>There are many prophecies in the OT that describe the coming Messiah
>Jesus fulfills those prophecies
>Jesus is the Messiah
>Jesus is the truth
>Christianity is the truth
vs.
>The writers of what would become the NT knew about the prophecies
>They wrote the story of Jesus in such a way so that they would fulfill said prophecies to gain legitimacy
>Jesus was just a historical man written to be the son of God
>Christianity is just another religion with its own myths in equal validity to that of any other religion
Discuss and debate.
What if writing Jesus into the prophecies made them true?
Then that would support the second claim?
egregores
So just collective unconscious?
How would they not know abot the prophecies? In the NT it is outright stated tha Jesus does things exactly to fullfil them
The issue is that Jesus does not fulfill most of the prophecies and extensive mental gymnastics are needed to make it fit. Most of the important prophecies are still scheduled to be fulfilled in the second coming in two more weeks. Pretty much the entire doctrine of the second coming exists only to cope with the unfulfilled prophecies.
Name one
He did (the Catholic Church), He did (Christians weren't purged by Hadrian, and their faith was unaffected when the Temple was destroyed. He did (Christianity is the largest religion ever, the Catholic Church is the single largest church on Earth, the Gospel has been spread to every corner of the world). No it wasn't added later (frescos of Mary in early Christian churches). Name those prophecies
>In Isaiah 11:1-9, we see prophecies about the coming Messiah, some of which were fulfilled in Yeshua, but some have not been fulfilled yet. We don’t yet see wolves lying down with lambs, nursing children playing at the cobra’s hole, or the earth full of the knowledge of Yahweh. The verses in Micah are also clear prophecies about the coming Messiah, and they tell of a universal peace that has not yet manifested.
>not understanding parables
The Apostles explicitly asked Him about this directly and He explained that Truth is simple and should be understood by all. It doesn't literally mean that babies will play with cobras and wolves will cease to hunt livestock. It means that the wicked will repent and lay down with the faithful lambs of the Shepard's flock, which is exactly what happened, is happening and will continue to happen within the Church. If you actively participated in your parish you would know it's filled with repentant souls with troubled pasts, the Church is a hospital for the sinner, and you'll find plenty of wolves laying down alongside innocent lambs to be in communion with Christ
Incredible mental gymnastics, and that's only the least concerning of the prophecies mentioned in that excerpt.
How is it mental gymnastics? It's literally a metaphor, and an apt one at that. Do you think when Jesus told the story of the Two Sons that he was talking about a literal event specifically with no underlying message which was more important? How are you going to convey a universal truth to a crowd of children, teenagers, young men, women, the elderly, of all different intellects and perspectives? You tell a memorable, simple and engaging story, philosophers have done this since there first was a philosopher
Jesus didn't even fulfill the prophecies doe. He didn't create an independent Judean Kingdom. He didn't save the Judeans. He didn't make Judea the light of the world. The virgin birth was added later. Some of the prophecies associated to Jesus where fulfilled by Judean kings hundreds of years before.
Is the reason why the book of Enoch not considered canon is because the NT writers seemed to have clearly ripped it off?
To be fair, most israelites don't even consider it Canon
The second alternative Is less reasonable. If you want to be atheist then Jesus exists no matter what you wish to feel.
The better explanation is that Jesus was a smart man, like Terry Davis, and purposefully fulfilled the parts of scripture which weren't fulfilled prophecies yet and also interpreted what those prophecies meant.
>The better explanation is that Jesus was a smart man, like Terry Davis
Watch this
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Jesus didn't exist.
>What if I want to be israelite?
Then you israelite.
Why the mental gymnastics?
Sorry for hijacking the thread, but I took the mark of the beast, and the day afterwards Jesus & The Holy Spirit left me and I became permanently sick... I dont know what to do anymore.
