Is it possible to teach yourself and get good at programming without going to college and get a CS degree?
I started learning Python six months and I haven't done anything I'm proud of, I feel like I'm missing something...
Should I take a course on CS? (CS50 or MIT OpenCourseWare) or is there any alternatives.
I wanna get good at it, not just some homosexual who writes shit code.
It's possible but difficult by far
Even college (not all tho) can filter many morons
Ask yourself why do you want to program?
If you're just in it for the money, you will fail
You need to suffer and persevere
That's the definition of Passion
Passion is for homosexuals I am 100% in it for the money and I'm starting a 104k job right out of university. You don't need "passion" you need drive and persistence. Do not listen to these homosexuals that make troony tinker toys on their ubuntu VMs coding is not hard.
>I have zero experience in the real world but let me tell you how it is
Passion is 100% necessary to be a good developer. One needs to constantly learn new tech stacks/design patterns/etc. and not being passionate about it makes that very hard motivationally. Eventually, you will burn out if you're not into it, and ultimately become a dogshit dev even if you were ever any good. In my experience I've never met a dev that wasn't passionate about it that was w
Let's be honest, you'll end up a project manager thinking you're somebody when all your devs think you're a worthless joke. I can't tell you how many project managers or even higher have told me "I used to be a developer/programmer" when every interaction makes it clear they have no clue. I had one project manager start crying b/c she found out I made twice as much as her.
>B..but I'm the project manager!
I run a small dev shop now and my number one requirement for new employees is the ability to learn new things quickly and enthusiastically. I ask them what frameworks they're familiar with, then ask them to do a quick practical evaluation project in a tech stack they have little to no experience with. I ask them about what they like to use and if they aren't smiling and passionate about it when telling me their answer, they're gone.
If a dev isn't enthusiastic, they will eventually be a net drag on the team, requiring others to pickup their slack. Money motivates up to a point, then the dev will feel they've made it and start slacking.
I'm not reading all of your cope. Your skill set is not mystical nor does it require innate born ability. You are not special. I have broken into your industry and I am profiting. Cry about it.
if you don't even view it as your industry and you have such contempt for it, are you even enjoying working in it
well friend, hatred is certainly a kind of passion, but contempt eventually burns you out.
OP here.
I wanted to program because I wanted to get good at something, I love computers and how you make computers do some cool shit. I love money, but I'm not in it because of it.
>but you need to be very persistent and not cry like a little b***h if you don't understand something at first glance.
Boy, that happened to me a lot of times.
I feel like I'm running in circles instead of getting better.
I apperciate your honesty, So what did you guys learned in uni? Things that every dev should know?
>So what did you guys learned in uni? Things that every dev should know?
The first thing you need to do is stop putting uni on a pedestal. Pick a domain of programming that interests you (web, operating systems, embedded, etc literally whatever you like) and then figure out how to do the bare minimum moron shit in it and then go from there. Do not try to learn bottom-up.
Are game engines a valid field?
I know this seems like a moronic question but I hear alot of mixed information about whether games are a good field to get into, and it is literally the only field that I have any genuine interest in since I enjoy math.
yes making game engines is valid. even if you don't find work in the field you will learn a lot about computers and programming and can easily shift to other fields if needed.
Dude, you won't believe how I suck at maths, I want to get gud at it so I can tinker with old engines like Quake or Unreal.
Can someone learn maths on their own? Or am I eternally fricked?
>Can someone learn maths on their own?
yes. learn the math relevant to game engines
I'm beyond moron on maths, I was lazy as a kid and I deeply regret it.
Things like calculus, trig...etc, right?
That's what makes it intersting, It's never enough, you always learn new things.
>It's never enough, you always learn new things.
My goal is to eventually have a broad enough understanding that I can make expert programmers uncomfortable with the my bullshit lingo while also being good enough of a programmer in my preferred technologies to work for only half a day and still be somewhat better than the average developer working "full" 8 hours. That's why I keep pushing myself to learn more.
