I want to learn malware dev what would you recommend for me to start out with
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I want to learn malware dev what would you recommend for me to start out with
I want to learn malware dev what would you recommend for me to start out with
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Shopping Cart Returner Shirt $21.68 |
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Go to some coding entry level course
That's a man
He'll be my b***h
Learn a low level language, something like C or C++ (I dont recommend C++)
Then learn about the win32 and windows operating system and how programs and processes and memory works
a guy called "crow" on youtube has some good vids on it
start with malware for linux kernel based os in c++ it will teach you everything you need to know
then do windows/android/ios whatever because those are more Black personlicious
>jewtube
dont do this please
I agree. I'd like to add, it can be helpful to look at existing malware and learn how they work, perhaps even through some reverse engineering.
What's wrong with c++ for malware dev?
there's something wrong with C++ in general.
ok but seriously now. for malware in general, staying low level, especially when you're doing OS-level shit, tends to be preferable. C++ can get in the way of that. sure, C++ is for a large part compatible with C, but using the C++ standard library and mixing it with C types is not a great experience. it's not a bad idea to start with C when you're new so you can force yourself to use structs for example to learn how memory works, etc, etc. not to mention small binary sizes or other shenanigans that you can do with C tooling can be useful, perhaps when you want to inject a payload or something else. that's my take on it, but besides that C++ is fine if you're a maniac and like using C++.
so many things written in c++ chromium tensorflow unreal engine llvm
The list could go on, im not saying that its good because a lot of people use it but you just have to learn it at this point dont you?
I like reading c, if i write stuff i use c++
>you just have to learn it at this point dont you?
I don't really get the argument here. I learned both C and C++, and I used C++ extensively at some point, but I stuck with C in the end. There's plenty of software written in plain C, especially if you look at systems-level programming, e.g. linux, win32/winapi, most of the userspace that exists on top of them e.g. gnu, etc, etc. so arguably C is a more relevant language for malware dev, it's nicer to use C when you want to work closely to the operating system. it's fine to use C++ if that's your preference, but do you actually have a good reason for it? there's no reason why you can't just use C. remember, C++ isn't just a superset of C anymore. the standard library, tooling, ecosystem, etc, is all different. even though there's a lot of overlap, the languages are not compatible anymore either, they diverged at some point. again, I worked with both, and they are a very different experience.
also wanted to add, C maps very nicely to assembly, whereas C++ generally doesn't. C++ doesn't even have a stable ABI. IMO that even gets in the way of debugging. C is also nicer for static analysis. like I said somewhere earlier in this thread, it's not a bad idea to start with C to learn low-level concepts, to learn how the OS works, how memory works, etc, etc. IMO C++ gets in the way of that.
>C maps very nicely to assembly
How the frick does anyone still think this? It's been 50 years. Frick off.
if you can expect what the compiler will produce from your C code then I'd say it maps to assembly fairly nicely. don't see what your "It's been 50 years" is meant to imply here. what do you think changed about this?
>Small binary sizes
This isn't 1999 gramps, my 400kb bin is fine with my 20tb c drive. Space is cheap.
there's a reddit meme schift between people looking forthe most 'legit' way to program in low level languages (thanks to gays like Linus), when realistically it actually almost exclusively comes down to just knowledge and skill.
if you so wish, you can program in c++ exactly like you can in C, but with the benefit of additional C++ libraries, and still interface with most of them in C. Dont like OOP, literally just dont use it. It's a workshop full of tools you are free to use and not use. There's a lot more to the language than just classes.
see
for your first reply you can literally just replace c with c++ and re-arange some of the statements about being a superset, and you'd have an identical argument for why "they have no reason not to use c++".
if you've used C to the point that you know what will be generated for the compiler, you could really easily do the same exact thing for c++, unless you're some jeet who cant actually learn more than one complex skill in a single lifetime
no and no.
the post I was replying to was implying it was somehow a bad idea to use C, so yeah I was saying there wasn't any reason not to use C. but in both these replies I have legitimate points on why C is nicer to work with for OS-level applications like for malware dev. I never said not to use C++ for it, but I did say that there's reasons to believe C may be nicer, at least to start out with. the constraints C sets can be useful for learning low level concepts.