You can't trick someone into breaking their covenant with God, they have to do it with full knowledge. The Holy Spirit will never leave you unless you knowingly demand it to of your own free will
I stole a bag of clothes left outside a thrift store. When I did that, God said "Thou shalt not steal". I looked up to the sky, and smirked like a demon.
When I placed the bag of clothes in my bedroom, Jesus entered into my room (Spiritually, I couldnt see him physically) and he said: "Dont touch the clothes, not even with your hands". me being rebellious, I instantly jumped out of bed and tried to shove my hand in, but was supernaturally pushed away multiple times, and it made me more angry each time. I was sent to a time out in the hallway, where I paced back and forth for about 30 minutes. This was the moment I should have prayed but didnt due to hardness of heart.
2 Hours in, I am standing infront of the bag of clothes, screaming at God "WHY THE FRICK CANT I TOUCH THE CLOTHES HUH?!! TYRANT FRICK!!!"
Right before I was gonna shove the whole hand into the bag of clothes, the Holy Spirit screamed in distress "SHEDDING!!!!" and I responded "For two and half years I avoided people... SHEDDING IS BULLSHIT!!!" and I looked at the ceiling/sky/throne of God and I gave the most demonic smile, and shoved my whole hand into the bag of clothes. I took part of the clothes out and rubbed part of them on my cheek and said "ooooh God I am rubbing the mark of the beast on my face!!" and then I tried on the clothes whilst throwing up a devil horn with my hands.
The next day I became ill and the first thing I said "Oh noo, i took the mark of the beast, I took the mark of the beast". That part of my face burns with searing pain daily, but so does every part of my body too. I hear computer noises in my head, i see ai rendered images when I close my eyes, I used to run in the woods often, now I can barely go to the store. 8 months long headache and i hear electrical computer noises in my brain.
The truth? The clothes had belonged to a vaccinated (marked) person who donated their clothes to the thrift store. The shedding was on the clothes.
Wrong, satan is a deciever. Bible says DONT BE DECIEVED
Eve: The serpent beguiled/decieved me
And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet who wrought miracles in his presence, by which he <<< them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshiped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire, burning with brimstone.
Satan can only tempt and torment if you allow it, Eve was told by God Himself, directly, not to eat the fruit. Both her and Adam were punished both for disobedience and for not taking responsibility for their choices
Yes, read my post. A voice in my head (Jesus) said: Dont touch the clothes. "Not even with your hand. " and I also heard the Holy Spirit yell "SHEDDING!!!" but i dismissed it.
I basically touched the forbidden apple like in the garden. Now I got marked, aka spike protein shedding aids. Yes the covid 19 vaccine was the mark of the beast it literally corrupts the blood and the soul is in the blood, it contains LUCIFERASE destilled at 66.6 phosphate buffer, messenger RNA alters DNA and according to greek strong concordance "messenger" means angel, so essentially Fallen Angel DNA/RNA. Jesus said in the days of Noah, so shall it be when the son of man returns, in Genesis 6:4 and book of enoch we can read how fallen angels intermingled with the seed of man, spawning the nephelim, now they succeeded doing this through vaccines and technology. The Prophecy of Daniel, Iron (technology) mixed with clay (humans) is the vaccine which contains nano technology and graphene oxide, binding humans to transhumanism, connecting people to the Internet of Bodies, Bill Gates patent WO060606, where in 2027 only those with the nano technology in their body will be able to buy and sell, as the tech gives every person a unique ID and their bankaccounts will be tied into their body. Far beyond the simple minded freaks who are waiting for a bulky physical RFID chip in their right hand. No, nano technology in the RIGHT HAND HELIX. Did you know moderna patent papers state the vaccine contains luciferase and induces a TRIPLE STRAND HELIX, thus making the person no longer genetically original in the image of God, but a hybrid which Jesus did not die for?
I thought the clay represented black people.
Well the true isrealites are black
That's not what I mean.
"And the fourth kingdom shall be strong as iron: forasmuch as iron breaketh in pieces and subdueth all things: and as iron that breaketh all these, shall it break in pieces and bruise.
