Sci loves its space threads so i thought to create semi permanent renewable energies thread.
Here we talk about Energy harvesting via hydro,solar,wind and even stuff like sucking carbon out of the air to be used to make fuel or plastics
What are /scis/ thoughts on battery density will there be a collapse in battery prices in 5 to 10 years in the say way how lcd tv prices collapsed.
>sucking carbon out of the air to be used to make plastics
the last thing we need is more plastic
We'll figure out a way to collect all that micro plastics. Them we can burn it to get the CO2 back.
If only fuel could be made out of human poop...
Not worth it. You get a very small fraction of the solar energy used to grow our food. Biofuels are several orders of magnitude more efficient, and direct solar is an order of magnitude more efficient than biofuels. It would be better to recycle the nutrients to alleviate the phosphate shortage we're creating.
i saw someone mention e-fuels. Which is taking the co2 from the atmosphere and mixing it wth hydrogen. For a net zero carbon foot print.
That's the most moronic idea anyone has ever come up with and I cannot understand why anyone ever suggests otherwise. The only way to make it carbon neutral is to use renewable energy or nuclear power and you end up with significantly less energy than you started with, especially after you consider losses from transportation and combustion.
It's almost certainly going to be the future of economy in a place like saudi arabia, oil won't last forever but the shipping between Asia and Europe won't stop, they will build a solar plant that makes efuel there and have ships use it as the refueling stop on those important trade lanes, same thing with jet fuel honestly. It really is inevitable as oil price will keep going up while efuel price will keep going down and planes and ships simply can't be made electric otherwise.
It will never be the future of any economy. It would be easier and cheaper to convert vehicles to wood gassifiers and run them off biomass.
lmao, who ever said sci can't be funny should look at this post.
are you actually moronic? MAYBE ships, but fricking planes?
Planes will likely be powered by natural gas or hydrogen because of the energy density, then by batteries once the technology advances enough.
I don't think you can run a plane on batteries unless its energy density increases tenfold
I don't think so. Nuclear has its advantages and disadvantages. So do renewables. The best would be a mix of both. One isn't absolutely better than the other.
>energy density increases tenfold
Which would be an advancement of the technology. Read better.
>Biomass
AKA burning trees
Not quite. Gassifiers convert wood or charcoal into syngas which is then burned.
>bio fuels
corn Black folk deserve the rope
Produce biochar and mix it into compost piles to reduce emissions from composting and improve agricultural soil.
global warming is fake
what is high and low tide
This thread isn't about global warming. Renewables are needed because we're gonna face a supply crunch of fossil fuels in the future due to resource depletion. Developing and investing in renewables to either help the fossil fuels last longer or to replace them entirely is needed.
have you read about Hydrothermal carbonization
it seems very promising.
It has alot of applications
human have to poop all the time, basically it speeds up the bio-waste to fuel process that the earth thats millions of years to do.
nuclear, simple as.
>BuT iT's NoT rEnE-
i don't care, it's better than sucking energy out of the wind or sunlight or whatever else moronic shit you have in mind. have you people no common sense? you harvest energy from the wind, there is less wind energy. less wind energy means less air moving in as hot air rises, means less hot air rising means more heatwaves.
>you harvest energy from the wind, there is less wind energy. less wind energy means less air moving in as hot air rises, means less hot air rising means more heatwaves.
What?
restricting convective activity in the atmosphere produces a greenhouse effect. restricting convention is how traditional glass greenhouses work. using windmills to hamper the flow of air causes the greenhouse effect, it windmills prevent convention, which is how heat escapes from the lower atmosphere.
>restricting convention is how traditional glass greenhouses work.
Hats off. 8/10, almost got me to respond. Here's your (You)
i wish there was some safe reactive metal that could cause water to boil. But its all radioactive isotopes
Nuclear makes all renewable energy irrelevant. The sheer efficiency and output makes solar and wind shit themselves.
are you suggest cargo ship run of nuclear reactor?
Nuclear icebreakers are a thing.
arent those things NAVY vessels not private vessels.
Im not against the use of Nuclear i just dont see them being used in commercial ships.
Yes and just put armed guards on the ships to protect the uranium. Pay them well and give them regular return to family to avoid them being bought by terrorists. It doesn’t have to be a navy ship, just have a navy ship follow it everywhere guarding that reactor like a hawk. Better yet use a less spicy rock like thorium or some shit. There’s no excuse at the end of the day.