See
well, it really depends on what your math level is currently. Game engines are pretty just all Linear Algebra/Trigonometry, i don't even think there is much if any calc involved, but those 2 topics alone will definitely require Pre-Calc 12
when the coof started in 2020 I decided to upgrade my math rather than just "learn to program" first as 90% of the boot camps just pigeonhole you into "full-stack" development, I was literally at a grade 4 level and could not even deal with fractions FFS. I was lucky enough to have a forced paid 3-month vacation because I live in leaf land so I basically just spent 8 hours a day on math and brought myself to a grade 11 level and will be wrapping up precalc this year, you can learn on your own but you will basically have to take a linear path from where you are at.
>well, it really depends on what your math level is currently
It's bad tbh, but I'm willing to learn, I need to do a little research.
>my math rather than just "learn to program" first as 90% of the boot camps just pigeonhole you into "full-stack" development
I almost signed up on one of those bootcamps, Thank frick I didn't.
To add to this;
I only had (the euro version of) highschool math for 2.5 years,
and then had no math at all until I took "linear algebra" in college,
which was just a game engine class where we had to write a 3d game engine in c++.
And with some googling I figured it all out just fine.
(Not op) I am in it for the money, I’m sick and tired of being a restaurant chef (although it pays an ok wage in Hongcouver ) and can tell you right now I don’t give a frick about suffering or perseverance as literally fricking ANYTHING is better than working a busy kitchen line/managing the 19-24 year old moron cooks on said line.
Does this mean I will “fail”? I never understood this “you must be passionate” bullshit, I just want to make six figures and write/collaborate on cool software.
Any nerd trying to gatekeep you is simply threatened that he is not as special or talented as he thinks he is. You can definitely learn how to create good software, but it will take a lot of persistence and learning.
I don't think you need passion but you need to at least somewhat like what you're doing. But yes, you'll absolutely need to be able to endure immense stress and and suffering. That's how I got my BSc in CS.
Good universities are a force multiplier. Simply put: the kids groomed in private schools get a ton of value from a good university. If you are not a private school kid groomed for success then university is mediocre at best. You can definitely teach yourself, but you need to be very persistent and not cry like a little b***h if you don't understand something at first glance.
As for resources, just use whatever the frick you want you're gonna pick up and drop a million resources during your coding career so stop fussing about making sure you're using the best one and start fricking coding.
frick off leave you worthless sales piece of shit. you will NEVER get the money. sales filth like you will die..
big baby is threatened that his ability to press buttons is not as exclusive as he thinks
Anybody that has been in any kind of programming education knows it's plenty exclusive.
I've seen people not understand for loops or 2d arrays after 3 years, so I'm not scared.
But you can just do programming as a 9-5, you'll be behind but I don't think it's that big of a deal if you're not moronic
>I've seen people not understand for loops or 2d arrays after 3 years, so I'm not scared.
Kek, this is absolutely true. I have a friend that has been "learning" for years and still can't program for shit. Another thing I noticed is that there are a lot of "experienced" programmers that got into the industry when the barrier of entry was much lower and they're actually shit at it.
>not just some homosexual who writes shit code
First step: stop using Python.
I guess this is a good thread to ask.
I have two opportunities for getting into software dev:
My local uni has a comp sci degree that I can get into a year ahead thanks to the classes I did there. However I need to get a part time job for a whole year to pay for it since I've been NEETing for the past two years.
Second option is this bootcamp thing called 42 that has no tuition nor residential fee.
get the degree
I actually knew someone that went to 42 and they were quite happy with it afaik. I'd still go for the degree.
>If you're just in it for the money, you will fail
Complete nonsense. Most people are in it for the money at this point, CS is the default degree males go for when they don't know where to go from high school. Most of these are going to get a job as programmers. Some will even be decent programmers.
But people with passion can become legendary programmers.
Is it even possible to get a job as a sElFtAugHt code monkey?
Bren doing web dev and have several projects, applied for 20 jobs and didn't even get a single Interview.
Just forget about it OP, seriously. If I would have known that before, I would have just not even started or learned something else.
