Annoying b***hes shilled by borderline prostitutes that think they are profund
t.brazilian
I read A hora da estrela with my gf. We agree that it's not shit, it's sometimes interesting, but she mostly talks about nothing at all. It's not deep, it's not philosophical. Her prose reads like a cargo cult philosophy, if you will: looks like the real thing only if you don't know what it is.
Was about to post the same.
That is indeed the problem with her. Lots of abstract concepts, "joy", "hope", "understanding", "knowledge", etc. but no philosophical content at all. She is not like Goethe, Dostoevksy, or Borges, there's just nothing in it but "feels".
She's not a particularly great writer either. Nothing impressive about her Portuguese prose. It's the feminine equivalent of the empty rhetoric of a political speech: words words words signifying nothing.
Here's a random passage:
"See, my love, I am losing the courage to find whatever it is I shall have to find, I am losing the courage to give myself over to the road itself, and I am now promising us that in that Hell I shall find hope.
"Perhaps it is not the ancient hope. Perhaps it cannot even be called hope."
I was struggling because I did not want an unknown joy. It would be as forbidden by my future salvation as the forbidden beast that was called impure—and I was opening and closing my mouth in torture to call for help, but then it still hadn't occurred to me to invent this hand that I have now invented to hold mine. In my fear yesterday I was alone, and I wanted to ask for help against my first dehumanization.
Dehumanization is as painful as losing everything, as losing everything, my love. I was opening and closing my mouth to call for help but I neither could nor knew how to enunciate."
It's essentially self-help for middle class women who are afraid of being caught reading self-help books. The kind who go to Bali every once in a while in order to "find themselves".
and i thought it couldn't get worse than Paulo Coelho's tepid and empty self-help "spiritualism". somehow this is worse.
[...]
Astroturfed.
She was the same kind of "empty profound" in interviews and as a person, and others like her (Buarque, etc) were already shills.
curiously also all libertine-leaning almost commies. they were the artistic 'resistance' during the military dictatorship period, becaude of 'le freedom of speech', which promptly turned into drivel (worse than it was while censored) when it all came down.
Good to know people here still have a head over their shoulders
Im Brazilian and I never understood how can people like her
Its all just effect as you said, all style, no substance
She used to be widely quoted on Facebook because of that, she is very quotable, but in a vague, banal way. The anon that said cargo cult was really incisive, thats the best way to describe it. She uses loaded words but no structure to support them
Contrast that with Anais Nin, which, to me, was the epitome of the female brained female writer: she also has this declarative, actress like voice like Clarice when writing, but she actually has good insights, especially about the female condition (bonus point for this, by itself, being an example of the inafe female narcissism). And she was a real BPD hoe on top of that, she fricked half her entire generations writers and artists, and even fricked her father for many years
No. Brazilians are still seething so hard at some mousy Ukrainian b***h coming over and BTFOing their barely existent literary culture, that they make up bullshit accusations like this.
8 months ago
Anonymous
Learn to read, stupid Jamal. He's talking about Anaïs Nin.
8 months ago
Anonymous
I'm sorry what?
8 months ago
Anonymous
Sorry. I forgot, Lispector gets accused of fricking her university professors.
8 months ago
Anonymous
That is partly true
8 months ago
Anonymous
Is Pessoa popular in Brazil at least
8 months ago
Anonymous
moron
8 months ago
Anonymous
what language do brazilians speak again?
8 months ago
Anonymous
Portuguese
8 months ago
Anonymous
No. No Brazilian literature is popular in Brazil. It is more like a "Game of Thrones" vibe among the readership, if you get my meaning. The most obvious stuff like JGR get a respectful awe at a distance. JGR is actually hot to the touch
I mean that that's a pleb stock white lady who is likely only being read because she looks like her audience in england and america, and brings them a sense of vicarious ethnic flavor. since you were curious and asked why.
She was a holol israelite whose parents moved her to Brazil
or probably this, as equally likely.
8 months ago
Anonymous
Takes 3 seconds to google
8 months ago
Anonymous
>and brings them a sense of vicarious ethnic flavor
What the hell do you mean by "ethnic flavor"?
isnt that her USP? she's marketed as a Brazilian author.
you're really being obtuse about this, i know you know what i mean. the puta is not an inca.
When on Earth did she larp as ethnic?
Lispector is a white Brazilian.
What are you on about?
Do you think Brazilian = "ethnic"? Maybe England marketeers larp her as an ethnic?
Lispector was always clear about her origins and no one in Brazil thinks of her as anything other than white.
Most Brazilian authors are white, and are seen as white by everyone.
