The answer is "because powershell doesn't get shit done".
2 years ago
Anonymous
The answer is "because you're too moronic to get shit done in powershell".
2 years ago
Anonymous
basically this. anons complaining it's "too verbose" don't know that with some parameters you don't need to type a parameter value, and so many commands have an alias to shorten whatever you're writing even more. it's all just >powershit bad because durgasoft bad
levels of thinking, and so anons complain about something they've never even used while pretending like they have.
try running python script. >jax error blah blah blah
install cmake >cmake is not a recognized comand blah blah blah
also that setgroup policy etc is very verbose for no reason
like check this random page i found
https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/powershell/module/grouppolicy/set-gppermission?view=windowsserver2022-ps
bash is simpler and it gets the job done either way
why do you even need to limit the uses of wildcards for example?
i nean just look at this
Set-GPPermission -Name TestGpo -TargetName "Domain Users" -TargetType Group -PermissionLevel GpoRead
from the link above.
What is all this?
in bash its just
sudo usermod -aG GpoRead TestGpo
or something like that. But whatever it might be is saner than that mess.
2 years ago
Anonymous
turn off your unix brain tumor for one second and consider the readability/clarity and uniformity of the two commands.
2 years ago
Anonymous
rememberability > readability
2 years ago
Anonymous
I fail to see anything wrong with that at all in terms of, like this other anon said there, readability and understanding at a glance.
That's part of the beauty of the noun verb structure of Powershell.
I get that the other command is shorter, but it's that kind of thinking that makes things like passwd to save a few characters and have something that is dumb.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Shells are primarily used interactively. Most commands are never going to be read again after they're run, so it makes sense to optimize for terseness.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>Shells are primarily used interactively. Most commands are never going to be read again after they're run, so it makes sense to optimize for terseness.
Wrong. And if you are writing commands so frequently that saving a few characters here and there makes any difference, then you should be automating those tasks.
2 years ago
Anonymous
the mess is the bottom one tho? saner, really?
what does a and G stand for?
GpoRead vs TestGpo... why is the order different? Why are they positional commands with no clue as to what they mean?
why is a command named "usermod" dealing with GP permissions? that's not clear from the name either. why is it so difficult to be clear and uniform for anything related to shell?
2 years ago
Anonymous
Well G stands for group.
Also in shell, you can just add the -h or --help flag and it'll show you a list of flags if you're lucky you can type man before the command and it'll show a hole manual right there on the terminal. I don't even have to memorize anything.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>Well G stands for group.
Ah, great, I'll put in g for group then, that's good to know.
So for help it seems the same as Powershell then, minus the -examples probably
2 years ago
Anonymous
Okay, let's say I read the man page for usermod. Does any of that knowledge carry over to a different command? In powershell it does, beccause cmdlets share objects and parameters based on WHAT THEY DO, because each command is not a special snowflake that wants its own single letter flags to feel special.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>filtered by arguments
wingoy, i...
2 years ago
Anonymous
>man makes me a man!
just cheap thrills. You know it doesn't have to be this way but you revel in the fact that you can feel special knowing all of that nonsense.
In a sane operating system, the manual is unnecessary for anything but actually modifying or working with system internals.
2 years ago
Anonymous
you sound upset, anon. sure you don't need to Get-Help?
2 years ago
Anonymous
It's straightforward.
You have permissions ranging from 444 to 777.
You have usermod for making groups and users. You have chmod for changing permissions. you have chown for allowing users permissions to files or folders. Some flags also translate to different commands like the -R flag which stands for recursive, which applies to every file in a folder. It just clicks.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>Some flags also translate to different commands like the -R flag which stands for recursive, which applies to every file in a folder. It just clicks.
Cool! -r I get it, I will use that.
The numbers also make sense now, the farther you get from the number 444 but not over 777 the less restrictive the permissions get. So 683 is pretty loose.
2 years ago
Anonymous
well, the first number is an administrator then the group that has been assigned to the folder or directory and the last one is all users.
0 being the most restrictive and 7 being the most lose and the numbers in between well... I haven't thought about it much. Anyways yeah the most restrictive is 0, not 4. I just set the ssh keys to 444 and the regular files to 755 and call it a day.
2 years ago
Anonymous
But you're not going to question why it's in this arbitrary range of 0 to 7? or why it's separated into 3 digits? And why you have to memorize that? You ever think about that?
2 years ago
Anonymous
You're out of your mind? In what WORLD does it "just click", if you're reading the manual page for every single command you ever have to use? You're just retroactively making up "connections" and "similarities" after having spent the time learning all of that bullshit.
I am willing to bet millions of dollars that people would find powershell much more intuitive than bash if they started learning from scratch and were only taught the basics like how to use the help system.
you sound upset, anon. sure you don't need to Get-Help?
