that is not an especially egregious example, but the answer to "why did art deteriorate between the greek and roman periods to late anqituity?" is merely "christcucks". this is not unusual or a controversial answer. this has been debated and is the undisputed answer. christcucks will reply to this comment out of bitter envy and self-insecurity, but the reality is that they know it's true
with evangelical priests killed and destroyed everyone who was like this.
"ancient finns" lives in ancient equivalents to the modern toolshed but made out of dung
Unironically what caused this? I know there was big turmoil in rome, and the city of rome saw a population decline, but why did thqt cause art to get a lot worse for a prolonged time period?
I cannot for the life of me find a piece of Byzantine art that makes me go 'wow' like Roman art does. Surly they would've eventually found skilled artists right? The art of the region took a nosedive after the collapse of the empire, and didn't really come back until like 1000 years later. Hell even the ancient Greeks alone had much better looking art that this.
If you have a bunch of barbarians who want to culturally annihalate another culture then you suddenly lack the cultural products of the previous culutre.
Christianity eradicated the hellenic and roman culture and society.
Just look at this hair. It's like a child trying to copy an original piece. Was Christianity really responsible for this decline? Why did it take christianized Europe 1000k years to figure out what the pagan Romans and Greeks already knew?
>HURR CHRISTIANITY CHRISTIANITY CHRISTIANITY
why do you feel the need to drag your fedora shit into everything
also plain untrue
2 years ago
Anonymous
Renaissance was also ended by picrel, another german. I can't think something germanic countries ever did good for civilization.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>I can't think something germanic countries ever did good for civilization.
they are kinda killing themselves now, so that's good
2 years ago
Anonymous
Christianity destroyed the culture.
What part of it do you not understand?
It was cultural apocalypse with every temple, cultural area, ritual, cultural pracrices or ANYTHING identifying the people with its culture was destroyed and any who resisted considered devil worshipers.
Christians are not rational human beings.
2 years ago
Anonymous
if you were caught reading the books of your culture by the christians they would call you demon worshiper.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Pagan art, late third century.
Huh paganbros?does the narrative still hold?
2 years ago
Anonymous
Christianity destroyed 99% of Pagan demonic demon worshiping books.
Particularly in the age of Justinian, book-burning was staged as a ritual act. Persecution of pagans under Justinian involved book-burning – book-burning was even enforced systematically during this time period and included an unspecific range of pagan books, if we can trust texts such as the anonymous Life of Simeon. At least, descriptions of religious inquisitions found there are confirmed in other source material. The general picture, then, is one of increased legislation and clamping down on certain avenues of thought, largely pre-Christian, but the evidence for legal enforcement is somewhat limited before the age of Justinian. Charges of magic and of paganism sometimes provided a convenient excuse for incriminating powerful individuals who would otherwise have been exempt from book-charges.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Galerius' step father, Diocletian, made a few years earlier
It's almost like that was a bad artist or something, not representative of the period.
However, find me a single piece of Byzantine art (over 300 years later btw) that is as good or even slightly worse than the Roman and Greek art I've posted.
2 years ago
Anonymous
That's a very simplistic bust. Also, yeah sure homosexual, here's byzantine art
2 years ago
Anonymous
frick C*stantine and C*stantinople
2 years ago
Anonymous
>Frick Constanine (the first christian emperor) >posts the crusaders chimping out
what did he mean by this?
turk falseflagging or just a moron?
2 years ago
Anonymous
it doesn't matter as its his capital and legacy being fricked.
2 years ago
Anonymous
become stupid -> adopt stupid religion as result of poor judgement
2 years ago
Anonymous
That was sculpted almost 1300 years after the ones I posted, which again brings me to my point.
Why did it take christianized Europe over 1000 years to figure out what the Romans and Greeks already knew? Not a Christ hate thread, genuinely I want to know.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Still christian art.
2 years ago
Anonymous
If you actually take the time to read what I said here
Just look at this hair. It's like a child trying to copy an original piece. Was Christianity really responsible for this decline? Why did it take christianized Europe 1000k years to figure out what the pagan Romans and Greeks already knew?
you'd know that I never said Christians didn't make beautiful art, just that it took them like over 1000k years to catch up to the Romans and Greeks, which is a very big gap.
Just look at this
>the coinage
oh my god
Even better example
This is just bizarre
Those are only like 350 years apart, wtf happened? That shit is not normal.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>Those are only like 350 years apart, wtf happened?
They are more like 700 years apart
2 years ago
Anonymous
Pagan art, late third century.
Huh paganbros?does the narrative still hold?
