one of the most acephalous myths

When and who started the myth that samurai were supposedly different (racially) from the Japanese masses? Naturally we can argue that elites can be different, but not on a "racial" level. I feel like a lot of this comes from Jomon hero fanfic, something like the Tocharians and their supposed involvement/creation of the first Chinese dynasties.

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  1. 1 month ago
    Radiochan

    this seems to be something racists from IQfy made up, I'm not aware of this necessarily in Japanese media

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      reddit

  2. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    I'm sure this comes from some older films, they generally cast actors with slightly less oriental features. (although still yayoi).
    but the very issue of jomon substitution is exaggerated, it is a misinterpreted myth

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      Jomon myth?

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      Haplogroup D in Japan is of Ainu origin.
      The theory that the Samurai class originated with Ainu warriors used by Yayoi rulers isn't as dumb as it looks.

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        Idk dude thats a weird halpogroup. Wtf is that in tibet?! Looks like wrong samples

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          Tibetans and Ainu are a very ancient branch of Paleo East Asians
          Very early west Eurasians migrated through India and into Asia, displacing them on the Y chromosome and creating the East Asian race outside of Tibet, Mongolia and the Japanese islands

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            ?
            >Tibet, Mongolia and the Japanese islands
            All of these places have really different culture from the rest of asians

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            Yes? And? The same thing with the Eurochads.
            In all fairness, China was like the Rome of East Asia so they profoundly influenced all their surrounding settled neighbors, I don't know how much of that we can chalk up to racial differences
            It is pretty funny that technically the mainland East Asians are descended from a west Eurasian male lineage though
            I always thought Finns were chineses but the truth is they were white men who took made a big long loop through Asia before coming home

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            Han Chinese are O3 and Finns are N.

            What are you even talking about you dumb pigskin?

            O3 is an East Asian male lineage. N is also East Asian origin.

            https://i.imgur.com/EFjL7HH.jpeg

            When and who started the myth that samurai were supposedly different (racially) from the Japanese masses? Naturally we can argue that elites can be different, but not on a "racial" level. I feel like a lot of this comes from Jomon hero fanfic, something like the Tocharians and their supposed involvement/creation of the first Chinese dynasties.

            The Tarim mummies have nothing to do with Tocharians.

            Tarim mummies are basal ANE remnants from before 1000 BC, Tocharians are Indo European speakers (Afanasievo descendents ) whose language appeared over 1000 users after the Tarim mummies in the first millennium AD.

            Afanasievo are totally unrelated to Tarim mummies.

            Tocharians didn't even live next to the first Chinese dynasties.

            Tarim mummies didn't found them either.

            The Xia, Shang and Zhou were indigenous Hua (Han) and the Shang and Zhou regularly human sacrificed caucasoid Indo Europeans they captured in wars against the Xirong barbarians in Gansu.

            The only caucasoid skull found in Shang dynasty sites was a human sacrifice victim.

            DNA tests of 3000 year old remains of Shang and Zhou nobles at Hengbei showed they were all Mongoloids with Han specific haplogroups of O3 and Q1a1 .

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            There are two types of morons, those who put words in people's mouths and those who don't know how to interpret anything.
            >The Tarim mummies have nothing to do with Tocharians.
            I never said I had it.
            >Tarim mummies are basal ANE remnants from before 1000 BC, >Tocharians are Indo European speakers (Afanasievo descendants) whose language appeared over 1000 users after the Tarim mummies in the first millennium AD.
            who cares? I didn't even vaguely touch on these things, I didn't mention tarim mummies or anything else. straw man.
            >Afanasievo are totally unrelated to Tarim mummies.
            Yes, no one said that.
            >Tocharians didn't even live next to the first Chinese dynasties.
            now the moron is starting to think like a human being, read my statement again, it is clearly a prescription for what they say.
            >Tarim mummies didn't find them either.
            the same useless topic that no one said. Do you want to look smart?
            >The Xia, Shang and Zhou were indigenous Hua (Han) and the Shang and Zhou regularly human sacrificed Caucasoid Indo Europeans they captured in wars against the Xirong barbarians in Gansu.
            who asked? It's not the topic of the topic, it's not about IE. but I think you obviously had to include Caucasoid.
            >The only Caucasoid skull found in Shang dynasty sites was a human sacrifice victim.
            same as above.. who is this relevant to? It's not the topic of my topic and I didn't say anything.
            >DNA tests of 3000 year old remains of Shang and Zhou nobles at Hengbei showed they were all Mongoloids with Han specific haplogroups of O3 and Q1a1.
            and paleontological studies suggest that members of the archossaria had parental care. to mention something relevant

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        Reminder that Sentilise Islanders are the purest Haplogroup D inhabitants on the planet.

