I believe that everything is subjective, there no objective truths. Our perception shapes reality.
Change my mind.
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I believe that everything is subjective, there no objective truths. Our perception shapes reality. Change my mind.
I disagree, and my perception shapes reality.
WHAT!?
You can't believe in opposite affirmations at the same time...
Muh dik is objective
And that objective is yo momma
>I believe that everything is subjective, there no objective truths.
If that's true, then it's false.
You're not very logical.
Instead of trying to point out flaws in the logic, why don't you show an example of objective truth?
I could but then you’d go on a long tangent imagining a different reality where it’s not true.
For instance: human beings cannot fly in a stable fashion without the assistance of of some device or machine.
You’ll create some justification where that isn’t true, but if you jump off your roof right now without any mechanical assistance or otherwise, you’re not going to fly and you’re going to hurt yourself. This is true every time, but you’ll bullshit some imaginary scenario for the sake of argument.
>but you’ll bullshit some imaginary scenario for the sake of argument.
No, I'm not smart enough to do that. I get the flying thing. It's satisfying enough.
Good, I guess
I am currently looking at my computer screen.
I don't really have to, but for you: you're a moron (objective truth).
>Instead of trying to point out flaws in the logic
logical inconsistencies arising as a result of a contradictory proposition should tell you something
>example of objective truth
God
>God
How do you know God is an objective truth? How can you arrive at this conclusion?
Any supposed subjectivity applied to His will and actions become automatic objective truths since He creates reality and its mechanics. Furthermore, infinite wisdom and knowledge gives ultimate insight of every truth
Didn't understand shit of what you just said my homie
Since God is the creator of reality, then whatever God makes is the objective truth.
Let's try this way. He is by definition the necessary being and everything depends on his presence as a result of that. Since we exist then he does too. Your only way out is modal collapse to make everything necessary (and therefore objective truths). Either way your proposition fails
God is not necessary for existence.
No
>No
why isn't this perception objective?
Because thought and belief are affected by genes and culture you live in. It's not under our control.
It seems like genes and culture hold the keys to objectivity in your view. Whatever they "decide" becomes fact after all.
>How can you arrive at this conclusion
Define God as objective truth.
How the frick am I gonna do that?
Ok...
Just use your imagination. God is imaginary
>How the frick am I gonna do that?
Everytime you think about the concept of, "objective truth", say, "God" instead.
For example:
>I believe that everything is subjective, there are no gods. Our perception shapes reality.
>Change my mind.
This is how atheists say it. Then you give them your arguments, and they oppose it, because atheists have no mental framework. They only oppose the frameworks of others. Kind of like Satan. Satan is the accuser. He does not stand for anything, other than opposition.
Who said anything about God? I'm Christian, this is not a discussion about God.
Every conclusion is the product of premises coming together in a structure of logic. Just like DNA. Each premise becomes the father of additional conclusions. But there needs to be a starting point of your tree of logic. This is the tree at the center of the garden. The tree of knowledge of good and evil is the objective truth. There is only one rule. Don't disobey objective truth. What did the serpent say to eve? He said, "did God really say that?"
Stop making shit up.
Funny how the sound of "shit" has evolved. I can hardly bare it. It surrounds my head.
Ok Satan, gtfo my thread, I didn't invite you.
Water is made up of molecules consisting of one atom of Oxygen and two atoms of Hydrogen
Your dad fricked your mom.
>there are no objective truths
Is this proposition an objective truth?
No
So there are objective truths.
>there no objective truths
Wrong. Gravity will always make objects fall to the ground. All you can do against this is at best argue semantics.
>I believe that everything is subjective, there no objective truths.
Isn't that an objective truth?
>everything is subjective, there no objective truths
Is that objectively true? Or just your opinion?
>I believe
Unless you're lying, it is objectively true that you believe. Which makes the rest of your statement utterly self defeating.
>it is objectively true that you believe.
How can you be so sure? You can believe something else and not know.
Because if you believe it's true that you believe.
Nothing subjective about it, doesn't matter what you believe. It's that you believe in anything at all that's true.
>Our perception shapes reality.
is this perception under your control?
I do not believe solipsism is true because if it were true we would be very unlikely to find ourselves in undesirable circumstances The world is far too chaotic and beyond our control. Look at any map of the Earth and how seemingly random the shapes of the continents are, there's no way any of this is within the realm of our minds other than as conscious projections. If sollipsism is bullshit, then there must be an objective truth, because it implies properties about reality independent of alll observers.
What kind of jobs do you people have where being objectively correct on a regular basis isn’t necessary?
Your worldview wouldn’t survive one day at a lot, maybe all decent jobs, and most shitty ones too.
Just because two people AGREE on something doesn't make something objectively true.
