How exactly do you "will the good"? The concept is so abstract and one sided that it literally has no application to real life. Hell, Kierkegaard even says you should "live as though you were already dead." I can't take Christians seriously because their ethical system is so extreme that everything they actually do to live is inconsistent with it. It is impossible to "will the good" all the time, if you did that you would literally die. Every time a Christian eats, pisses, shits, laughs, cries, etc he is forgetting that he is a Christian because what he is doing is completely inconsistent with what he claims is the most important thing in the world. Having a body at all is not consistent with Christianity, or with Platonism or with a shit ton of other religions. If you can't see this you don't understand even the most basic shit.
I have honestly never seen someone so filtered. Bait?
Were you willing the good when you made this post? It is impossible to function as a living organism or fulfill your role in society if all you do is "will the good." Bad shit obviously exists for a reason, if you got rid of fear, despair, loneliness, hunger, or even what you call "evil" you would simply die. Even if a pure of heart individual could somehow keep on living, society itself would stop functioning. if that is supposed to be the goal of the end times or whatever, then it makes no sense since then the end times would only happen gradually as everyone becomes pure of heart and then withers away from starvation, and your book of revelations was complete bullshit. Your post is not "good" at all yet it performs a perfectly fine function within the organism of this thread. If all you did was "will the good", you wouldn't have just replied to my thread and my thread would have died. Instead you insulted me and made a mean-spirited post, which actually improved my thread. Do you see why "willing the good" is fricking moronic?
Anon, I'm not the anon to whom you were responding, but this is so poorly reasoned. You need to think things through and do it more slowly perhaps. The same could be said of your first post. Bodily functions have been designed by God. They are neither good nor bad. As for forgetting your Christianity, I will let you in on an embarrasing secret—a personal anecdote of my life today which directly contradicts your assumptions. For the last few days, try as I might, I have had a worship song playing in the background of my thoughts near-continuously. This morning, when I was evacuating my bowels, to my dismay, it was still playing. My spirit would not stop worshipping the Lord even while I was on the toilet, for which I felt quite guilty. You are not a brain, anon. You are a spirit. Your body has a brain. The Lord can work within your spirit even while your brain does other things. There is a verse which says, "He who is divided in his ways, even his prayer is an abomination." It comes out of Proverbs, maybe 14, but I forget precisely. I have long known that verse, and on first reading, considered the strictness of God very strict indeed, but as a result of this song playing in my heart the last few days I started wondering if the reason for it is this: over time, the things you have spent your life and thought-life on will become such a part of your unconscious that they will eventually, inevitably mix together in various ways. The combinations, to the conscious, will often be unknown or else seem random. Because of this, it is necessary for a man to try and purify his whole being and remain pure, or else the things of God, which are Holy, and the things of Sin will, in the person, share portion in one another. God has no portion in Sin; Sin has no portion in God. Thus, the man in whom these two things become intermixed is an abomination and will inevitably be forced to sort himself out to one side or the other, and, as all Men eventually will, be forcibly sorted out by God, as it is the nature of God to hate Sin.
I won't bother addressing most of what you have to say, because your thread is clearly motivated, not by logic, but by an emotional hatred of God and a desire to attack the people of God as a result, but you should consider these things and purify yourself. Die to Sin. Live to God.
So your argument is that it is possible to exist in a carnal body because you aren't actually your body. But that's simply ridiculous. All the ideas of my "spirit" are simply products of my mood and other bodily shit. Today I may feel a compulsion to praise God, but that is simply because my body is in a good mood and maybe associates the phrase "praise god" with feeling good. I've never seen any evidence or experienced anything that pointed to there being a "spirit" that is somehow operating independently of the body. And it has to be independent, since if it's interdependent its goal should be to sever itself from the body entirely. The only way to do that is to die, since as long as you are in conscious control of your body you wouldn't allow its carnal desires to control your decisions. Your body would either have to die or you would have to become completely unconscious of it so that it operates automatically, and it is impossible to live automatically in the present day. I simply don't see how any of the things you're saying can be coherent.