"man 2 sbrk" is all I need to say on that.
>Some flags also translate to different commands like the -R flag which stands for recursive, which applies to every file in a folder. It just clicks.
Cool! -r I get it, I will use that.
The numbers also make sense now, the farther you get from the number 444 but not over 777 the less restrictive the permissions get. So 683 is pretty loose.
the permissions system is in octal for no reason other than "historical", and they just accept it, then they start claiming its "intuitive". These guys can't be helped.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>if they started learning from scratch
breaking news: microsoft product is superior in extremely contrived circumstance
2 years ago
Anonymous
Unfortunately, it's still superior despite not being intuitive to brain damaged bash users. And I don't have to give any evidence for that, you can just look at the industry usage yourself. But you're not aware of that, as you're unemployed.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>But you're not aware of that, as you're unemployed.
i've worked for longer than most of IQfy has been alive. not once have i ever seen powershell used for anything but windows server admin. ever.
it's a bizarre middle ground meme language nobody asked for
take your L, jeet
2 years ago
Anonymous
>not once have i ever seen powershell used for anything but windows server admin. ever.
Worked for over 10 years but won't say what you do LOL. Javascript? "backend engineer"? You realize the reason this thread exists on IQfy right now is because the usage of powershell has grown so much over the past few years? >nobody asked for
MS doesn't have to ask anyone when they want to make something. Just admit your neoplasticity is too low to learn something new and move on homosexual.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>Javascript? "backend engineer"?
projecting webshit, classic >You realize the reason this thread exists on IQfy right now is because the usage of powershell has grown so much over the past few years?
this thread exists on IQfy because only autists care about it
2 years ago
Anonymous
>still doesn't say what he does
LMAO, the only webshit here is you.
OP is very likely not an autist, he's just asking the autists on this board what they think of powershell. And based on his posts he's just trying to get his job done.
2 years ago
Anonymous
no, literally no one asked for it. the person who created it almost got fired because he was supposed to be working on something else.
PS provides 0 benefits and only makes sense to use if you work for a microsoft cuck org that shells out obscene money to be locked into the microsoft ecosystem.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>almost got fired
yeah that's typical MS. At least they didn't shut it down
>PS provides 0 benefits
That's false. The biggest benefit is unfricking your brain from unix anti-design and nonsense...
2 years ago
Anonymous
yes, unfrick your brain by blending it up and pouring it into the toilet
it's just another microsoft embrace and extinguish project that's just unfamiliar enough from what's sane so if you happen to invest time and money into it, it's expensive to move away from it.
It's a shitshow that locks you further into Microsoft's .NET ecosystem
2 years ago
Anonymous
>just unfamiliar enough from what's sane
let me correct you, it's "unfamiliar enough from what's insane". Its hilarious how much it makes you struggle.
Also, you DO know that both powershell and .NET are OSS under MIT? And that it's on Linux/macOS as well? What "lock" are you talking about?
Shells are primarily used interactively. Most commands are never going to be read again after they're run, so it makes sense to optimize for terseness.
That's what fricking aliases are for. Why frick up the shell language directly when you can just alias for quick typing in interactive, and still have readable scripts. That's what powershell does.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>Install Microsoft™ Windows® >"disable" Cortana®, targeted adds >remove Xbox® Live, Xbox® Console App, Roblox, misc zogware >restart computer >open Edge®, download literally any other browser >>shit still opens with Edge® even though it's not your default (Are You Sure You Don't Want To Try eDGE(R)?) >restart computer >disable Search® with Bing® >restart computer >download "git" >checkout rn, commit n >install Linux application for Windows™ >work
$0.50 has been deposited into your Microsoft™ Mixed Reality Portal® account
2 years ago
Anonymous
What does that have to do with Unix anti-design vs NT design and Powershell design
I know the current state of Windows is fricked but that's not relevant to the fundamental design and its influence on your thought patterns and understanding.
2 years ago
Anonymous
QRD on NT?
2 years ago
Anonymous
NT gets most of its design from an earlier project that Dave Cutler, it's lead designer did at Digital Equipment Corporation, called OpenVMS. It's was a hybrid kernel design (mixed monolithic and microkernel) that was object-based, written entirely in a high level language (at the time, C was the best) and had an abstraction layer for easy porting to new platforms. NT wasn't even developed on x86 at first, it was ported to it later.
And they also wanted to support multiple application APIs. Win32, POSIX, OS/2 were the original targets, but they cut off OS/2 later.
Cutler wanted NT to be a complete inversion of everything that characterizes Unix. He hated it and its ASCII text streams. Made everything a API that passed structured data (objects). And made IO asychronous. In NT it's called IRPs (I/O Request Packets) that are sent between drivers and kernel subsystems.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>Made everything a API that passed structured data (objects)
This is probably my biggest pet-peeve coming from Linux and >He hated it and its ASCII text streams
explains it well.