and no, C++ is vastly more complex than C is, as well as being higher level. for a lot of language features you can't reasonably expect what the compiler will generate. even learning all the language features there exist in C++, or the standard library, STL, is not reasonable. if you use C++ like browsing a hardware store and picking out useful features when you need them, then you can't expect to know what the compiler will produce.
you're doing the same exact thing, making bad arguments like 'why not use C', like some idiot would about Rust.
learning what the compiler will produce comes down to repetition and experience. The code produced from a loop for example will generally remain consistent, and if worst comes to worst, you can modify the assembly code yourself. If you dont know how something works and you're trying to use it, is it your fault, or the machine? Depending on the compiler and short of some update, the output can be very heavily expected to always be the same. If you cant handle that, then IDK, why not actually sit down and figure out the code you're writing. There are mountains worth of wiki's out there explicitly for this purpose, as well as simply just getting good
>arguments like 'why not use C'
yes and no. like I said, the post I was replying to was implying it was somehow bad to use C, and C++ should be used regardless. that is just not true. but I also gave legitimate points as to why C can be preferred, like having a stable ABI, small footprint which can be preferable like payload injections, working at a low level.
C++ is still evolving like crazy, when you're comparing C++ to C, I'll assume you're talking about all the language features that C++ has over C. there's a lot of them, and they are meant to provide abstractions over C. it's useful to study the compiler output, but it simply doesn't map to assembly the same way as C does. you have to learn how vtables work, and what the lower level implementations might look like when you consider all of the other interactions classes can have in C++. now add templates, there's plenty of features in C++ like that which don't even produce any code yet. metaprogramming will inherently make it more difficult to expect what the compiler may output.
stay mad and cope some more
calling C++ high level compared to C is not a strange take. C++'s entire point is to provide abstractions over C, so naturally it's generally gonna be a higher level language. just because a language compiles down to native code, doesn't mean it's suddenly low-level, or automatically on par with C in that regard. that is a moronic take. I didn't shit on C++, I said multiple times it's fine to use, or even preferable. but I also advocated for why C could be good, because the person I was replying to was under the impression that C was somehow inherently a bad choice over C++. they are both fine.
> muh rust Black person cnile cnile rust cnile
how are you this degenerate? stay mad
c++'s purpose is not to provide abstractions over C, you fricking idiot.
C++ is not built in C, nor is it interpretted in C. The only time C is even remotely involved is in the syntax
You're right about the ABI, but this comes down to a lack of enforcement upon the C++ standard. If someone so wished they could make their own C compiler and totally write out some microsoft tier bullshit as well. The programmer sets their own standard for their program - the structure, the design, etc. All I can say about the bad ABI is that it will probably either be the language's undoing, or lead to there eventually being one. It doesnt come about unless people are actually trying to solve the problem, though, so... gfy Black person
>C++'s purpose is not to provide abstractions over C, you fricking idiot.
I sincerely hope that you're just trolling by being intentionally obtuse. It's literally in the fricking name. It was quite literally called "C with classes" at some point. The whole design philosophy behind C++'s language features is by providing low-cost abstractions. People can not seriously go from from "it's just C but with additional features at your disposal" to "C is only related to C++ by syntax." Some of the dumbest shit I've read on IQfy, that says a lot.
>duh marketing ploy means it da troof
yes, the language was originally a modification of C with classes tacked on. More features were added, and the implenetation kept changing until ultimately it became something else entirely. The language is very clearly not all about classes anymore, and there are tools that allow for high level as well as low level implentations of whatever you're trying to achieve.
you being deeply moronic is not my problem, only thing I can suggest is maybe googling 'does cpp involve c in any of its processes (besides syntax)?'
you've done nothing but constantly slap your dick on the wall about C, complaining about why everyone should just use C because 'there's no reason not to', never mind that the reasoning for why this is, comes down to 'because you say so.'
My conclusion? It's a nice language, use it if you want. There's effective documentation for both languages, and it's easy to get acquainted with both, unless you're just some brown moron (you) who has no identity outside of the language that has had the misfortune of being entangled in your inhibitive case of autism
>complaining about why everyone should just use C
I never did this, I stated multiple times already that they're both fine languages, and C++ can also be preferable in many situations. you have the reading comprehension skills of a 4 year old
I also never stated that C++ can't be used for low-level tasks, or that C++ never diverged into a different language. I already went over all those things you just redundantly brought up. I only said it's not a weird take to say that C++ is generally higher level than C, because the design premise is to add abstractions upon C. I never said the languages are the same now, quite the opposite in fact, but that doesn't change what I said.