Brazil is a Western country of European origins, specially when it comes to its elite, which is as European, and in fact used to be much more European, than that of, e.g., the US, including at the time when Lispector started writing.
She was a Brazilian author? I'm sure had she the ability to write in any other language she would have booked it out of Brazil at the drop of a hat. Dire literary tradition.
Portuguese was not even her mother tongue.
8 months ago
Anonymous
>Brazilian = "ethnic"? Maybe England marketeers larp her as an ethnic? >"ethnic flavor"?
seriously pendejo this is getting annoying, see other anon:
Was about to post the same.
That is indeed the problem with her. Lots of abstract concepts, "joy", "hope", "understanding", "knowledge", etc. but no philosophical content at all. She is not like Goethe, Dostoevksy, or Borges, there's just nothing in it but "feels".
She's not a particularly great writer either. Nothing impressive about her Portuguese prose. It's the feminine equivalent of the empty rhetoric of a political speech: words words words signifying nothing.
Here's a random passage:
"See, my love, I am losing the courage to find whatever it is I shall have to find, I am losing the courage to give myself over to the road itself, and I am now promising us that in that Hell I shall find hope.
"Perhaps it is not the ancient hope. Perhaps it cannot even be called hope."
I was struggling because I did not want an unknown joy. It would be as forbidden by my future salvation as the forbidden beast that was called impure—and I was opening and closing my mouth in torture to call for help, but then it still hadn't occurred to me to invent this hand that I have now invented to hold mine. In my fear yesterday I was alone, and I wanted to ask for help against my first dehumanization.
Dehumanization is as painful as losing everything, as losing everything, my love. I was opening and closing my mouth to call for help but I neither could nor knew how to enunciate."
It's essentially self-help for middle class women who are afraid of being caught reading self-help books. The kind who go to Bali every once in a while in order to "find themselves".
if you truly do not understand what we're saying here
8 months ago
Anonymous
The other anon is, ironically, myself.
There is nothing "ethnic" in that paragraph.
Lispector is not Brazilian
Lispector *IS* definitely Brazilian.
You know nothing about Brazil.
And "pendejo" is not a word we use here, sorry.
8 months ago
Anonymous
I am the other guy discussing with the guy you are also discussing, Im Brazilian too, and sorry but Clarice is not Brazilian
8 months ago
Anonymous
Unless you are some R*ddit/FFLCH imbecile for whom "real" Brazilian = índio/black, Lispector was very much a Brazilian.
Brazil is a country of immigrants, and the Brazilian elite specially, like the Argentine one, is an elite mostly composed of European immigrants, and the children and grandchildren of European immigrants.
Lispector was Brazilian, Otto Maria Carpeaux was Brazilian, Paulo Ronai was Brazilian...
You can "become" Brazilian in a way that you cannot "become" Japanese, because BR identity is not ethnicity-based.
>But your usage impliews this is something that happens more than in this case, so what do you mean with whites larping as ethnic? There are so many layers of confusion to this
There's no confusion to this at all, it's entirely simply: she's not Brazilian and is writing as a Brazilian author. You can add layers of mystery to this but it's nothing overly different; it's a white tourist who is writing in dreary platitude and egoistic pathos to be consumed by her like-minded sisters in the suburbs of middle england, germany and new york. I mean, from what I've just read of her. There's a million other white women like her, wandering around india and africa wearing the local clothes and playing prophetess and guru.
>Third, you should ask yourself if thats not the effect of gringo press exoticizing stuff up for the sake of selling
WELL yes this is probably 90% of it, but even so.
>she's not Brazilian and is writing as a Brazilian author
She was an Ukrainian-born Brazilian, and wrote as herself, a white Brazilian of middle/upper class, of European culture, and influenced by European literature.
8 months ago
Anonymous
>, a white Brazilian of middle/upper class, of European culture, and influenced by European literature
that's what we've been saying she's a globohomo, that's what they all are.
8 months ago
Anonymous
I just used the dame Braizl x Japan comoarison when discussing with the other guy. I think I fall in the middle of both of you. You think shes 100% Brazilian, he thinks shes 100% foreigner, I think she is Brazilian but not as Brazilian as a native born Brazilian, pre-mutted
[...]
Starting to develop genuine sympathy for Lispector here. You Brazilian muts are beyond it. Thats like saying anyone who didn't float in with the Mayflower isn't American.
>You Brazilian muts are beyond it. Thats like saying anyone who didn't float in with the Mayflower isn't American.
I'm English actually and I don't think the Spanish, Italians, Germans, Scots and Irish wandering around in the Amerindes are anything other than what they are.May God grant them the santy to recognize this and end their foolishness of pretending to be something they are not, then we can wrap up this ghastly american tax rebellion and bring world peace.