I have a very dumb question. At what density of wind turbines would it take to have a significant effect on the regional climate? My thought is that winds are important to the general flow of heat and moisture in a region, and wind turbines take a small fraction of energy from the wind to spin. At some point with enough wind turbines, the windflow will have enough energy sapped from it that the weather and climate will be affected. What is that point, and will we ever hit that point by accident? Or is it just not possible for us to hit it?
Well why don't you calculate it, you can take a standard operating wind speed for a turbine, density of the air and area of the wind formation as your factors for determining the kinetic energy the wind has and then compare that to how much power a turbine makes to get a rough estimate.
>will there be a collapse in battery prices in 5 to 10 years
How will they collapse when lithium production is bottlenecked so hard?
For a collapse to happen, you'd need sodium with other dirt-cheap and abundant materials in the cell and the tech for it is still nowhere.
>You can only make batteries out of lithium
Okay, moron
>literally said that alternative chemistries are needed
>moronic Black person understands "u kan meik baturey only litiuhm"
You should probably go open IFLS and jerk off to the 1235234232nd article about muh brand new vandium-osmium-indium-unubtainium flow solid state molten glass batteries that will totally see a production run out of the lab of 1GWh by 2057 (game changer).
They are already making sodium ion batteries you dumb Black person.
what's the energy density ratio for a sodium battery compared to a lithium battery and is there a cap based on material properties?
If a sodium battery is 4 times as large and heavy isn't that a dealbreaker?
I was reading about something called Hydrothermal carbonization: which is basically using poop as a source of fuel to generate power.
https://ohioline.osu.edu/factsheet/fabe-6622
not to sound too schizo but with the government looking to make cars have automatic remote shut off. Has anyone thought of creating a project where by people can make their own fuel or create a platform that can be used to convert older existing ICE automobiles into electric vehicles without the possible government remote control aspect attached to it.
>create a platform that can be used to convert older existing ICE automobiles into electric vehicles without the possible government remote control aspect attached to it.
That's an interesting idea and should be doable. Electric vehicles are much simpler than gasoline/diesel ones since you only have 1 central computer controlling everything instead of multiple small computers controlling each aspect of the car.
yes electrics are much easier. Im big on 3d printing and honestly i thought 3d printign would have have lead to people doing custom designed bikes and car parts. But its still reserved for dorks and geeks.
Anyway there are alot of older cars where the engine is shot but it could be converted into EV. the 3d printing elements for that would me in remaking the dash board to handle full electrical displays.
I have a better idea.
Let's reduce the population of all nations. The West has already accomplished this. Now we force everyone else to do this, by perhaps blowing up a volcano and starting a global winter for a few years. Billions should die off in the developing world.
Now we can go back to driving big block Chevies on ultra-premium 103 octane gas for $0.22/gal.
I like this idea better than solar panels, wind turbines, or nuclear reactors.
>i'm gonna save the world from global warming
>then i'll be a big hero and everyone will know how important i really am!!!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Messiah_complex
I want to do my MSc dissertation in something related to renewable energy. How do I go about this?
How is the energy troonsition going on bros?
Just like everywhere else, basically.
Actually, better than in France. So ... renewables > nuclear?
France has taken half of it's nuclear plants offline.
https://news.sky.com/story/nearly-half-of-frances-nuclear-reactors-taken-offline-adding-to-electricity-demand-on-european-grid-12600662
They are saying it's for maintenance purposes, but i think it's because Mali Black folk stopped supplying them uranium.
I know. I wanted to disprove the moronic point of
>How is the energy troonsition going on bros?
It's actually going better than in not-transitioning France. The rise has nothing to do with renewables, but with the ongoing war against Ukraine.
> It's actually going better
kek
The rise has got to do with lack go fuel getting supplied by Russia, your toxic green meme shit runs on that, EU just declared Nuclear and Gas as green btw, so cope and seethe. The problem in France is temporary, Nuclear is the Future, No one likes the regressive dilute shit like solar and wind, you morons are literally back to burning coal.
> Klaus Ernst, head of the Bundestag Energy Committee, has recommended revising all sanctions related to Russian energy and proposes Germany seriously consider bringing NordStream2 online in the event of a cold snap, for a limited time.
What exactly IS the problem with renewables, actually?
>Klaus Ernst
Unironically one of the funniest German politicians, but in a sad way. He's part of "the Left", so it makes sense that he wants to lick Putin's boots. Half of his party does. I love seeing him on TV, but I will never take him seriously. You should see the speeches in parliament where he basically tells everyone to check out his Porsche.
Also, his recommendation to lick Putin's boot will have no effect whatsoever. The left party only managed to be in parliament due to sheer luck. They got less than 5% and would actually not qualify for a seat, but since they won 3 direct mandates, they were allowed due to some special rules. They are completely irrelevant and hated in Germany.