Like absolutely the info you get from running a cmdlet is great ime, but doing anything with it requires so many extra steps to prepare the input and output streams before piping them together - meaning more objects and more manipulation to get working. Granted, I have about 2 weeks cumulative experience with Powershell.
So In your defense, when you don't have to manipulate those datastreams to get a result, the result is usually hella clean and you'd need 10x the lines in bash to get the same quality. I need to figure out how PS pops up the status bar when I run Update-Help.
>OpenVMS
I've heard legends. My first job ever was upgrading a Java applet served from an Itanium server running OpenVMS.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>meaning more objects and more manipulation to get working.
It can get a bit annoying at times to fish out the actual property containing the data you want from the resulting object of a cmdlet but its a small price to pay and when you accomplish a lot of shit using objects like you said it's really nice.
>I need to figure out how PS pops up the status bar when I run Update-Help.
https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/powershell/module/microsoft.powershell.utility/write-progress?view=powershell-7.2
>I've heard legends. My first job ever was upgrading a Java applet served from an Itanium server running OpenVMS.
Early years with DEC Alpha, Itanium, x64, Win2k, OpenVMS were wild. Windows NT was actually PORTED to DEC Alpha, and did you know that the first 64-bit Windows was XP ported to Itanium? Not x64!
2 years ago
Anonymous
No, I need ncurses for Powershell. >There's a cmdlet for it
Because of course there is.
I mean enough can be done without where I'm from, and all that info you get it straight from files on *nix, which are rarely other than text, run 'em if they 'aint.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>the first 64-bit Windows was XP ported to Itanium?
Ackshually, the first 64-bit Windows was 2000, ported to Alpha AXP. It didn't see a release however (because Microsoft dropped support for DEC) - there was also a (very hobbled) Windows 2000 for Itanium out there somewhere.
But the first 64-bit version to actually see release was Windows XP for Itanium, yes, beating out the AMD64 version (which was based on Windows Server 2003, not XP itself) by about four months.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Is unfortunate that this solid design is doomed to be tied to current Windows forever.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Windows is not that bad if you're a user.
It's just kind of intrusive is all.
Like what are these updates for anyways that they need to be forced or these random installations?
Also if you could customize it it'd be cool.
I think the problem with PowerShell is that is not designed with separate tools in mind. They try to fit in everything in one line and it's a mess. Also like I keep going back that example. Each flag had like 6 ok a parameters or whatchamu call it. A flag should just be a flag that can be combined with different flags.
Also in that command I posted a for loop and an if statement were used just to change a groups permissions. That's bad. You should need to put in code logic just to do something like that in my opinion.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>It's just kind of intrusive is all.
It literally deletes problematic files now.
We all know where that's going.
2 years ago
Anonymous
I was forced to write a firewall update script that could work over ssh becuase our old boomer tech lead hosts a server on iis, windows. The word "forced" is key here, it's really an unpleasant shell experience as compared with bash and even bash has room for improvement in my opinion.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>permissions ranging from 444 to 777
what the bloody frick are you talking about?
2 years ago
Anonymous
I corrected and said ranging from 0 to 7
Give me some slack I'm not a sys admin
2 years ago
Anonymous
>I just set the permissions on a share using gnuleenux
Real world. I just set the correct gpo permissions for a change necessary for 30,000 users by taking an extra 3 seconds to tab complete a command
>Looks like someone slapped Python and C# together
that's what i thought because powershell's syntax is so similar to python's syntax and i don't know about the C#.
can you elaborate on the similarities between C# and powershell?
These PowerShell threads are hilarious because it becomes obvious real quick how few people on g have an actual real job.
PowerShell is amazing for windows/azure/Microsoft 365 admins. I use to quite a bit even for personal scripts at home on my windows laptop.
it's useful I guess. Very opinionated. Dotnet integration is actually pretty cool. Does it do anything, really, what I wouldn't rather do with something else? Nope.
windows administration is a job for indians you should be ashamed. you'll actually learn, if you do progress further in your career beyond password resets and kibana, that powershell is terribly bloated - it is mediocre at solving any task. Simple file manipulations/ rest? just use bash thru git bash. Anything more complex than that? Should be in a docker image and use a real more powerful compiled language... or really even python or go .
The only time I use powershell at work is startup scripts with terraform to configure my windows VMs initially but that's because I'm lazy and didn't create a custom image.
I'm really thankful for Powershell. Until it came along, there was a constant stream of OOP-brains complaining about Unix byte streams and saying how it'd be "so much better" if pipes were based on objects instead.