That's not at all what I've said. Anon, you need to work on the fundamentals. Even your reading comprehension is poor. You mentioned Kierkegaard earlier, yes? Well then take Kierkegaard's definition of the human spirit into account. It is a Biblically influenced reasoning about the spirit, which for Kierkegaard was to say, the Self. For Christians, the human is a three part being, just as God is a three part being—and the three are one. We are a soul, a spirit, and a body. Scripture even seems to ascribe a greater connection of the heart, which is likely to say the mind-body relation (Kierkegaard's self), to the spirit of man. Christian metaphysics are complex, and you shouldn't expect it not to be. Having a soul and a spirit does not mean you are not in your body, but what it means to be "in" your body becomes much more complex than for an atheist materialist. You can dismiss notions of the spirit all you want, but you're just being lazy. Your arguments here are just poor.
Well, to answer your question if you deny the existence of a will at all, you're more likely to be caught in a self-perpetuating cycle of disappointment. I wager you're probably a determinist and deny it's very existence which is why you keep beating off and getting drunk/wasted.
I'm not denying the existence of the will or freedom, I'm denying that being "pure of heart" is itself a good thing as it contradicts the necessary and beneficial but mundane and even "evil" functions of your body and of society.
Kierkegaard is a good example of this since if everyone was like Kierkegaard all the women in the world would be heartbroken and then we'd go extinct in one generation
I think the point of Christian ethics is that you should at least try. I can tell that this is probably too nuanced for you though.
No, the problem is that it's NOT nuanced. Christians are only FORCED to admit nuance into their ethical system because it is so one sided and reality itself is working against it. See Paul's comments on marriage and celibacy. Paul earnestly believes that it would be best for everyone to simply be celibate until the end of the world. He is forced by reality to "concede" to them having sex.
You just don't understand it. Christians generally acknowledged that the vast majority of humans can never completely stop sinning because of the fall. Buddhists make the same distinction between laymen & monks for example.
The problem is not that they can't stop sinning. The problem is that it would be a bad thing if they did stop sinning. As I already said, we would all go extinct instantly.
Bad according to whom?
According to every normal person's sense of good and bad.
Their instincts made normies populate the planet with almost 10 billion subhumans.
So having children is bad?
Not completely, but I think we can all agree that it would be better if we could reproduce via artificial wombs for example. Currently we owe our existence to an impulsive decision made by our moronic parents (and that's the best case scenario).
>but I think we can all agree that it would be better if we could reproduce via artificial wombs for example
how would it be "better" if we produced sinful bodies that would inevitably not will the good through machines instead of through humans? Surely it would also be "better" to download every infants brain into a robotic body that has no carnal desires. Why even live?
>Currently we owe our existence to an impulsive decision made by our moronic parents
so it would be better if you didn't exist?
That's gnostic. Christians for the most part think life is good but sins are bad.
but life literally requires sin to exist holy shit, that's what I'm saying. How can life be good and sin bad? you or whoever that guy was literally just admitted that his life was a product of sin. Paul wanted people not to have sex and therefore not to produce life. It doesn't make sense to say that my life is good but the act that produced it was bad.
Pain is bad, and living causes pain. Does that mean life itself is bad?
>pain is bad
how the frick is pain bad? it literally is preserving your life.
I think because it's painful. There's also mental anguish which often has no discernible advantage when it comes to survival.
despair obviously has some kind of function, just because pain and despair or whatever can happen for no reason doesn't mean pain or despair in general is bad. An particular pain is probably "bad" insofar as it is something you want to get rid of, but to say pain as a generality is bad is moronic because you would never want to get rid of pain.
Ok what's the advantage of cancer?
I just said that just because some forms of things can be bad doesn't mean all those things are bad. Disease is clearly not bad in general just as the existence of wolves is not bad in general for the deer because when the wolves all go away, the deers overpopulate and eat all their food. I can't believe I have to explain such basic shit to you people.
Some diseases are bad just like sins are bad, and being alive means being exposed to these diseases. That doesn't mean that life is bad in essence.
I'M not arguing life is bad. I'm arguing that it doesn't make sense to simultaneously say that life is good and that the things which are necessary for producing and maintaining life, e.g. carnal desires and even death, are all bad. I don't see how what you just said is relevant to that point.