> What exactly IS the problem with renewables, actually?
Watch this :- https://youtu.be/N-yALPEpV4w
I don't really care about Germany or EU honestly, pic rel is the population pyramid of Germany, look carefully, There next generation of ethnic German population is basically negligible. In next 20-30 years, with the boomer bubble bursting, it will resemble a failed mideastern shithole, Just like the renewables, Germany itself is completely unsustainable, and that politician you are seething about just wants the German boomers to survive the coming winter.
>that politician you are seething about just wants the German boomers to survive the coming winter
I think, he wants to keep his Russian paychecks, to be honest.
If he wanted to keep his Russian/Chinese paychecks he would be an Anti nuclear green meme bro.
>If he wanted to keep his Russian/Chinese paychecks he would be an Anti nuclear green meme bro.
So ... he would be against Russian gas imports? I don't think so.
> Anti nuclear green meme bro
> Against Russian gas
kek, do you have any idea, how Germany has been functioning for years?
Yeah, the left has been trying to give Putin a blowjob for years. Half of them stopped when he started raping Ukraine, but the other half got even more turned on
There is no such thing as "renewable energy", all power generation consumes resources one way or another.
They are also useless for a power grid.
What are the best energy storage options? gravitybatteries, compressed air, hydrogen, etc, etc?
>battery density
These are already an explosion hazard. you need 10x better performance for many applications, at which point those will be as illegal to own as home made dynamite.
one of the issues with renewables is that we are now decentralizing energy density to the consumer level.
>decentralizing energy density
What does this even mean?
You can decentralise energy storage and/or generation, but people prefer their homes distinctly unexploded.
A more harmless approach is to build houses with sub-basements and store a few tens of cubic metres of water in tanks, for solar thermal storage. That way you can power Stirling engines at night and get power also at night.
you mean salt tanks. since salt holds water better. I was looking at hydrogen but i dont want to highly explosive gas that could explode just from a static shock.
Im thinking of a future where the government gets stricter and stricker and says no more propane gas, no more coal. The solar youre collecting NEEDs to be fed back into the system to help everyone so even if you can power your home its going somewhere else.
How to build an offgrid car sized system that can give me 5 to 10kw of energy.
So far the ideas i have are compost gases from rotting food stuffs, using methane from human/animal waste, hydrogen gas.
>you mean salt tanks. since salt holds water better.
Salt tanks are better when you scale up, but plain water is cheep and cheerful and has a huge heat capacity. A 1000 l tank at 90 C holds a lot of energy.
>I was looking at hydrogen but i dont want to highly explosive gas that could explode just from a static shock.
Definitely agree here.
>Im thinking of a future where the government gets stricter and stricker and says no more propane gas, no more coal. The solar youre collecting NEEDs to be fed back into the system to help everyone so even if you can power your home its going somewhere else.
Alternative energy tends to be intermittent, the only thing you can be certain about is that a solar panel is little help at night. What is needed is a hybrid integrated system. A cost effective solar panel has a 20 percent efficiency and that leaves 80 percent thermal energy you can store in, say 100 tanks, each on 1 m^3.
0 - 100 C in 1000 l is 4.2 kJ/lL * 100 * 1000 = 420 MJ. That is quite a bit. Allowing for just 1 percent thermal efficiency in a Stirling engine, you get 4.2 MJ electric power. Over 12 hours night that is 4.2 MJ / (12* 3600 s) = 97 W. If you scale up by 100 tanks, that is 9700 W which is pretty comfy, and no batteries involved, purely thermal storage.
>How to build an offgrid car sized system that can give me 5 to 10kw of energy.
A hybrid solution would give you more than enough thermal energy. In fact fo rthe above to work, you would need a pretty good thermal radiator for the cold sink.
>So far the ideas i have are compost gases from rotting food stuffs, using methane from human/animal waste, hydrogen gas.
Those are rather complex and probably requires a large scale to work out, especially for hydrogen gas. There are also already rules in place that makes mixing biological waste illegal, not entirely sure why. People used to dump animal remains after slaughtering into the manure heap. That was stopped.
What if batteries can’t really be made much better? Everyone is banking on future R&D to come through, but it quite possibly will never
They probably won't. Most of the energy of combustion comes from the breaking of O2's double bond, not from the fuel itself. That's what allows hydrocarbon fuels to have such high energy density - they turn atmospheric O2 into a giant communal battery.
Non-nuclear energy storage that doesn't exploit air-breathing is unlikely to ever achieve high energy density, and if it did it would likely become too dangerous, see