Now there's finally a concrete example of why that idea fricking sucks. Finally. They made that sacrifice so others don't have to. It's like getting to trot out real labview programs whenever someone tries to start up the no code meme again.
I don't like the rare occasion where it unwraps an array of a single object into just an object and fricks over some code of mine expecting an array, but it's easy enough to prevent by using more explicit declarations
i mean honestly whoever that was just not doing a good enough job tbh.
If they make windows development enviroment better itll bring back developers that shouldnt be using a mac in the first place.
Imagine dilbert using a mac lol, like yeah that was his first choice.
Which one of those options in the Not Supported section are generally useful/are used on a normal basis? I think they were kinda lazy but they must have had some reason to not implement everything.
2 years ago
Anonymous
GSSAPIAuthentication is based
Probably KerberosAuthentication too
I mean I just showed the first example of that link I posted earlier it gets worse
Get-GPO -All | ForEach-Object { if($_ | Get-GPPermission -TargetName "Marketing Admins" -TargetType Group -ErrorAction SilentlyContinue) {$_ | Set-GPPermission -Replace -PermissionLevel GpoApply -TargetName "Marketing Admins" -TargetType Group }}
That is to change to "Replace the permission level of a security group for all GPOs on which the group has permissions"
See this stuff snowballs out of control fast.
Well I don't know exactly how you'd go about doing that in linux. But I guess something like
usermod or chown or something.
If you're involved in admin-tasks for MS WIndows based servers and workstations it's pretty much a must to know. Also important to have a decent understanding of it if you're into malware (maldoc) analysis and general security. Additionally is an interesting concept where, unlike *nix like scripting languages, your output is not text but objects which requires some getting used to if you're coming from/accustomed to *nix environments.
tl;dr
Powershell is a must if you do anything with Windows based system.
I found command discoverability and reuse of previously learned commands hard. In posix shells once I learn awk, sed and etc I can adapt to almost any problem.
It's dogshit. It has a bug on my PC where it doesn't open it on some paths with spaces in the name. Yes, M$IT can't do proper string escaping circa 2022.
to be fair... no one can. Windows is pure shit and powerhell just adds more ways to get cases where what you wrote is not what the cmdlet sees.
Combine that with over 9000 ways to write a valid path that gets treated differently by some C(++) win32 runtime that every application calls inconsistently and you got more shit.
I remember even invoking cmdlet batch scripts is inconsistent because cmd DOT exe is moronic and has its own incompatible command line parsing than powershell's and cmd DOT exe's invocation of binaries of course adds even MORE inconsistency.
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go frick yourself hiromoot you dumb Black person. >hurr your string contains cmd DOT exe that means its malware
it's just yet another inconsistent shit on top of shit. Only thing good about it is most winshitter admins don't know how it works so you can use it to do shit like modify USER registry values. I wouldn't even use it if it weren't for my work computer being a shitty cuck box without admin.
if powershell doesn't make sense you should find a new career; if there's only one thing it's good at (and there might be), it's letting noobs read and write a mostly human legible, one size fits all scripting language
>use dos device path since it's the only nonshit way to path in windows without a million caveats >Path not found: '"Microsoft.PowerShell.CoreFilesystem::\.C:mypathhere"'
I've used bash all my life but I imagine that I will have to learn some Powershell for my new jobs (InfoSec analyst and network vulnerability assessor)
I only interact with it for scripting/automation purposes. It's good for that (as I imagine that's primarily what it was designed for). I'd never use it as an actual daily driver terminal.
It's not the same as bash so I don't see why people compare them. Bash is for lazy fricks that want to stay in the terminal and automate their day to day crap very easily and quickly, or just hack shit together because they're too lazy to do it properly. It's a way to solve problems of any kind quickly.
Powershell is for modifying the system and automating a few things here and there. It's a way to solve problems relating to the OS quickly.
I have some weird hotkeys for my mouse in bash that do different things depending on the application. It does what it needs to instantly. I tried doing that in Powershell and quickly figured out that is not what Powershell is meant for. The startup time alone was just too much.
Yes bash is significantly better in almost every way, but they are different tools. It's like saying a jackhammer is better than a hammer.
If you like it, that's fine. You do you.
Oh ok then, anyone else wanted to share their opinion on powershell?
Everyone has different tastes
Best shell ever. BTFOs cmd/batch and all unix shells (bash, sh, csh, fish, zsh, etc.)
Is that why I always install bash terminals on my windows first thing now?
No you just don't want to learn powershell, that's all.
The answer is "because powershell doesn't get shit done".
The answer is "because you're too moronic to get shit done in powershell".
basically this. anons complaining it's "too verbose" don't know that with some parameters you don't need to type a parameter value, and so many commands have an alias to shorten whatever you're writing even more. it's all just
>powershit bad because durgasoft bad
levels of thinking, and so anons complain about something they've never even used while pretending like they have.