8 months ago
Anonymous
Lispector is not Brazilian
8 months ago
Anonymous
>Brazilian = "ethnic"? Maybe England marketeers larp her as an ethnic? >"ethnic flavor"?
seriously pendejo this is getting annoying, see other anon: [...] if you truly do not understand what we're saying here
Starting to develop genuine sympathy for Lispector here. You Brazilian muts are beyond it. Thats like saying anyone who didn't float in with the Mayflower isn't American.
8 months ago
Anonymous
Not born in Brazil. Not Brazilian. You’re the moronic McCucker-Rooney troon
8 months ago
Anonymous
I knew you guys were impoverished, but they should really think to invest in updating your civics curriculum to include more modern definitions of citizenship.
[...] >You Brazilian muts are beyond it. Thats like saying anyone who didn't float in with the Mayflower isn't American.
I'm English actually and I don't think the Spanish, Italians, Germans, Scots and Irish wandering around in the Amerindes are anything other than what they are.May God grant them the santy to recognize this and end their foolishness of pretending to be something they are not, then we can wrap up this ghastly american tax rebellion and bring world peace.
My bad. Respect that take more than all the hairsplitting going on itt
8 months ago
Anonymous
>
>Lispector *IS* definitely Brazilian.
urgh birther nationalism
[...] >You Brazilian muts are beyond it. Thats like saying anyone who didn't float in with the Mayflower isn't American.
I'm English actually and I don't think the Spanish, Italians, Germans, Scots and Irish wandering around in the Amerindes are anything other than what they are.May God grant them the santy to recognize this and end their foolishness of pretending to be something they are not, then we can wrap up this ghastly american tax rebellion and bring world peace. (You) >My bad. Respect that
I might add that they are cooking under the sun and it boils their brains and makes them mad, like the eastern europeans squatting in palestine at this moment in time. that's 99% of the problem.
8 months ago
Anonymous
>Brazil is a Western country of European origins
Is that what they actually taught you in your ridiculous college? I mean, really? lol. Look around you, you deluded, disgusting homosexual
8 months ago
Anonymous
It is more like Afrika. And that's precisely why Grandes Sertões is so monumental
>you guys really have a white people larping as 'ethnic' problem in south america
I have never, not once in my life seen anyone doing that.
Do you have any examples?
you guys really have a white people larping as 'ethnic' problem in south america, this woman from her picture looks like a local brit.
(You) >>you guys really have a white people larping as 'ethnic' problem in south america >I have never, not once in my life seen anyone doing that. >Do you have any examples?
sure:
https://i.imgur.com/LbbhPBx.jpg
So is she actually good or just being astroturfed
and confirmed lol
Takes 3 seconds to google
8 months ago
Anonymous
When did she larp as ethnic?
8 months ago
Anonymous
In her interviews and writings
8 months ago
Anonymous
How can you larp as ethnic? Saying uga buga? What does that even mean, she wasnt even born in Brazil
8 months ago
Anonymous
isnt that her USP? she's marketed as a Brazilian author.
you're really being obtuse about this, i know you know what i mean. the puta is not an inca.
8 months ago
Anonymous
Half of Brazilians look Med
I dont understand the shock
You thought there were only mutts?
8 months ago
Anonymous
your feigning to not understand, reframing the topic and fragmentary sentences are cringe af
8 months ago
Anonymous
Man, shes a Ukraine israelite, that other anon posted her early life, she wasnt even born in Brazil. I dont know what your point is in this case
But your usage impliews this is something that happens more than in this case, so what do you mean with whites larping as ethnic? There are so many layers of confusion to this
First, you should ask yourself why gringos are so eager for "foreign, exotic" flavor that they lap up white people as if they were not white, same shit happens with South African writers
Second, you should ask yourself why did you expect Brazilian to be "ethnic" when there are all kinds of stablished communities in Brazil from Japs to Germans to Arabs etc that managed to stay homogeneous enough to be noticeable and to retain part of their culture
Third, you should ask yourself if thats not the effect of gringo press exoticizing stuff up for the sake of selling instead of the author "larping" as "ethnic"
Fourth, what if the life of a Brazilian white really is exotic and foreign to the eyes of an American white? Race is not the end all be all of exotic flavor
8 months ago
Anonymous
>But your usage impliews this is something that happens more than in this case, so what do you mean with whites larping as ethnic? There are so many layers of confusion to this
There's no confusion to this at all, it's entirely simply: she's not Brazilian and is writing as a Brazilian author. You can add layers of mystery to this but it's nothing overly different; it's a white tourist who is writing in dreary platitude and egoistic pathos to be consumed by her like-minded sisters in the suburbs of middle england, germany and new york. I mean, from what I've just read of her. There's a million other white women like her, wandering around india and africa wearing the local clothes and playing prophetess and guru.