Anon if i make and ship a product that is not to correct specs I am wrong and in trouble. There is no wishing your way out of it. Material, time, measurements, dates, these things aren’t subjective.
You are correct, and I agree with you.
What I don't agree with is how you consider specs, time and materials as objective concepts. Those too are constructs. A "table" doesn't exist in real life. It is merely a word, a concept that takes place in our minds, in the field of ideas, that takes form and become reality.
>A "table" doesn't exist in real life.
Let’s test it anon. Smash your head on a table in your mind as hard as you can, then do it to a real one in your house (apartment) and report back with the difference.
Face first
The wood is real. Not the table.
"Table" is just a word. Something that exists in our minds. Even the word wood is not real, it's just trying to condense what the material is. Words try to explain nature, but they're merely an user interface for a much more complex reality.
Why would the wood be real but not the table..a table is just wood in the shape of a table
>a table is just wood in the shape of a table
Tables are a human invention, a social construct. They're not real.
Human inventions are still real if they’re manufactured. The table you refused to smash your face into is real and that’s why you wouldn’t do it.
Only vowels exist. Consonants don't. They're just noise. They're not real, they don't mean anything, specially on their own.
Vowels are like wood, table are like consonants.
You’re literally developing psychosis
Society is literally mass hysteria. You're just not questioning it.
AI and people, under certain conditions, can be led to believe anything, and act as if they were so.
Does that make it real? That is the real question.
>Society is literally mass hysteria. You're just not questioning it
Long term Unemployed thoughts
When did this place become so normies? You go to a job, work 9 to 5, go to church on Sundays and that's it? Am I that big of a loser compared to you?
>can be led to believe anything, and act as if they were so.
The first part is true but the second is not. Instruct the machine to be a cat and it will meow and purr but that's an imitation of what it thinks a cat must do and not actually be one because it has no first person experience of it and can never have that even if it were to tap into the sensory nerves of one and learn to simulate it perfectly to an outside observer.
>Does that make it real?
No because objective truths exist outside of perception.
>A "table" doesn't exist in real life. It is merely a word, a concept that takes place in our minds
The identification of tables can be programmed into machines though. This shows definitions correspond to real things and not just more definitions no?
If I tell a machine that it is God... And the machine starts acting, thinking, doing things as if it were so... Is the machine God?
>starts acting, thinking, doing things as if it were so
It can't do that because it's a created object that is not eternal and lacking the omni attributes amongst other limitations. And anyway the previous point was about identification not transformation.
I know, but thinking like this stinks of unemployed people in their early 20s who spend too much time thinking about how many angels can dance on a needle. If all you do is sit in your room playing video games and watching breadtube its easy to get into this headspace that "whoa what if nothing is real dude"
Hit the nail on the head. This is the most unemployed op
>"whoa what if nothing is real dude"
I've been unemployed for 6 years, but started to develop this idea recently. And even then, what you're doing is a ad hominem.
And not only that, but the idea that "nothing is real" has been pondered in ancient Greece
>I've been unemployed for 6 years, but started to develop this idea recently.
….and you think this helps your case and doesn’t perfectly prove his and my point?
Your point is an ad hominem. I don't have to take it into consideration. I'm not the subject of discussion, no matter how much you want to make it so.
It’s not an ad hom anon it’s the direct cause of your shitty opinion. Your life is so easy it’s not dependent on even understanding that things are true or false.
>I've been unemployed for 6 years
This particular argument aside, none of your opinions are worth anything because of this. You’re a total fricking loser dude
>I've been unemployed for 6 years
This makes the point though. If you are out in the real world you get a footing in fundamental reality. If youre secluded in your room watching fictional sci fi or video games stuff ect. your grip on reality becomes lose.
>What kind of jobs do you people have where being objectively correct on a regular basis isn’t necessary?
>Your worldview wouldn’t survive one day at a lot, maybe all decent jobs, and most shitty ones too.
Kek back to work, homosexual.
What are whe percieving then? Checkmate
Idk. You can't even prove to me that you exist.
Why do you care? If I truly were just a loser with a brain turning to slop... You wouldn't have to pay attention to it. You could just ignore it.
>immediate goal post moving
This is what happens when you don't know what you are talking about
You are talking about me pretending that you.
You clearly have no idea what you're talking, what I've gone through, the experiences I've had.
You made a thread around a superficial amd simplistic though ; just move on
>guy on IQfy who has been unemployed for 6 years shares his thoughts with us as his brain turns to slop
Lol
I can guarantee that this guy is also struggling with a porn addiction and is seriously considering if hes trans or non binary ect.
Even if objective truth exists I see no reson not to ignore it.
Reality shapes our perception. If you have normal nerves, fire is gonna feel hot. If you have a normal tongue, sugar will taste sweet