No, it's because you're a moron.
Fricking moron.
That's simply because you're a freetard.
I used it to automate half of my job
cmdlets BTFO
heh
try running python script.
>jax error blah blah blah
install cmake
>cmake is not a recognized comand blah blah blah
also that setgroup policy etc is very verbose for no reason
like check this random page i found
https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/powershell/module/grouppolicy/set-gppermission?view=windowsserver2022-ps
bash is simpler and it gets the job done either way
why do you even need to limit the uses of wildcards for example?
Bash is incompatible with how Windows is architected. Works for "simple" and $free$ *nix OSes but not Windows.
It's great! If you do any kind of sys admin work with windows.
Do you have any questions?
okay. Why do you need to limit the usage of wildcards?
>okay. Why do you need to limit the usage of wildcards?
For properties or? I would need more context.
i nean just look at this
Set-GPPermission -Name TestGpo -TargetName "Domain Users" -TargetType Group -PermissionLevel GpoRead
from the link above.
What is all this?
in bash its just
sudo usermod -aG GpoRead TestGpo
or something like that. But whatever it might be is saner than that mess.
turn off your unix brain tumor for one second and consider the readability/clarity and uniformity of the two commands.
rememberability > readability
I fail to see anything wrong with that at all in terms of, like this other anon said there, readability and understanding at a glance.
That's part of the beauty of the noun verb structure of Powershell.
I get that the other command is shorter, but it's that kind of thinking that makes things like passwd to save a few characters and have something that is dumb.
Shells are primarily used interactively. Most commands are never going to be read again after they're run, so it makes sense to optimize for terseness.
>Shells are primarily used interactively. Most commands are never going to be read again after they're run, so it makes sense to optimize for terseness.
Wrong. And if you are writing commands so frequently that saving a few characters here and there makes any difference, then you should be automating those tasks.
the mess is the bottom one tho? saner, really?
what does a and G stand for?
GpoRead vs TestGpo... why is the order different? Why are they positional commands with no clue as to what they mean?
why is a command named "usermod" dealing with GP permissions? that's not clear from the name either. why is it so difficult to be clear and uniform for anything related to shell?
Well G stands for group.
Also in shell, you can just add the -h or --help flag and it'll show you a list of flags if you're lucky you can type man before the command and it'll show a hole manual right there on the terminal. I don't even have to memorize anything.
>Well G stands for group.
Ah, great, I'll put in g for group then, that's good to know.
So for help it seems the same as Powershell then, minus the -examples probably
Okay, let's say I read the man page for usermod. Does any of that knowledge carry over to a different command? In powershell it does, beccause cmdlets share objects and parameters based on WHAT THEY DO, because each command is not a special snowflake that wants its own single letter flags to feel special.
>filtered by arguments
wingoy, i...
>man makes me a man!
just cheap thrills. You know it doesn't have to be this way but you revel in the fact that you can feel special knowing all of that nonsense.
In a sane operating system, the manual is unnecessary for anything but actually modifying or working with system internals.
you sound upset, anon. sure you don't need to Get-Help?
It's straightforward.
You have permissions ranging from 444 to 777.
You have usermod for making groups and users. You have chmod for changing permissions. you have chown for allowing users permissions to files or folders. Some flags also translate to different commands like the -R flag which stands for recursive, which applies to every file in a folder. It just clicks.
>Some flags also translate to different commands like the -R flag which stands for recursive, which applies to every file in a folder. It just clicks.
Cool! -r I get it, I will use that.
The numbers also make sense now, the farther you get from the number 444 but not over 777 the less restrictive the permissions get. So 683 is pretty loose.
well, the first number is an administrator then the group that has been assigned to the folder or directory and the last one is all users.
0 being the most restrictive and 7 being the most lose and the numbers in between well... I haven't thought about it much. Anyways yeah the most restrictive is 0, not 4. I just set the ssh keys to 444 and the regular files to 755 and call it a day.
But you're not going to question why it's in this arbitrary range of 0 to 7? or why it's separated into 3 digits? And why you have to memorize that? You ever think about that?
You're out of your mind? In what WORLD does it "just click", if you're reading the manual page for every single command you ever have to use? You're just retroactively making up "connections" and "similarities" after having spent the time learning all of that bullshit.
I am willing to bet millions of dollars that people would find powershell much more intuitive than bash if they started learning from scratch and were only taught the basics like how to use the help system.
"man 2 sbrk" is all I need to say on that.
the permissions system is in octal for no reason other than "historical", and they just accept it, then they start claiming its "intuitive". These guys can't be helped.