>Third, you should ask yourself if thats not the effect of gringo press exoticizing stuff up for the sake of selling
WELL yes this is probably 90% of it, but even so.
8 months ago
Anonymous
I told the other anon that she is not Braizlian but he is half right, I mean, she came to Brazil when she was 2 years old. She was raised in Brazil. Shes not 100% pct brazilian so thats why I disagreed with that guy, but saying shes a tourist like white women in India is going too far in the other direction
8 months ago
Anonymous
>but saying shes a tourist like white women in India is going too far in the other direction
That's a fair point ... kind of... i don't know. I'd say not.
8 months ago
Anonymous
It would be a different thing if we were talking about an homogeneous society
If she was considered a Japanese writer because she moved to Japan when she was 2 years old, she would be more of a foreign. But Brazil doesnt have an ethnic identity. Theres everything in Brazil. Now there are mostly mutts and they are multiplying fast, but you can have a nordic guy, an indian looking guy, a japanese, a dark-as-night guy, and they wouldnt be out of place in Brazil like Clarice in Japan
8 months ago
Anonymous
She was a Brazilian author? I'm sure had she the ability to write in any other language she would have booked it out of Brazil at the drop of a hat. Dire literary tradition.
I read A hora da estrela with my gf. We agree that it's not shit, it's sometimes interesting, but she mostly talks about nothing at all. It's not deep, it's not philosophical. Her prose reads like a cargo cult philosophy, if you will: looks like the real thing only if you don't know what it is.
Was about to post the same.
That is indeed the problem with her. Lots of abstract concepts, "joy", "hope", "understanding", "knowledge", etc. but no philosophical content at all. She is not like Goethe, Dostoevksy, or Borges, there's just nothing in it but "feels".
She's not a particularly great writer either. Nothing impressive about her Portuguese prose. It's the feminine equivalent of the empty rhetoric of a political speech: words words words signifying nothing.
Here's a random passage:
"See, my love, I am losing the courage to find whatever it is I shall have to find, I am losing the courage to give myself over to the road itself, and I am now promising us that in that Hell I shall find hope.
"Perhaps it is not the ancient hope. Perhaps it cannot even be called hope."
I was struggling because I did not want an unknown joy. It would be as forbidden by my future salvation as the forbidden beast that was called impure—and I was opening and closing my mouth in torture to call for help, but then it still hadn't occurred to me to invent this hand that I have now invented to hold mine. In my fear yesterday I was alone, and I wanted to ask for help against my first dehumanization.
Dehumanization is as painful as losing everything, as losing everything, my love. I was opening and closing my mouth to call for help but I neither could nor knew how to enunciate."
It's essentially self-help for middle class women who are afraid of being caught reading self-help books. The kind who go to Bali every once in a while in order to "find themselves".
and i thought it couldn't get worse than Paulo Coelho's tepid and empty self-help "spiritualism". somehow this is worse.
https://i.imgur.com/LbbhPBx.jpg
So is she actually good or just being astroturfed
Astroturfed.
She was the same kind of "empty profound" in interviews and as a person, and others like her (Buarque, etc) were already shills.
curiously also all libertine-leaning almost commies. they were the artistic 'resistance' during the military dictatorship period, becaude of 'le freedom of speech', which promptly turned into drivel (worse than it was while censored) when it all came down.
>Lots of abstract concepts, "joy", "hope", "understanding", "knowledge", etc. but no philosophical content at all.
And this is why Lispector is in "men will never understand" tier. Lispector is a woman and her books are solely for women. Her writing is meant to represent the "how" of feeling, but not "what" is felt or thought; that part the reader fills in like water fills a receptacle. Masculine literature is communicative: the writer has idea X and wants to say X, there, done. Feminine literature is meant for the reader to project herself into it: it's mean to adapt itself to what the reader is feeling and reflect that feeling. It acquires its meaning in the reading.
So when in The Passion According to GH, the narrator says she "became a now", what does "a now" mean? In itself, nothing. Maybe Lispector has an idea of what "becoming a now" is to her, but she does not expect her reader to share it. The narrator does not exist as a separate individual from the reader. The reader, a woman, will read that she "became a now" and the sentence will assume the meaning of what "becoming a now" is to this reader.
A man will read that GH "became a now", ask what the frick it means, get no answer and close the book, thinking Lispector a pretentious b***h.
