabe, gotcha
The likes of you need to expect no saving.
the flood did happen, the sphinx has water erosion
noah is a mytho-logical character, hes meant to teach
would book of job be more valid if it were a real man who said all that?
Is everything in genesis allegorical then to you?
no, i have studied the physics that involve the universe and i know it happened as it says it did, big bang theory was made by a christian after all
what i mean is that its an inspired work because of how its meant to transmit so many messages in the imagery it paints through the words used
a single phrase can have multiple meanings and every one of them is deep
So big bang theory comes from god creating the universe but the people in genesis are allegorical?
well, you know the earth has been going for a long time... right?, odds are that civilization has been built and destroyed many times.
technology in those terms comes and goes, knowledge does not.
we know hebrew scribes worked as engineers and such in mesopotamia and egypt, phoenecians not only dealt goods but also knowledge... that is the main reason the alphabet we use was made and propagated by them (later modified for ease by the greeks)
I don't know about that, we can figure out that god created the universe with the big bang but we can't accurately recall if the people in genesis were real people?
where in the bible does it say that the people mentioned were all real people and not a literary rsource depending on the context?
you do realize youre (not) reading something without even knowing what it is about and then making ignorant questions?
Well, we have independant sources showing jesus was real, so did it only start happening in the new testament that it was about real people? or was it somewhere else
did i say the people in the old testament didnt exist?
would it make a difference if adam was a real man when its adam kadmon who matters?, why are you worshipping the flesh when its spirit thats important and all the good in spirit comes directly from god, whenever man deviates from it he falls from grace and acts in selfish behavior
its easy to tell the difference
but really, you dont wanna talk about this, youd rather waste your time trying to argue dumb shit on IQfy, right?
have fun wasting your life, dumbass. good luck disproving something you havent even studied, surely youre the first guy to DEBOONK the bible in 2022+ years
ok have fun out there kiddo since you want to assume i'm arguing in bad faith instead of just having autism and being unable to articulate in a decent way
, im just asking where do the real people come in then if we assume adam and eve and noah to be fictional, who is fictional in genesis and who is not
does it matter who is real and who is not?, youre meant to understand the situation, context and decisions made
the person who makes the decision does not matter, are you gonna venerate bones?, do those bones have the ability to create life?, can it make something grow?, a man does not will his hair to grow, he depends on god for that. god decides how long you breathe even if you think it does not happen.
when man does good its because he is emulating god, when he acts in wicked ways its because he deviated. thus dont praise and cherish people, recognize the good belongs to god in a transversal way and acknowledge his ways are superior to mens, maybe then youll understand why it does not matter if theyre real people, if its real people in fictional setting, if theyre fictional people in real setting or whatever
its about you learning good and bad thus being able to emulate god
Okay, so if genesis is allegorical and the people in it dont matter, what's your evidence for your belief in god? just faith? or things you've seen? or that you've ruled out all other possible creations of the universe
understand genesis and youll answer the question yourself, no one can light the switch for you
Okay i guess i'm just fricked then if there is a god because i'm not seeing it from a deist point of view, at least you talked to me
god created everything and saw it was GOOD, this meant it served a purpose towards maintaining the balance imposed by god in the creation
god created god with the intent of this creature being his representation in a physical form, with his capabilities and potential.
man used this power to enslave other humans into labor and create empires
god once regrets creating humanity because all of their thoughts are consumption, practically the worst kind of animal with the potential to go beyond mere animals thus risking the whole ecology but still shows mercy because of the righteousness of a small man
humanity once again starts behaving this way and god keeps forgiving and offering his hand which man uses to get up and abuse the power granted
god sends warning throught the whole bible to the prophets, enoch and revelations talk of the moment were living on which involves the sun moving into a position which put us at risk (were seeing the consequences in the current global warming)
so even if you dont believe, the judgement is coming
all of genesis is mostly myth (most people are likely city names at best) and the first five books (the torah) in general are an accounting of the formation of the monothiestic cult of YHWH. It's the book of Joshua where real history starts and it stops being so mystical etc
Are you asking for evidence that those things happened but had no involvement from God? There's no evidence whatsoever that there was ever a global flood. There have been huge floods and possibly one of them inspired the story of Noah.
>noah's ark
Not even physically possible with modern technology; the closest scale model needs concrete pillars JUST to support its own weight.
>the flood
There never was a global flood. The most likely source for the myth stems from Mesopotamian myths (Noah's Ark is just a ripoff of prior fiction) which MAY have roots in the real historic flooding of the Persian Gulf.