> muh fricking cnile you make your entire identity C because you advocated for C++ but also C fricking cnile cnile ahh nghhh cnile Black person cnile cnile cnile
some people come to IQfy to state their opinions anonymously, other people (like you) come to IQfy so they can be a moron without being publicly humiliated. you're clearly a lost cause.
c++ is not an abstraction of C no matter how much you insist otherwise, c++ being higher level exclusively refers to the entirely optional higher level tools that it provides (EG: smart pointers) rather than any supposed abstraction overtop C.
you really are either just flagrantly moronic or completely lying if you still claim to know jack shit about C++ while saying the same crap over and over. Still working through that CS degree? Maybe crack open google or ask chat.jeetpt for some basic fricking facts
you're so fricking dense. I'm gonna stop wasting my time on this shit. no need in being redundant, read what was actually being said on the thread or some shit. you're just arguing with yourself at this point.
>follow what's actually being said
yeah, instead of screeching about being as 'cnile' as the ghosts screaming in your head claim you to be.
What a moronic take.. you are a huge homosexual and not worth my time at all
Kys urgently
if you're calling c++ a 'high level language' while comparing it to C, then it's clear you dont have a clue what you're talking about. It's technically true that it is 'high level', but only because it offers the potential for high level programming. Simultaneously it offers much more low level functionality, outputting code straight to assembly.
if you didnt know this then you again dont know what you're talking about, probably because you're the c equivalent of a Rust Black person, adopting the langauge as some sort of identity and shitting on every other language ultimately just for that reason
Ignore him he must be either a kid or mentally disabled
I will say one cool program that is written in c is postgres and i cant take that away from you
try x86 asm using SMI instructions. those are ring -2. although im not sure if anyone still uses that technique anymore
hump
>maldev why?
You just are spending your precious time on earth digging away at pajeet bugs, for what? Who cares? It will get fixed and you complicated malware will be obsolete forever, try building something instead
maldev is fun, make software do what you want, not what pajeets want
don't post this kind of shit on public websites. hope you're paying for a vpn otherwise you're already on a watch list
where do you think you are?
Like vpn providers are not willing to give up logs to authorities if needed.
Honestly both c and cpp are nice and cool languages but if im being honest i would be more comfortable shipping cpp rather than c just for being less obscure and being easier to find info about edge cases, or is it the other way around?
both languages have a shitload of documentation, it purely comes down to your choice and whatever you feel most comfortable with. Either is just as capable as the other
>pillow
GIWTWM
read Black hat Go
Go is a new language so antiviruses aren't so good against it
and it is good for such task
https://www.amazon.com/Black-Hat-Go-Programming-Pentesters/dp/1593278659
this one, you can pirate it for free
as long as it compiles to native binary it's good for malware, don't think too much about it
start with the greeks
THIS! SO MUCH THIS!
OP:
read (clap)
the (clap)
greeks! (clap)
Please tell me that's just a flatchested girl. I don't want to be a gay
It's a drawing, anon. It can be whatever you want it to be.
clearly not anon, says his name is Dylan right there.
And yes Dylan, it is a girl
wow everyone itt is retared
write fuzzing software and target networking and file i/o related functions. it's perfectly fine to start without a "toolbox" of techniques to use, because you will learn along the way, and actual sold exploits that get used in larger chains of other exploits don't have to be a complete solution
this is LEGAL btw. exploit dev is LEGAL, the ACTION of breaking into other people's computer systems is ILLEGAL.
i do not care. I have done some illegal shit before. Whatever.
I look like that!
download winapi docs, you will be surprised with the cool things you can do
1. stop being a zoophile
2. stop being homosexual
Bet that ball of hair near the exit has a certain aroma most find undesireable.
Learn C -> Learn Win API -> Write software for malicious purposes. Congrats, you've learned maldev.
Upgrade your skills and then learn pascal, and only write malware in that.
Or, for even more hilarity, write your malware in python and wonder why it gets by EDRs.
Are you trying to get a job at Microsoft?