Lispector is a mirror for women to project themselves onto. It's obvious men will see nothing in such a surface. All female novels are this in an essence, but Lispector is one of the writers that really does away with most trappings of objectivity.
Your analysis is great but your example was poor
Becoming a now is a mirror for projwction as you say, and the reader mimics her feeling, but its pretty clear it means a heightened perceptiion of the flowing of time, of the present moment
On bit sized quantities Clarice is digesteable even if she seems pretentious
The problem is when you have a bookful of these sentences and nothing for you to chew on, its all smokes and a vaguely defined plot that doesnt matter much
Her literature comes from the Modernism Era that was happening on Brazil, their goal was to basically deconstruct what was literature and you know the idea already it has been done in other fields too
The first eras don't have a lot to say, they just want to deconstruct what literature can be
When did she larp as ethnic?
Yes, her literature is taught in schools and appears in national exams too
>There's a million other white women like her, wandering around india and africa wearing the local clothes and playing prophetess and guru.
eating up my inheritance and grandads money to finance their holidays mind you
I'm sorry, but "The devil to pay in the backlands" is fricking eternal
8 months ago
Anonymous
In the year 5,307 there will be men reading "The devil to pay in the backlands".
8 months ago
Anonymous
Also, it is a spoiler-heavy book. There are heavy, heavy twists. So please don't read any moronic reviews or twisted comentaries on it
8 months ago
Anonymous
It's honestly a book where the plot itself matters very very little. Getting spoiled should not be a big deal.
8 months ago
Anonymous
I disagree. The plot is uncanny. He doesn't even know if the Devil has accepted his offer.
8 months ago
Anonymous
And the favour he asks from the Devil involves his very being, his way of life, his upbringing and his utmost sexuality. He deals it all directly with the Devil. A book for the ages, sorry
8 months ago
Anonymous
It's honestly a book where the plot itself matters very very little. Getting spoiled should not be a big deal.
I'm sorry, but "The devil to pay in the backlands" is fricking eternal
He wanted to be Joyce but wiyh regional flavor, inventing words like the repentistas from the northeast do
Reading it in Enlgish is reading a completely different book prose wise
8 months ago
Anonymous
>Reading it in Enlgish is reading a completely different book prose wise
Yes. Still pretty powerful shit. Clarice be damned
8 months ago
Anonymous
I agree
8 months ago
Anonymous
You are so wrong. He presents a mythical Brazil. Historians and geographers have gone through the places he vividly describes and they simply never existed. The world is entirely plausible, yet entirely fictional what the actual frick it is like a South American Lord of the Rings tbh
Astro
Good to know people here still have a head over their shoulders
Im Brazilian and I never understood how can people like her
Its all just effect as you said, all style, no substance
She used to be widely quoted on Facebook because of that, she is very quotable, but in a vague, banal way. The anon that said cargo cult was really incisive, thats the best way to describe it. She uses loaded words but no structure to support them
Contrast that with Anais Nin, which, to me, was the epitome of the female brained female writer: she also has this declarative, actress like voice like Clarice when writing, but she actually has good insights, especially about the female condition (bonus point for this, by itself, being an example of the inafe female narcissism). And she was a real BPD hoe on top of that, she fricked half her entire generations writers and artists, and even fricked her father for many years
Are you the brazilian anon that despises Lispector? Because that's fricking based
I think I am, unless there are more of us. Probably there are
>and even fricked her father for many years
really?
yes
A fringe, controversial position, largely proven as false by Academia research. Her writing is shit, though
No. Brazilians are still seething so hard at some mousy Ukrainian b***h coming over and BTFOing their barely existent literary culture, that they make up bullshit accusations like this.
Learn to read, stupid Jamal. He's talking about Anaïs Nin.
I'm sorry what?
Sorry. I forgot, Lispector gets accused of fricking her university professors.
That is partly true
Is Pessoa popular in Brazil at least
moron
what language do brazilians speak again?
Portuguese
No. No Brazilian literature is popular in Brazil. It is more like a "Game of Thrones" vibe among the readership, if you get my meaning. The most obvious stuff like JGR get a respectful awe at a distance. JGR is actually hot to the touch
Annoying b***hes shilled by borderline prostitutes that think they are profund
t.brazilian
you guys really have a white people larping as 'ethnic' problem in south america, this woman from her picture looks like a local brit.
She was born in hungary or something
And who in Brazil is white but larps as ethnic?
She was a holol israelite whose parents moved her to Brazil
I mean that that's a pleb stock white lady who is likely only being read because she looks like her audience in england and america, and brings them a sense of vicarious ethnic flavor. since you were curious and asked why.
or probably this, as equally likely.