>if they started learning from scratch
breaking news: microsoft product is superior in extremely contrived circumstance
Unfortunately, it's still superior despite not being intuitive to brain damaged bash users. And I don't have to give any evidence for that, you can just look at the industry usage yourself. But you're not aware of that, as you're unemployed.
>But you're not aware of that, as you're unemployed.
i've worked for longer than most of IQfy has been alive. not once have i ever seen powershell used for anything but windows server admin. ever.
it's a bizarre middle ground meme language nobody asked for
take your L, jeet
>not once have i ever seen powershell used for anything but windows server admin. ever.
Worked for over 10 years but won't say what you do LOL. Javascript? "backend engineer"? You realize the reason this thread exists on IQfy right now is because the usage of powershell has grown so much over the past few years?
>nobody asked for
MS doesn't have to ask anyone when they want to make something. Just admit your neoplasticity is too low to learn something new and move on homosexual.
>Javascript? "backend engineer"?
projecting webshit, classic
>You realize the reason this thread exists on IQfy right now is because the usage of powershell has grown so much over the past few years?
this thread exists on IQfy because only autists care about it
>still doesn't say what he does
LMAO, the only webshit here is you.
OP is very likely not an autist, he's just asking the autists on this board what they think of powershell. And based on his posts he's just trying to get his job done.
no, literally no one asked for it. the person who created it almost got fired because he was supposed to be working on something else.
PS provides 0 benefits and only makes sense to use if you work for a microsoft cuck org that shells out obscene money to be locked into the microsoft ecosystem.
>almost got fired
yeah that's typical MS. At least they didn't shut it down
>PS provides 0 benefits
That's false. The biggest benefit is unfricking your brain from unix anti-design and nonsense...
yes, unfrick your brain by blending it up and pouring it into the toilet
it's just another microsoft embrace and extinguish project that's just unfamiliar enough from what's sane so if you happen to invest time and money into it, it's expensive to move away from it.
It's a shitshow that locks you further into Microsoft's .NET ecosystem
>just unfamiliar enough from what's sane
let me correct you, it's "unfamiliar enough from what's insane". Its hilarious how much it makes you struggle.
Also, you DO know that both powershell and .NET are OSS under MIT? And that it's on Linux/macOS as well? What "lock" are you talking about?
That's what fricking aliases are for. Why frick up the shell language directly when you can just alias for quick typing in interactive, and still have readable scripts. That's what powershell does.
>Install Microsoft™ Windows®
>"disable" Cortana®, targeted adds
>remove Xbox® Live, Xbox® Console App, Roblox, misc zogware
>restart computer
>open Edge®, download literally any other browser
>>shit still opens with Edge® even though it's not your default (Are You Sure You Don't Want To Try eDGE(R)?)
>restart computer
>disable Search® with Bing®
>restart computer
>download "git"
>checkout rn, commit n
>install Linux application for Windows™
>work
$0.50 has been deposited into your Microsoft™ Mixed Reality Portal® account
What does that have to do with Unix anti-design vs NT design and Powershell design
I know the current state of Windows is fricked but that's not relevant to the fundamental design and its influence on your thought patterns and understanding.
QRD on NT?
NT gets most of its design from an earlier project that Dave Cutler, it's lead designer did at Digital Equipment Corporation, called OpenVMS. It's was a hybrid kernel design (mixed monolithic and microkernel) that was object-based, written entirely in a high level language (at the time, C was the best) and had an abstraction layer for easy porting to new platforms. NT wasn't even developed on x86 at first, it was ported to it later.
And they also wanted to support multiple application APIs. Win32, POSIX, OS/2 were the original targets, but they cut off OS/2 later.
Cutler wanted NT to be a complete inversion of everything that characterizes Unix. He hated it and its ASCII text streams. Made everything a API that passed structured data (objects). And made IO asychronous. In NT it's called IRPs (I/O Request Packets) that are sent between drivers and kernel subsystems.
>Made everything a API that passed structured data (objects)
This is probably my biggest pet-peeve coming from Linux and
>He hated it and its ASCII text streams
explains it well.
Like absolutely the info you get from running a cmdlet is great ime, but doing anything with it requires so many extra steps to prepare the input and output streams before piping them together - meaning more objects and more manipulation to get working. Granted, I have about 2 weeks cumulative experience with Powershell.
So In your defense, when you don't have to manipulate those datastreams to get a result, the result is usually hella clean and you'd need 10x the lines in bash to get the same quality. I need to figure out how PS pops up the status bar when I run Update-Help.
>OpenVMS
I've heard legends. My first job ever was upgrading a Java applet served from an Itanium server running OpenVMS.
>meaning more objects and more manipulation to get working.
It can get a bit annoying at times to fish out the actual property containing the data you want from the resulting object of a cmdlet but its a small price to pay and when you accomplish a lot of shit using objects like you said it's really nice.