>other events
Its my interpretation that the Garden of Eden is a israeli retelling of Dilmun, a place in Sumerian mythology which was the river valley that the modern Persian Gulf resides in. It would've been a VERY fertile and warm environment in the Ice Age, very close to where humans left Africa, and very easily could've been home to some of the earliest civilization outside of Africa.
Thanks to rising sea levels over time this "paradise" would've been lost to the sea, the Sumerians would've retained the memory in myth, and eventually the israelites would steal it as their own OC.
>Noah's Ark is just a ripoff of prior fiction
That was disproven, they're too different to be copied
adding onto your post, it's more likely the opposite actually happened.
>Epic of Gilgamesh has a god tell a guy to stop his work, make a boat to save animals, and they survive the flood
>Eridu Genesis has a god tell a guy to stop his work, make a boat to save animals, and they survive the flood
>Atra-Hasis has a god tell to guy to stop working, make a boat to save animals, and they survive the flood
>israeli god tells a guy to stop working, make a bigger boat to save way more animals, and they survive the flood
You're right its so unique and original.
okay
here's a video showing that's bullshit because the writing styles are different in many ways, also the timelines don't match up because gilgamesh was altered many times with the flood story
>here's a literally who youtube channel
I'm sorry are you trying to say that because the same story was written differently (thanks to the fact they're all in different languages) that its not the same story? Can my crudely written fanfiction of George Washington teaming up with Santa Claus be accepted as fact if I write it uniquely?
You mean like exactly what happened to the Old Testament. If you want to talk about timelines than the Epic of Gilgamesh is more valid at 2100-1150BC compared to the OT at 1500-400BC; just by age its clear the israeli myth is a cheap copycat of the established stories.
>epic has fricking multiple versions across multiple points in history
>video shows how genesis has things that the epics don't structure wise, and shows how they probably have a common ancestor instead of being ripoffs
You can say they're based on the same event, but you can't say it's a ripoff, it's just not true
>OT has multiple versions across multiple points in history
Again, going by that argument, the prior Mesopotamian works are more valid than the israeli one.
>they added more animals so its different and unique, my OC isn't fanfiction
My brother in christ, the common ancestor IS the Mesopotamian myths.
If somebody 600 years after Tolkien wrote the LOTR made their own version with the same exact plot, characters, motives, and lessons but with slightly different events that's a ripoff. If that author attempted, as you are, to insist their story was the original or even contemporary to the source material it blatantly stole from, then they're lying.
israeli brainwashing is ridiculous honestly; it gradually just evolves into "we wuz" tier nonsense.
uneducated demons, begon
fossils of sea animals have been found atop mountains and other such high places, for an example of the flood.
Genesis is basically how the world was made and then reshaped. the clearest bits are usually only hinting it. like the sulfuric glass amidst the desert, which is probably were sodom and gomorrah were.
for another really nice point, every nation has had a flood story.
the logical conclusion is it happened, and as it started to distance itself from Noah and all, people started adding in their own things and changing history up into whatever they end up having.
>the logical conclusion is it happened
Lol. What you really mean:
> I lack the intellect, honesty, or balls to admit that my 3000 year old myths aren't true, so here are some assertions and misunderstandings of science and geology
what else explains everyone, even across continents and completely separated, having the same main idea around?
Uhh, maybe the fact that human civilizations tend to congregate and grow around sources of water that can flood, sometimes catastrophically?
Sea fossils above sea level is just plate tectonics. The Sodom story was just a meteorite impact, nobody disputes that.
>every nation has had a flood story
This is just plain false.
I said stories are meant to teach understanding and not facts, why then do you people abandon wisdom and continue to argue the facts like fools?
Are the saying the stories are lies?
Good understanding is never false.
Well, my understanding is that the stories don't teach anything about reality.
Then your understanding is in poor condition having learned nothing.
What do the stories teach?
Stories can teach many different things, but not all stories seek to teach the same, it all depends on the stories.
The story of Adam and Eve teach about the basics of life and death, that we are all born innocent but are destinated to sin, that man and woman belong together and give rise to new life, and that life is difficult and hard work.
>that man and woman belong together and give rise to new life
I don't need Genesis to know this. My school had a class about it.
clearly you haven't been in any modern day school
you're not even going to try and watch the video, are you?
>clearly you haven't been in any modern day school
Understanding is not a given, as it is created so it can be destroyed, that is why we must preserve good understanding or man be led astray into confusion.
You better know it now, but in the old days there were no schools, all understanding was given through the priests unto the illiterate. Still you are arrogant and have much to learn.
The point of genesis, and the torah in general, is that the worship of idols divides people and breeds evil. Only idolators expect the bible to be literal because god is beyond the physical world.