Takes 3 seconds to google
>and brings them a sense of vicarious ethnic flavor
What the hell do you mean by "ethnic flavor"?
When on Earth did she larp as ethnic?
Lispector is a white Brazilian.
What are you on about?
Do you think Brazilian = "ethnic"? Maybe England marketeers larp her as an ethnic?
Lispector was always clear about her origins and no one in Brazil thinks of her as anything other than white.
Most Brazilian authors are white, and are seen as white by everyone.
Brazil is a Western country of European origins, specially when it comes to its elite, which is as European, and in fact used to be much more European, than that of, e.g., the US, including at the time when Lispector started writing.
Portuguese was not even her mother tongue.
>Brazilian = "ethnic"? Maybe England marketeers larp her as an ethnic?
>"ethnic flavor"?
seriously pendejo this is getting annoying, see other anon:
if you truly do not understand what we're saying here
The other anon is, ironically, myself.
There is nothing "ethnic" in that paragraph.
Lispector *IS* definitely Brazilian.
You know nothing about Brazil.
And "pendejo" is not a word we use here, sorry.
I am the other guy discussing with the guy you are also discussing, Im Brazilian too, and sorry but Clarice is not Brazilian
Unless you are some R*ddit/FFLCH imbecile for whom "real" Brazilian = índio/black, Lispector was very much a Brazilian.
Brazil is a country of immigrants, and the Brazilian elite specially, like the Argentine one, is an elite mostly composed of European immigrants, and the children and grandchildren of European immigrants.
Lispector was Brazilian, Otto Maria Carpeaux was Brazilian, Paulo Ronai was Brazilian...
You can "become" Brazilian in a way that you cannot "become" Japanese, because BR identity is not ethnicity-based.
>she's not Brazilian and is writing as a Brazilian author
She was an Ukrainian-born Brazilian, and wrote as herself, a white Brazilian of middle/upper class, of European culture, and influenced by European literature.
>, a white Brazilian of middle/upper class, of European culture, and influenced by European literature
that's what we've been saying she's a globohomo, that's what they all are.
I just used the dame Braizl x Japan comoarison when discussing with the other guy. I think I fall in the middle of both of you. You think shes 100% Brazilian, he thinks shes 100% foreigner, I think she is Brazilian but not as Brazilian as a native born Brazilian, pre-mutted
>Lispector *IS* definitely Brazilian.
urgh birther nationalism
>You Brazilian muts are beyond it. Thats like saying anyone who didn't float in with the Mayflower isn't American.
I'm English actually and I don't think the Spanish, Italians, Germans, Scots and Irish wandering around in the Amerindes are anything other than what they are.May God grant them the santy to recognize this and end their foolishness of pretending to be something they are not, then we can wrap up this ghastly american tax rebellion and bring world peace.
Lispector is not Brazilian
Starting to develop genuine sympathy for Lispector here. You Brazilian muts are beyond it. Thats like saying anyone who didn't float in with the Mayflower isn't American.
Not born in Brazil. Not Brazilian. You’re the moronic McCucker-Rooney troon
I knew you guys were impoverished, but they should really think to invest in updating your civics curriculum to include more modern definitions of citizenship.
My bad. Respect that take more than all the hairsplitting going on itt
>
urgh birther nationalism
[...]
>You Brazilian muts are beyond it. Thats like saying anyone who didn't float in with the Mayflower isn't American.
I'm English actually and I don't think the Spanish, Italians, Germans, Scots and Irish wandering around in the Amerindes are anything other than what they are.May God grant them the santy to recognize this and end their foolishness of pretending to be something they are not, then we can wrap up this ghastly american tax rebellion and bring world peace. (You)
>My bad. Respect that
I might add that they are cooking under the sun and it boils their brains and makes them mad, like the eastern europeans squatting in palestine at this moment in time. that's 99% of the problem.
>Brazil is a Western country of European origins
Is that what they actually taught you in your ridiculous college? I mean, really? lol. Look around you, you deluded, disgusting homosexual
It is more like Afrika. And that's precisely why Grandes Sertões is so monumental
I have some news to you that you might find shocking about the demographic history of the Americas.
yes i know they're all mudblood colonists. i'm speaking to the aztec remnant, however, who should machette these people and be done with it..
>you guys really have a white people larping as 'ethnic' problem in south america
I have never, not once in my life seen anyone doing that.
Do you have any examples?
>
(You)
>>you guys really have a white people larping as 'ethnic' problem in south america
>I have never, not once in my life seen anyone doing that.
>Do you have any examples?
sure:
and confirmed lol
When did she larp as ethnic?