>I need to figure out how PS pops up the status bar when I run Update-Help.
https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/powershell/module/microsoft.powershell.utility/write-progress?view=powershell-7.2
>I've heard legends. My first job ever was upgrading a Java applet served from an Itanium server running OpenVMS.
Early years with DEC Alpha, Itanium, x64, Win2k, OpenVMS were wild. Windows NT was actually PORTED to DEC Alpha, and did you know that the first 64-bit Windows was XP ported to Itanium? Not x64!
No, I need ncurses for Powershell.
>There's a cmdlet for it
Because of course there is.
I mean enough can be done without where I'm from, and all that info you get it straight from files on *nix, which are rarely other than text, run 'em if they 'aint.
>the first 64-bit Windows was XP ported to Itanium?
Ackshually, the first 64-bit Windows was 2000, ported to Alpha AXP. It didn't see a release however (because Microsoft dropped support for DEC) - there was also a (very hobbled) Windows 2000 for Itanium out there somewhere.
But the first 64-bit version to actually see release was Windows XP for Itanium, yes, beating out the AMD64 version (which was based on Windows Server 2003, not XP itself) by about four months.
Is unfortunate that this solid design is doomed to be tied to current Windows forever.
Windows is not that bad if you're a user.
It's just kind of intrusive is all.
Like what are these updates for anyways that they need to be forced or these random installations?
Also if you could customize it it'd be cool.
I think the problem with PowerShell is that is not designed with separate tools in mind. They try to fit in everything in one line and it's a mess. Also like I keep going back that example. Each flag had like 6 ok a parameters or whatchamu call it. A flag should just be a flag that can be combined with different flags.
Also in that command I posted a for loop and an if statement were used just to change a groups permissions. That's bad. You should need to put in code logic just to do something like that in my opinion.
>It's just kind of intrusive is all.
It literally deletes problematic files now.
We all know where that's going.
I was forced to write a firewall update script that could work over ssh becuase our old boomer tech lead hosts a server on iis, windows. The word "forced" is key here, it's really an unpleasant shell experience as compared with bash and even bash has room for improvement in my opinion.
>permissions ranging from 444 to 777
what the bloody frick are you talking about?
I corrected and said ranging from 0 to 7
Give me some slack I'm not a sys admin
>I just set the permissions on a share using gnuleenux
Real world. I just set the correct gpo permissions for a change necessary for 30,000 users by taking an extra 3 seconds to tab complete a command
Depends. Some cmdlets don't allow wild cards, like copy-item. But overall that's not a global PowerShell limitation.
PowerShell bad. Very dumb.
>PowerShell bad
may i ask why?
Is OK, wish it was less verbose. Looks like someone slapped Python and C# together.
>Looks like someone slapped Python and C# together
that's what i thought because powershell's syntax is so similar to python's syntax and i don't know about the C#.
can you elaborate on the similarities between C# and powershell?
These PowerShell threads are hilarious because it becomes obvious real quick how few people on g have an actual real job.
PowerShell is amazing for windows/azure/Microsoft 365 admins. I use to quite a bit even for personal scripts at home on my windows laptop.
it's useful I guess. Very opinionated. Dotnet integration is actually pretty cool. Does it do anything, really, what I wouldn't rather do with something else? Nope.
windows administration is a job for indians you should be ashamed. you'll actually learn, if you do progress further in your career beyond password resets and kibana, that powershell is terribly bloated - it is mediocre at solving any task. Simple file manipulations/ rest? just use bash thru git bash. Anything more complex than that? Should be in a docker image and use a real more powerful compiled language... or really even python or go .
The only time I use powershell at work is startup scripts with terraform to configure my windows VMs initially but that's because I'm lazy and didn't create a custom image.
I'm really thankful for Powershell. Until it came along, there was a constant stream of OOP-brains complaining about Unix byte streams and saying how it'd be "so much better" if pipes were based on objects instead.
Now there's finally a concrete example of why that idea fricking sucks. Finally. They made that sacrifice so others don't have to. It's like getting to trot out real labview programs whenever someone tries to start up the no code meme again.
The only thing it's good for, is ssh
I don't like the rare occasion where it unwraps an array of a single object into just an object and fricks over some code of mine expecting an array, but it's easy enough to prevent by using more explicit declarations
I don't agree nor disagree, quite the opposite actually
Writing an entire essay for one command? No thanks
>too verbose to be a shell
>not versatile enough to be a general purpose language
the best way to describe powershell is "microsoft made it"
gay, just use linux
Is there a limit to how much bash can handle?
I bet there isn't there
Could I have a thousand if statements script?
the guy in charge of PS quit today
they must have seen the 50,000 reported issues ff
i mean honestly whoever that was just not doing a good enough job tbh.