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          Probably but it means nothing. Recently the most basal branch of haplogroup D was discovered in Yemen and it's safe to say they don't descend from Andamanese.

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        yes, but Ainu descends from Jomon.
        They are the "purest" remaining Jomon descendants, as far as I know.

        Hayato, Azumi are Austronesians. Are they still around..? Ryukyuans descended from them correctly.
        The Austronesians can actually live harmoniously with the Jomon, it's the Yayoi who are genocidal AF.

        Recent immigration is there, sure, but it has come from the northeastern parts of China, while Vietnam has a lot of Southeast Asia that Japan doesn't have. Japan originates in the Tungusian/Siberian Ultraarctic Circle.

        Schizo

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          No. Ryukyuans are Japanese and were not connected to Yamato until recently. I think the Austronesian Hayato/Azumi theory is flawed because the Taiwanese aborigines, unlike other Austronesians, were afraid of open water.

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          Muh schizo
          > The distribution of Y-DNA haplogroup D in Tibet, Andaman, and Japan is a result of historical migration patterns and population movements. Haplogroup D is one of the Y-chromosome haplogroups, which are passed down from father to son. The presence of haplogroup D in these specific regions likely reflects the ancient migration of populations from Central Asia and East Asia.

          >In the case of Tibet, the presence of haplogroup D may be linked to the migration of ancestral populations from Central Asia and the Tibetan Plateau. In the Andaman Islands, the presence of haplogroup D may be connected to the early settlement of the islands by ancient populations. In Japan, the distribution of haplogroup D may be attributed to the migration of ancestral populations from the Asian mainland to the Japanese archipelago

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            https://i.imgur.com/PfNhp1h.png

            Haplogroup D in Japan is of Ainu origin.
            The theory that the Samurai class originated with Ainu warriors used by Yayoi rulers isn't as dumb as it looks.

            Sameflag
            whatever.

            I just know the Jomon are either Qin migrants and the Yayoi might be Han migrants full off.

            There's also the theory that Yayoi are all korean, which doesn't make sense to me, but Korean history is full of frick.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      Kinda funny how two of these guys look like Hikaru Nakamura, who is half-Japanese and half-"caucasian". It's almost as if the native Ainus resemble Hapas more than full-blooded Japanese.

      T: my wifes are japonese

  3. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    Ainu are indigenous only to Hokkaido, their ancestors were the Jomons, who are also ancestors of the Japanese, the Japanese are basically mixed Jomons and Yayoi in Honshu. Jomons contributed their religious beliefs and warrior culture, you often see bearded samurai similar to them. these Yamato people conquered the Emishis, who were Jomon from northern Honshu that had not yet been conquered. so the last pure Jomons are those Ainu who were conquered later. But again the blood of the original inhabitants is also within their conquerors.

    you also have the populations of the Ryukyu Islands, like Okinawa, which were apparently similar populations but with darker skin

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      the real japanese are yamato, okinawans are from the same family and they dont look like your ''yayoi''
      koreans are something else, probably from around manchuria

      • 1 month ago
        Radiochan

        The Emperor Emeritus has publicly stated that the Imperial House is descended from Koreans and modern scholarship originates Shinto from the practices of shamanistic Manchurian tribes.

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          I don't take women's opinions and their arguments seriously. I'm sorry.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      Interesting. That could explain why the Ryukyu have a Japonic language that's not a daughter language of mainland Japanese while being mostly Jomon while the Ainu are also mostly Jomon yet their language is not from the Japonic family at all.

      Ryukuan/okinawan are literally migrants from southern China.

      The Jomon themselves are mixed among the first Chinese migrants to Japan x indecent (Ebisu, shrimp people).

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        Recent immigration is there, sure, but it has come from the northeastern parts of China, while Vietnam has a lot of Southeast Asia that Japan doesn't have. Japan originates in the Tungusian/Siberian Ultraarctic Circle.

  4. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    I'm more interest in the samurai Yasuke

  5. 1 month ago
    Anonymous

    One thing that's hard to understand is how Jomon y-dna is prevalent while Jomon autosomal DNA is just around 15% of the Japanese gene pool. That kind of discrepancy would normally indicate Jomons are the origin of the Japanese elite. However, Yayois are usually seen as conquerors rather than conquered people. There are some clues that might ultimately explain the discrepancy. For example it seems the southern part of Korea had speakers of Japonic languages. Also the Emishi clan heads that accepted Yamato rule seem to have been given high ranking positions in the new order.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      This is pretty outdated though. Japanese descend from the Jomonic Yayoi of the Korean peninsula primarily who disappeared from there and were replaced by Koreans.
      Japanese are generally about 100% Yayoi except in the far northeast of Japan.