In her interviews and writings
How can you larp as ethnic? Saying uga buga? What does that even mean, she wasnt even born in Brazil
isnt that her USP? she's marketed as a Brazilian author.
you're really being obtuse about this, i know you know what i mean. the puta is not an inca.
Half of Brazilians look Med
I dont understand the shock
You thought there were only mutts?
your feigning to not understand, reframing the topic and fragmentary sentences are cringe af
Man, shes a Ukraine israelite, that other anon posted her early life, she wasnt even born in Brazil. I dont know what your point is in this case
But your usage impliews this is something that happens more than in this case, so what do you mean with whites larping as ethnic? There are so many layers of confusion to this
First, you should ask yourself why gringos are so eager for "foreign, exotic" flavor that they lap up white people as if they were not white, same shit happens with South African writers
Second, you should ask yourself why did you expect Brazilian to be "ethnic" when there are all kinds of stablished communities in Brazil from Japs to Germans to Arabs etc that managed to stay homogeneous enough to be noticeable and to retain part of their culture
Third, you should ask yourself if thats not the effect of gringo press exoticizing stuff up for the sake of selling instead of the author "larping" as "ethnic"
Fourth, what if the life of a Brazilian white really is exotic and foreign to the eyes of an American white? Race is not the end all be all of exotic flavor
>But your usage impliews this is something that happens more than in this case, so what do you mean with whites larping as ethnic? There are so many layers of confusion to this
There's no confusion to this at all, it's entirely simply: she's not Brazilian and is writing as a Brazilian author. You can add layers of mystery to this but it's nothing overly different; it's a white tourist who is writing in dreary platitude and egoistic pathos to be consumed by her like-minded sisters in the suburbs of middle england, germany and new york. I mean, from what I've just read of her. There's a million other white women like her, wandering around india and africa wearing the local clothes and playing prophetess and guru.
>Third, you should ask yourself if thats not the effect of gringo press exoticizing stuff up for the sake of selling
WELL yes this is probably 90% of it, but even so.
I told the other anon that she is not Braizlian but he is half right, I mean, she came to Brazil when she was 2 years old. She was raised in Brazil. Shes not 100% pct brazilian so thats why I disagreed with that guy, but saying shes a tourist like white women in India is going too far in the other direction
>but saying shes a tourist like white women in India is going too far in the other direction
That's a fair point ... kind of... i don't know. I'd say not.
It would be a different thing if we were talking about an homogeneous society
If she was considered a Japanese writer because she moved to Japan when she was 2 years old, she would be more of a foreign. But Brazil doesnt have an ethnic identity. Theres everything in Brazil. Now there are mostly mutts and they are multiplying fast, but you can have a nordic guy, an indian looking guy, a japanese, a dark-as-night guy, and they wouldnt be out of place in Brazil like Clarice in Japan
She was a Brazilian author? I'm sure had she the ability to write in any other language she would have booked it out of Brazil at the drop of a hat. Dire literary tradition.
>you guys really have a white people larping as 'ethnic' problem in south america
Huh? She's a israelite...
I read A hora da estrela with my gf. We agree that it's not shit, it's sometimes interesting, but she mostly talks about nothing at all. It's not deep, it's not philosophical. Her prose reads like a cargo cult philosophy, if you will: looks like the real thing only if you don't know what it is.
Was about to post the same.
That is indeed the problem with her. Lots of abstract concepts, "joy", "hope", "understanding", "knowledge", etc. but no philosophical content at all. She is not like Goethe, Dostoevksy, or Borges, there's just nothing in it but "feels".
She's not a particularly great writer either. Nothing impressive about her Portuguese prose. It's the feminine equivalent of the empty rhetoric of a political speech: words words words signifying nothing.
Here's a random passage:
"See, my love, I am losing the courage to find whatever it is I shall have to find, I am losing the courage to give myself over to the road itself, and I am now promising us that in that Hell I shall find hope.
"Perhaps it is not the ancient hope. Perhaps it cannot even be called hope."
I was struggling because I did not want an unknown joy. It would be as forbidden by my future salvation as the forbidden beast that was called impure—and I was opening and closing my mouth in torture to call for help, but then it still hadn't occurred to me to invent this hand that I have now invented to hold mine. In my fear yesterday I was alone, and I wanted to ask for help against my first dehumanization.
Dehumanization is as painful as losing everything, as losing everything, my love. I was opening and closing my mouth to call for help but I neither could nor knew how to enunciate."
It's essentially self-help for middle class women who are afraid of being caught reading self-help books. The kind who go to Bali every once in a while in order to "find themselves".
and i thought it couldn't get worse than Paulo Coelho's tepid and empty self-help "spiritualism". somehow this is worse.