And whereas thou sawest the feet and toes, part of potters' clay, and part of iron, the kingdom shall be divided; but there shall be in it of the strength of the iron, forasmuch as thou sawest the iron mixed with miry clay.
And as the toes of the feet were part of iron, and part of clay, so the kingdom shall be partly strong, and partly broken.
And whereas thou sawest iron mixed with miry clay, they shall mingle themselves with the seed of men: but they shall not cleave one to another, even as iron is not mixed with clay."
- Daniel 2:40-43
This is talking about how, after the Romans (the pure iron) there will be a time represented by iron mixed with clay, where the clay is black people. The fact that the iron isn't mixed with the clay represents self-segregation.
Keep in mind that hybrids have incredibly low birthrates and aren't able to reproduce after a few generations due to outbreeding depression. It seems like Daniel or Nebuchadnezzar's dream was predicting events down to our day. The fact that the kingdom is divided and weak is due to the clay (black people) being introduced everywhere. Yet we see they are not actually able to mix with the iron. That's how I always understood it.
Keep in mind that the statue represents the Kingdoms of the Gentiles and it will be completely destroyed.
Most black Americans have white ancestry and their reproductive rate is about the same as white Americans.
Some examples:
Black Americans are a hybrid race of around 22% White ancestry. This is the cause of multiple negative health effects due to genetic incompatibility. Indeed, consistent with Haldane's rule, unmixed Blacks from Africa and White Americans do not have the same rate of birth problems that hybrid American Blacks have:
>"In 2005, the mortality rate for black infants was 4.4 times higher than that of white infants. African women who come to the United States and have babies experience the same low rate of infant deaths as white American mothers."
https://archive.is/oYZm9
LTA4H, or "gleukotriene A4 hydrolase" is found on chromosome 17. An allele of this gene increases the risk of heart attack (the #1 cause of death in America) in Blacks by more than 250%, but only 16% in Whites. The 30% of Whites with this allele have counteracting genes, while the 6% of Black Americans who obtained it (via outbreeding) do not.
https://archive.is/RtzDl
There are several genetic mechanisms which may cause outbreeding depression:
--Two identical alleles at the same locus can in some cases be the alternative with the highest fitness ("homozygote advantage"/"underdominance"). This is the opposite of the effect which for other loci causes inbreeding depression.
--Disruption of beneficial, synergistic interactions between loci ("coadapted gene complexes"). This is a more important cause of outbreeding depression than homozygote advantage. This outbreeding effect is partly insidious since it will likely increase in strength over future generations as new genetic recombinations in each new generation break increasing numbers of such beneficial interactions.
https://archive.is/iZ5nS
96-97% of whites have no African ancestry.
https://archive.is/NPIyg
>Christian arguing that you can take away people's salvation by injecting them with a vaccine
This is wrong on so many levels lmao.
>a laymen is confused and asks for advice
Atheists: woah look at this guy's! This totally invalidates 2000 years of Church history!
This is why we have the Church you fool, learned clergymen exist to answer these questions for the faithful
>mark of the beast
Is abomination and is the same thing it was the first time God purged the earth, mixed race people.
fulfills those prophecies
Correction, he fulfilled the less impressive ones. He did not, for example, establish world peace. This and many other things were postponed until the Second Coming, although the prophecies said nothing about there being more than one coming.
>They wrote the story of Jesus in such a way so that they would fulfill said prophecies to gain legitimacy
They also just made up prophecies that aren't in the Old Testament sometimes, like the "he shall be called a Nazarene" one.
Ezekiel 21:25-27
“‘You profane and wicked prince of Israel, whose day has come, whose time of punishment has reached its climax, this is what the Sovereign Lord says: Take off the turban, remove the crown. It will not be as it was: The lowly will be exalted and the exalted will be brought low. A ruin! A ruin! I will make it a ruin! The crown will not be restored until he to whom it rightfully belongs shall come; to him I will give it.’