> have highly advances civilization with division of labor, a professional military, and artisans who can spend a whole lifetime honing their craft > produce beautiful plastic art still being revered thousands of years later > adopt a new religion, turning you from a warrior culture to a people of the book > lose all scientific advancement > begin to lose wars against barbarians > people need to either fight or farm for their own survival now > the professional arts scene disappears
Pretty simple, actually. Read Gibbon.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>Read Gibbon
Did he make up an answer that satisfies you?
these skills take a lifetime of practice, you might need several sculptors attempting to develop these skills with only a few becoming truly talented, further, these skills are developed over generations as well as over lifetimes, passed down from master to apprentice, you also need a supply of high quality marble
to support all these full time sculptors you need demand for their work, patrons of the arts might support starving artists, but without demand and competition they will start to stray from truly high quality pieces, after trade broke down and various cities were invaded and pillaged, the artists were scattered and most were unemployed, not enough to motivate them to start a school and teach dozens of eager students
Just look at this hair. It's like a child trying to copy an original piece. Was Christianity really responsible for this decline? Why did it take christianized Europe 1000k years to figure out what the pagan Romans and Greeks already knew?
It's not hard to understand at all.
This decline happens when the artisans that know how to do that job, don't pass the knowledge to a new generation because there is no demand for that anymore, either because of economic crisis or because of a change in taste
we live right now in a time period like that one, look at pic related. stoneworkers that know how to do that don't exist anymore. they were extremely ordinary in the 1800s and early 1900s, because everywhere from Buenos Aires to Saint Petersburg, all big buildings of big cities were being built like that, but architecture change and we don't have trained stoneworkers anymore, we use concrete, wood, brick and mortar instead.
byzantines were fundamentalist nutjobs like modern ISIS. This stupid simplistic art was sacred to them and should not be modified, only copied and the old Greco-Roman art was too pagan. For them, Art shouldn't progress and stay moronic as they were
Art has not really declined. Not completely, at least. Only an aspect of art — the artist — has declined. Artists today are nothing like the artists of yesterday, as individuals that is. There is no Michelangelo or Beethoven or Shakespeare today. However, art has become much more advanced nevertheless. The transition from individual to communal art projects brought with it significant advancements in our forms of art. There may not be an individual worth great respect behind the creation of any art today, but our art today is also outside the capabilities of any of those individuals.
Art has progressed, but it hasn't improved. There is simply nothing produced in recent times which can match the beauty and artistic perfection of ancient and Renaissance sculpture. We might be able to create works that are beyond the capabilities of the ancients, but because of the decline of the artist that you diagnosed there are a great many things that they created which are beyond our capabilities now.
test
-to this, in the span of 300 years? why did it get noticeably worse?
The stupid began to rule with the rise of Christianity and democracy
that is not an especially egregious example, but the answer to "why did art deteriorate between the greek and roman periods to late anqituity?" is merely "christcucks". this is not unusual or a controversial answer. this has been debated and is the undisputed answer. christcucks will reply to this comment out of bitter envy and self-insecurity, but the reality is that they know it's true
"ancient finns" lives in ancient equivalents to the modern toolshed but made out of dung
Unironically what caused this? I know there was big turmoil in rome, and the city of rome saw a population decline, but why did thqt cause art to get a lot worse for a prolonged time period?
lack of skilled craftsmen and tightening division of labor
I cannot for the life of me find a piece of Byzantine art that makes me go 'wow' like Roman art does. Surly they would've eventually found skilled artists right? The art of the region took a nosedive after the collapse of the empire, and didn't really come back until like 1000 years later. Hell even the ancient Greeks alone had much better looking art that this.
If you have a bunch of barbarians who want to culturally annihalate another culture then you suddenly lack the cultural products of the previous culutre.
Christianity eradicated the hellenic and roman culture and society.
>HURR CHRISTIANITY CHRISTIANITY CHRISTIANITY
why do you feel the need to drag your fedora shit into everything
also plain untrue
Renaissance was also ended by picrel, another german. I can't think something germanic countries ever did good for civilization.
>I can't think something germanic countries ever did good for civilization.
they are kinda killing themselves now, so that's good
Christianity destroyed the culture.
What part of it do you not understand?
It was cultural apocalypse with every temple, cultural area, ritual, cultural pracrices or ANYTHING identifying the people with its culture was destroyed and any who resisted considered devil worshipers.
Christians are not rational human beings.
if you were caught reading the books of your culture by the christians they would call you demon worshiper.
Pagan art, late third century.
Huh paganbros?does the narrative still hold?
Christianity destroyed 99% of Pagan demonic demon worshiping books.