Astroturfed.
She was the same kind of "empty profound" in interviews and as a person, and others like her (Buarque, etc) were already shills.
curiously also all libertine-leaning almost commies. they were the artistic 'resistance' during the military dictatorship period, becaude of 'le freedom of speech', which promptly turned into drivel (worse than it was while censored) when it all came down.
>Lots of abstract concepts, "joy", "hope", "understanding", "knowledge", etc. but no philosophical content at all.
And this is why Lispector is in "men will never understand" tier. Lispector is a woman and her books are solely for women. Her writing is meant to represent the "how" of feeling, but not "what" is felt or thought; that part the reader fills in like water fills a receptacle. Masculine literature is communicative: the writer has idea X and wants to say X, there, done. Feminine literature is meant for the reader to project herself into it: it's mean to adapt itself to what the reader is feeling and reflect that feeling. It acquires its meaning in the reading.
So when in The Passion According to GH, the narrator says she "became a now", what does "a now" mean? In itself, nothing. Maybe Lispector has an idea of what "becoming a now" is to her, but she does not expect her reader to share it. The narrator does not exist as a separate individual from the reader. The reader, a woman, will read that she "became a now" and the sentence will assume the meaning of what "becoming a now" is to this reader.
A man will read that GH "became a now", ask what the frick it means, get no answer and close the book, thinking Lispector a pretentious b***h.
Lispector is a mirror for women to project themselves onto. It's obvious men will see nothing in such a surface. All female novels are this in an essence, but Lispector is one of the writers that really does away with most trappings of objectivity.
Your analysis is great but your example was poor
Becoming a now is a mirror for projwction as you say, and the reader mimics her feeling, but its pretty clear it means a heightened perceptiion of the flowing of time, of the present moment
On bit sized quantities Clarice is digesteable even if she seems pretentious
The problem is when you have a bookful of these sentences and nothing for you to chew on, its all smokes and a vaguely defined plot that doesnt matter much
Damn, did you just copy/paste from mediocre open-access thesis
Her literature comes from the Modernism Era that was happening on Brazil, their goal was to basically deconstruct what was literature and you know the idea already it has been done in other fields too
The first eras don't have a lot to say, they just want to deconstruct what literature can be
Yes, her literature is taught in schools and appears in national exams too
>her literature is taught in schools and appears in national exams too
so?
I swear Brazilians must have some unique ass backwards way of defining ethnic. Like your trying to describe umami by calling it sweet.
she good
genuinely didn't immediately assume she was israeli but.. guess i shoulda figured
>חיה פּינקאַסיװנאַ ליספּעקטאָר
>Brazilian
>There's a million other white women like her, wandering around india and africa wearing the local clothes and playing prophetess and guru.
eating up my inheritance and grandads money to finance their holidays mind you
she is good at describing inexplicable sansations. the ploblem is that they are often specific to her.
>describing inexplicable
>inexplicable
Uhhh huhhhhh
THE COMPLETE GUIDE OF BRAZILIAN IQfy
1800's - 1922's (week of modern art) = Legendary Tier
1922' - Today = Shit
Dont be a moron, please. There are one or two works in there that are fricking godly
such as?
Ever heard of this lil song bird called Clarice?
Ah, I though you meant godly, not shitty.
I'm sorry, but "The devil to pay in the backlands" is fricking eternal
In the year 5,307 there will be men reading "The devil to pay in the backlands".
Also, it is a spoiler-heavy book. There are heavy, heavy twists. So please don't read any moronic reviews or twisted comentaries on it
It's honestly a book where the plot itself matters very very little. Getting spoiled should not be a big deal.
I disagree. The plot is uncanny. He doesn't even know if the Devil has accepted his offer.
And the favour he asks from the Devil involves his very being, his way of life, his upbringing and his utmost sexuality. He deals it all directly with the Devil. A book for the ages, sorry
He wanted to be Joyce but wiyh regional flavor, inventing words like the repentistas from the northeast do
Reading it in Enlgish is reading a completely different book prose wise
>Reading it in Enlgish is reading a completely different book prose wise
Yes. Still pretty powerful shit. Clarice be damned
I agree
You are so wrong. He presents a mythical Brazil. Historians and geographers have gone through the places he vividly describes and they simply never existed. The world is entirely plausible, yet entirely fictional what the actual frick it is like a South American Lord of the Rings tbh
She definitely has a few peak moments of hers
>Brazil is a Western country of European origins
LMFAO
The Devil to Pay in the Backlands is where it's at