      • 1 month ago
        Anonymous

        >Jomonic Yayoi.

        Explain.

        Also we still have papers from 2023 giving a 10 to 20% range of Jomon autosomal DNA in modern Japanese so I don't see how this would be outdated. https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S2589004223002079

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          https://doi.org/10.1016/j.cub.2022.06.004
          this is IIRC not the only paper on it but quick TL;DR
          >Korean peninsula is Jomonoid in genetic characteristics(including haplogroup D) during the transition from the Mesolithic to the Neolithic which brought East Asian Neolithic admixture
          >the Yayoi genotype forms in the southern parts of the Korean peninsula as a mix of typical East Asian Neolithic ancestry mixed with local Jomonoid ancestry eg. it is identical to the Japanese in every respect
          >Japanese-like Yayoi sweep across Japan replacing the Jomon genotype with their own
          >Japanese-like Yayoi in Korea in turn get swept by another wave of typical East Asian admixture from China although they retain traces of Yayoi in their genotypes
          Japanese race autists aren't going to acknowledge these results because they generally don't understand genetics beyond haplogroup maps and secondly it's somewhat humiliating for the Japanese to be from Iron Age Korea which they only grudgingly accepted because they though they still had significant indigenous admixture instead of Jomonoid Korean.

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            Interesting. That could explain why the Ryukyu have a Japonic language that's not a daughter language of mainland Japanese while being mostly Jomon while the Ainu are also mostly Jomon yet their language is not from the Japonic family at all.

        • 1 month ago
          Anonymous

          https://doi.org/10.1016/j.cub.2022.06.004
          this is IIRC not the only paper on it but quick TL;DR
          >Korean peninsula is Jomonoid in genetic characteristics(including haplogroup D) during the transition from the Mesolithic to the Neolithic which brought East Asian Neolithic admixture
          >the Yayoi genotype forms in the southern parts of the Korean peninsula as a mix of typical East Asian Neolithic ancestry mixed with local Jomonoid ancestry eg. it is identical to the Japanese in every respect
          >Japanese-like Yayoi sweep across Japan replacing the Jomon genotype with their own
          >Japanese-like Yayoi in Korea in turn get swept by another wave of typical East Asian admixture from China although they retain traces of Yayoi in their genotypes
          Japanese race autists aren't going to acknowledge these results because they generally don't understand genetics beyond haplogroup maps and secondly it's somewhat humiliating for the Japanese to be from Iron Age Korea which they only grudgingly accepted because they though they still had significant indigenous admixture instead of Jomonoid Korean.

          I do not understand

          • 1 month ago
            Anonymous

            This guy:

            One thing that's hard to understand is how Jomon y-dna is prevalent while Jomon autosomal DNA is just around 15% of the Japanese gene pool. That kind of discrepancy would normally indicate Jomons are the origin of the Japanese elite. However, Yayois are usually seen as conquerors rather than conquered people. There are some clues that might ultimately explain the discrepancy. For example it seems the southern part of Korea had speakers of Japonic languages. Also the Emishi clan heads that accepted Yamato rule seem to have been given high ranking positions in the new order.

            Get BTFO to this one:

            https://doi.org/10.1016/j.cub.2022.06.004
            this is IIRC not the only paper on it but quick TL;DR
            >Korean peninsula is Jomonoid in genetic characteristics(including haplogroup D) during the transition from the Mesolithic to the Neolithic which brought East Asian Neolithic admixture
            >the Yayoi genotype forms in the southern parts of the Korean peninsula as a mix of typical East Asian Neolithic ancestry mixed with local Jomonoid ancestry eg. it is identical to the Japanese in every respect
            >Japanese-like Yayoi sweep across Japan replacing the Jomon genotype with their own
            >Japanese-like Yayoi in Korea in turn get swept by another wave of typical East Asian admixture from China although they retain traces of Yayoi in their genotypes
            Japanese race autists aren't going to acknowledge these results because they generally don't understand genetics beyond haplogroup maps and secondly it's somewhat humiliating for the Japanese to be from Iron Age Korea which they only grudgingly accepted because they though they still had significant indigenous admixture instead of Jomonoid Korean.

    • 1 month ago
      Anonymous

      >Emishi clan heads that accepted Yamato rule seem to have been given high ranking positions in the new order.
      They somewhat decently relate to Manchus.

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