Particularly in the age of Justinian, book-burning was staged as a ritual act. Persecution of pagans under Justinian involved book-burning – book-burning was even enforced systematically during this time period and included an unspecific range of pagan books, if we can trust texts such as the anonymous Life of Simeon. At least, descriptions of religious inquisitions found there are confirmed in other source material. The general picture, then, is one of increased legislation and clamping down on certain avenues of thought, largely pre-Christian, but the evidence for legal enforcement is somewhat limited before the age of Justinian. Charges of magic and of paganism sometimes provided a convenient excuse for incriminating powerful individuals who would otherwise have been exempt from book-charges.
Galerius' step father, Diocletian, made a few years earlier
It's almost like that was a bad artist or something, not representative of the period.
However, find me a single piece of Byzantine art (over 300 years later btw) that is as good or even slightly worse than the Roman and Greek art I've posted.
That's a very simplistic bust. Also, yeah sure homosexual, here's byzantine art
frick C*stantine and C*stantinople
>Frick Constanine (the first christian emperor)
>posts the crusaders chimping out
what did he mean by this?
turk falseflagging or just a moron?
it doesn't matter as its his capital and legacy being fricked.
become stupid -> adopt stupid religion as result of poor judgement
That was sculpted almost 1300 years after the ones I posted, which again brings me to my point.
Why did it take christianized Europe over 1000 years to figure out what the Romans and Greeks already knew? Not a Christ hate thread, genuinely I want to know.
Still christian art.
If you actually take the time to read what I said here
you'd know that I never said Christians didn't make beautiful art, just that it took them like over 1000k years to catch up to the Romans and Greeks, which is a very big gap.
Just look at this
Those are only like 350 years apart, wtf happened? That shit is not normal.
>Those are only like 350 years apart, wtf happened?
They are more like 700 years apart
> have highly advances civilization with division of labor, a professional military, and artisans who can spend a whole lifetime honing their craft
> produce beautiful plastic art still being revered thousands of years later
> adopt a new religion, turning you from a warrior culture to a people of the book
> lose all scientific advancement
> begin to lose wars against barbarians
> people need to either fight or farm for their own survival now
> the professional arts scene disappears
Pretty simple, actually. Read Gibbon.
>Read Gibbon
Did he make up an answer that satisfies you?
these skills take a lifetime of practice, you might need several sculptors attempting to develop these skills with only a few becoming truly talented, further, these skills are developed over generations as well as over lifetimes, passed down from master to apprentice, you also need a supply of high quality marble
to support all these full time sculptors you need demand for their work, patrons of the arts might support starving artists, but without demand and competition they will start to stray from truly high quality pieces, after trade broke down and various cities were invaded and pillaged, the artists were scattered and most were unemployed, not enough to motivate them to start a school and teach dozens of eager students
so, I guess, economics
with evangelical priests killed and destroyed everyone who was like this.
Just look at this hair. It's like a child trying to copy an original piece. Was Christianity really responsible for this decline? Why did it take christianized Europe 1000k years to figure out what the pagan Romans and Greeks already knew?
Christianity wiped out Hellenic and Roman culture as I told you.
Germanic inmigration + 3rd century crisis
>the coinage
oh my god
LOL
Even better example
This is just bizarre
Greece declined economically and only left roman artists.
Also, not more greek statues to copy or steal.
It's not hard to understand at all.
This decline happens when the artisans that know how to do that job, don't pass the knowledge to a new generation because there is no demand for that anymore, either because of economic crisis or because of a change in taste
we live right now in a time period like that one, look at pic related. stoneworkers that know how to do that don't exist anymore. they were extremely ordinary in the 1800s and early 1900s, because everywhere from Buenos Aires to Saint Petersburg, all big buildings of big cities were being built like that, but architecture change and we don't have trained stoneworkers anymore, we use concrete, wood, brick and mortar instead.
byzantines were fundamentalist nutjobs like modern ISIS. This stupid simplistic art was sacred to them and should not be modified, only copied and the old Greco-Roman art was too pagan. For them, Art shouldn't progress and stay moronic as they were
all the ancient roman art turns out to be done by greek artisans, were there actually good sculptors from ancient Italy?
Most Byzantine art, especially statues were destroyed, either during the iconoclasm, by Venetians or turks
ART IS OBJECTIVE
Art has not really declined. Not completely, at least. Only an aspect of art — the artist — has declined. Artists today are nothing like the artists of yesterday, as individuals that is. There is no Michelangelo or Beethoven or Shakespeare today. However, art has become much more advanced nevertheless. The transition from individual to communal art projects brought with it significant advancements in our forms of art. There may not be an individual worth great respect behind the creation of any art today, but our art today is also outside the capabilities of any of those individuals.
Art has progressed, but it hasn't improved. There is simply nothing produced in recent times which can match the beauty and artistic perfection of ancient and Renaissance sculpture. We might be able to create works that are beyond the capabilities of the ancients, but because of the decline of the artist that you diagnosed there are a great many things that they created which are beyond our capabilities now.