I'm fricking depressed. Probably gonna neck soon as I approach already 30 and work some dead end job
Ah, the 30 year old failure using programming as a hail mary. The average learn to coder. Companies avoid this shit like the plague.
Try getting a helpdesk or low end infra job first, homosexual. Pay your dues. You know, people without degrees used to do this before the learn to code meme was so widespread, now you homosexuals want to have your cake and eat it too.
anyone competent would not be threatened by a 30 year old learning to code.
I'm giving you advice.
When did you start learning?
Good luck, anon.
Excellent!
seethe
>When did you start learning?
Several years ago. I went to college and actually studied Computer Science. (Got a degree in agriculture before). Passed all my Coding classes and shit, so I am not utterly moronic.
Then in 2019 I became severly depressed and shortly after with Covid coming around, I decided to move back home and help out my father.
Then after I felt better I picked up some shit job and that made me feel worse about myself again. And now I am doing this web dev shit for 4 months. (Easy to build up on the stuff I learned in college).
Was really hopeful, but the fact of the matter is, it only takes a few wrong turns and your life is fricked up.
So it will be dead end shit jobs for me, for the rest of my life I guess. I am 28 btw
God, I really want to die
To be clear: I did not finish my degree in CS there. And I will never go back there again to this horro
OP here, I'm 25 today.
Don't be a Black person and give up. think about these shit jobs you worked in, I work in a shitty job 12 hours a day, problems coming from every directions, and still didn't give up yet.
Things will get better, believe me, anon. You've got this!
>studied Computer Science ... became severly depressed ... [dropped out]
A tale as old as time,
this happend to somebody I was in a group project with at least once a semester
It was not necessarly the fact that I studied CS there. But the place itself. I was an incel there (yes I had sex before) and didn't consider a single person there a friend. (I have quite a few friends though from other places)
It was just the fact that I could not stand the cut throat Environment anymore after like 4 semesters, where everyone took advantage of each other. If I would have had at least one real friend there, I am sure it would have worked out. But whatever. It doesn't matter. The fact that I even decided to study it in the first place and didn't go with my gut feeling (moving to a different country, picking up a job there) is worse than any Depression I got from it, as I missed a once in a lifetime opportunity. I will just neck. Another 5 years max
>moving to a different country, picking up a job there
Why not do this now, doesn't seem very impossible
Beyond that; you seem to be talking about the US type college where you live there as well.
Can't relate, but that seems horrible.
I just took a 20min train ride home, and I was back in my comfort zone.
That makes everything a lot easier to bear probably
>Why not do this now, doesn't seem very impossible
It was a once in a life time opportunity back then, for the exact things I had lined up and the people I knew there. All these things are gone now. It's just another shitty wasted human existence. So who cares
I'm 26, studied my ass off due to existential fear and successfully managed to get my CS degree and few years ago and now I can wfh for meh pay and okay hours while worrying about other stuff in life.
People need to realize that sometimes you'll have to work hard so that your future will suck less.
damn same story here, down to having worked wfh for meh pay. working at a better paying place now, but with less lenient rules and more hours, so i kinda miss my old job where everyone was even more moronic and lazy than me. and i do genuinely have come to love programming though, so it's a little worrying if i'm not enjoying myself at my job
>my old job where everyone was even more moronic
You're not future me are you? Did I get a gf yet?
no dumbass you're going to continue being lazy about it, just like the past 6-7 years
Frick
try this https://www.recurse.com
totally possible and not difficult
i studied economics in school. only took programming classes in high school, not college.
am now a professional software engineer
You're not a genius and just like and talentless worthless homosexual out there you'll write shit code.
And you will cope
It's going to depend on the area and on your history,
but I personally know three people who had unrelated degrees and just got hired to learn programming on the job
The programming courses at my uni are basically worthless for actually teaching anything with lessons consisting of showing book examples with no added insights for implementation. The course book is shit too. If I relied on the learning material the school provides, I'd know jack shit today.
So from my experience, online resources like documentation, SO, youtube and practice are what teaches programming.
Thanks for the advice. I think I know what to do.