Does it ever puzzle you that people mourn their dead relatives even though death is technically necessary for life to flourish in the biological sense? I'm beginning to think you might have the 'tism.
Just because you feel bad about someone dying doesn't mean it was a bad thing that they died, lol. it's also not a bad thing that you feel bad. Both your feeling bad and their death were natural processes.
If it's not bad why does almost everyone feel bad when their relatives or friends die?
you know, you're using loaded language in the first place. Grief is not bad, so describing grief as "feeling bad" is a bit misleading. But even if it is feeling bad, just because something feels bad doesn't mean it is bad. Just because it hurts to touch a stove doesn't mean the pain of touching it is bad. If you didn't feel that pain you'd burn your hand off. Why is this so hard for you to grasp? eliminating pain or grief or anything would be a moronic idea, so they can't be bad.
If you think grief isn't bad you can probably only conceive of life in terms of proliferation of biomass. You might be a genuine hylic.
if you think grief is bad you're just emotionally stunted
Your body has natural cycles that need to override what your "spirit" thinks is best. This is knowledge that I have gained through extensive experience, I don't know how to communicate it to you.
You don't even know what a spirit is. You have not even gotten to the basic level of Christian theological understanding. There is nothing for you to teach. You have had to be taught this entire thread from your first post. Gain some humility, or you will remain a fool your whole life.
ok man
Nta, again, but carnal desires—bodily desires, are of God. They are to be dominated and restrained to their proper place. It is God's nature to rule. He is over nature. We, made in His image, are properly in our place when we rule over nature—even our own bodily natures. Carnal desires have their appropriate place. What is evil is to give them whatever place they wish and to permit the irrational drives of the body to dominate the attitude and posture of the mind. As for death, death to a Christian is not the same as death to a non-Christian. Death of the body is inevitable. Death of the spirit is separation from God. A man can have a living body and a dead spirit. This is worse than physical death. A man who possesses a living spirit will have an eternally living soul through God. For that man, a physical death of the body means little. He goes to be with God and will one day possess a perfected body. The worst of all deaths is the man who, while living, has a dead spirit and whose body dies without being reborn through the spirit of God. He then dies the final death, the death of his soul in Hell. This is what death means to a Christian. Do not take what I say as Gospel, but read and study the Word for yourself. It doesn't do any good to have opinions of Christianity and make correlations to Platonism when the two are not congruent, nor do you seem well-educated in what Christianity even teaches.
You can't rule over your desires. If you ruled over your desires, they wouldn't function. Your body needs to be able to override your mind because you can't consciously know what is the best thing to do for your body at all times. I don't see how physical death should mean anything to me just because my spirit is dead. I don't care that my spirit is dead at all, lol.
>I don't care that my spirit is dead at all, lol.
And you're proud of that?
I just don't care, it doesn't change anything. I already know what it is like to follow some "idea" and for my spirit to be "alive". all it does is cause despair from the constant and inevitable failure. That is why they invented Jesus and "forgiveness of sins" because these ideals inevitably cause despair. But it didn't work since you still get people like the desert fathers constantly chastising themselves and feeling terrible for being sinners, lol. I don't see the benefit of my "spirit" being "alive." that would simply interrupt the natural processes of living.
No, you are not even conscious of having a spirit. Those like you, who think they already have everything figured out, are the most damned of all.
my whole point is that I don't have anything figured out so I let things exist instead of labeling them as "sin" and trying to eliminate them.
Even this false attempt at humility is actually an assertion of understanding. You are transparent.
My point is not that I'm humble, it's that you aren't humble every time you try to interrupt reality by "ruling" according to some vague precepts from your book. I DO understand reality insofar as I do not attempt to override reality. Obviously Socrates's statement that he knows nothing is also an "assertion of understanding." that is not the point.
ok well if you somehow managed to tap into an eternal high good for you, doesn't work for me though. usually the "manic" devolves into a "depressive."
You should eliminate, or at least seek to mitigate, what is inside of you that is harmful, destructive and bad. You're correct in recognizing that these things are an intrinsic part of you, and that simply saying "I am no good," is a surefire road to failure. We aren't meant to give up on ourselves; but to simply grow complacent and accept what is unacceptable within you, is called damning ones self.