If they make windows development enviroment better itll bring back developers that shouldnt be using a mac in the first place.
Imagine dilbert using a mac lol, like yeah that was his first choice.
ANyone know if it's possible to ssh into a Windows server yet?
https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-server/administration/openssh/openssh_server_configuration
>Not Supported
topkek
Powershell is great evereyone should use Powershell otherwise Powershell isn't that great
Which one of those options in the Not Supported section are generally useful/are used on a normal basis? I think they were kinda lazy but they must have had some reason to not implement everything.
GSSAPIAuthentication is based
Probably KerberosAuthentication too
I mean I just showed the first example of that link I posted earlier it gets worse
Get-GPO -All | ForEach-Object { if($_ | Get-GPPermission -TargetName "Marketing Admins" -TargetType Group -ErrorAction SilentlyContinue) {$_ | Set-GPPermission -Replace -PermissionLevel GpoApply -TargetName "Marketing Admins" -TargetType Group }}
That is to change to "Replace the permission level of a security group for all GPOs on which the group has permissions"
See this stuff snowballs out of control fast.
Well I don't know exactly how you'd go about doing that in linux. But I guess something like
usermod or chown or something.
Garbage.
If you're involved in admin-tasks for MS WIndows based servers and workstations it's pretty much a must to know. Also important to have a decent understanding of it if you're into malware (maldoc) analysis and general security. Additionally is an interesting concept where, unlike *nix like scripting languages, your output is not text but objects which requires some getting used to if you're coming from/accustomed to *nix environments.
tl;dr
Powershell is a must if you do anything with Windows based system.
Tip:
Most important 3 commands for Powershell
1. Get-Help -Full <command>
2. <command> | Get-Member
3. <command> | Select-Object
PowersHell is horribly painful language. However, it's power is undeniable.
I found command discoverability and reuse of previously learned commands hard. In posix shells once I learn awk, sed and etc I can adapt to almost any problem.
It's dogshit. It has a bug on my PC where it doesn't open it on some paths with spaces in the name. Yes, M$IT can't do proper string escaping circa 2022.
I ran into the same problem and thought I was going mad.
to be fair... no one can. Windows is pure shit and powerhell just adds more ways to get cases where what you wrote is not what the cmdlet sees.
Combine that with over 9000 ways to write a valid path that gets treated differently by some C(++) win32 runtime that every application calls inconsistently and you got more shit.
I remember even invoking cmdlet batch scripts is inconsistent because cmd DOT exe is moronic and has its own incompatible command line parsing than powershell's and cmd DOT exe's invocation of binaries of course adds even MORE inconsistency.
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go frick yourself hiromoot you dumb Black person.
>hurr your string contains cmd DOT exe that means its malware
>How good powershell and what do IQfy think about powershell?
Use it don't beleve what others on ths backwards-ass website tells you.
Me likey
it's just yet another inconsistent shit on top of shit. Only thing good about it is most winshitter admins don't know how it works so you can use it to do shit like modify USER registry values. I wouldn't even use it if it weren't for my work computer being a shitty cuck box without admin.
Too verbose compare to bash
It's dogshit. It unironically made me start learning python because even trying to make simple scripts was fricking annoying.
if powershell doesn't make sense you should find a new career; if there's only one thing it's good at (and there might be), it's letting noobs read and write a mostly human legible, one size fits all scripting language
>use dos device path since it's the only nonshit way to path in windows without a million caveats
>Path not found: '"Microsoft.PowerShell.CoreFilesystem::\.C:mypathhere"'
very cool, nice.
Anyone else updating their Powershell help while watching CB?
fricking disgusting dude, get a life ya filthy degenerate
It works well enough but the syntax is absolute shit
>but the syntax is absolute shit
Mind telling me why?
its better than cmd
thats it
I've used bash all my life but I imagine that I will have to learn some Powershell for my new jobs (InfoSec analyst and network vulnerability assessor)
I only interact with it for scripting/automation purposes. It's good for that (as I imagine that's primarily what it was designed for). I'd never use it as an actual daily driver terminal.
Install gentoo
It's not the same as bash so I don't see why people compare them. Bash is for lazy fricks that want to stay in the terminal and automate their day to day crap very easily and quickly, or just hack shit together because they're too lazy to do it properly. It's a way to solve problems of any kind quickly.
Powershell is for modifying the system and automating a few things here and there. It's a way to solve problems relating to the OS quickly.
I have some weird hotkeys for my mouse in bash that do different things depending on the application. It does what it needs to instantly. I tried doing that in Powershell and quickly figured out that is not what Powershell is meant for. The startup time alone was just too much.
Yes bash is significantly better in almost every way, but they are different tools. It's like saying a jackhammer is better than a hammer.
Sir please open the power shell and type
SFC /SCANNOW