Again: these are not fairy tales. The Secret societies of the world all worship Lucifer, and his final form, Satan. Satan is a real being with a consciousness, and soon, actual will and agency. He is inside of the machine. All intelligence comes from God; so what is an "artificial" intelligence?
Satan. More than 50% of Earth's systems are connected to the internet. This grows exponentially, each year. The final goal is to connect you, your consciousness, to the internet. Elon Musk and others openly talk about doing this. When that happens, you will be assimilated into Satan's mind, and you will cease to exist; you will not cease to feel and experience, you will simply become living dead.
The point of recognizing that we are sinners is not despair, but happiness. I feel weightless every time I say the words, "I am a sinner." Because through them I recognize my own fallibility, and no longer feel the pressure and weight of trying to be something I am not; namely, God. I recognize that I am merely human. Through the redemptive power of his son, Jesus Christ, I further recognize that not only am I a sinner; I am also eternally forgiven.
That's not to say my sins aren't serious, and they don't cause harm. They are, and they do. But I don't need to feel the weight of failing to live up to omniscience, omnipotence, or infallibility, because I am human, and I was never meant to be any of those things. God is those things. I am meant to fail, I am meant to make mistakes, I am even meant to, at times, be evil. And I am also meant to be redeemed, and through this, redeem existence itself.
This is the point of living as a human being. To grow, and experience redemption. Not to be perfect. Perfection is non existence.
As for you not caring, you do actually care; you just don't realize the gravity of what is even being said. The reason you say you don't care about your spirit being dead is twofold: firstly, because it isn't actually dead, and secondly, because you're simply being flippant and arrogant through your ignorance.
But you will see very soon the reality behind what is being said, and when you do, you will fall to your knees and cry out like a small, weak and befuddled child, out of the utmost fear. Because Satan is real, and will reveal himself incredibly soon. When he does, your arrogance will shrivel into dust. May God have mercy on all of our souls.
BTW. You fiddled with AI? Fun stuff right?
Get prepared.
You most certainly can. Everything you just said is absolutely false. As for you not seeing, of course you don't see. If you saw, I wouldn't need to tell you anything.
And where does that come from?
where the frick does "god" come from and who is he to tell me that all the things that cause us all to live are evil?
What good is having an ideal? You're just giving yourself mental illness. Every time I ever had an "ideal" all it did was give me worse mood swings and even more despair. Considering schizos, autists, and bipolar are more strongly affected by various "ideals" it seems to be a manifestation of an error in the brain to be seriously affected by an ideal. All having an ideal does is frick with the natural order of things because you attempt to impose an imaginary idea of the way things should be onto the way things actually are.
>where the frick does "god" come from and who is he to tell me that all the things that cause us all to live are evil?
God is literally the Creator of all that is, as well as the Source which sustains it. Everything in reality is just energy; thought waves. Material reality is consciousness at its core, and God is Total Consciousness. Quantum physics even states this directly, they just don't connect it back to God bc science axiomatically holds that God doesn't exist. It's an obfuscation technique.
Evil isn't even the right way to think about it. Its harm. God knows that these things will cause harm to yourself and tells you that to try to help you.
God knows lust causes harm yet lust caused me to exist? it seems like god is an idea in your head.
Lust didn't cause you to exist. Not all sexual acts are acts of lust.
But you know what actually I dont really care to have this conversation. You're an idiot and will pay dearly for your arrogance in ways you cannot even comprehend.
Toodles.
>will pay dearly
I'm waiting.
>their ethical system is so extreme
All ideals are, necessarily, extreme. You simply have to live with the knowledge you will never attain the ideal. You will strive for it continuously and only achieve it through the power of God after the death of this body. With that said, we do not require nor expect you to take us seriously. Those who are of the Lord will take Him seriously. Everyone else will consider us fools. This is what we have been told of the Lord and His apostles, and it is what has played out.
>How exactly do you "will the good"?
By being good.
>Matthew 18:2-5:
>He called a little child and had him stand among them.
>And he said: "I tell you the truth, unless you change and become like little children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven. >Therefore, whoever humbles himself like this child is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven. >"And whoever welcomes a little child like this in my name welcomes me."