Why are so many people still getting CS degrees when the tech industry is pretty much dead and you have an almost zero percent chance of ever getting a job now? When the dot com crash happened in the early 2000s, CS enrollment fell off a cliff, but this time it just keeps growing. Is it just delusion at this point?
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Im trans btw
because of blackrock
It's the fastest growing market segment in terms of profits for the big pharmaceutical corporations EVER.
*nods*
Should move them to urban planning, civil engineering and construction majors to help out our housing crisis instead.
Learn to build is the new learn to code, over a billion more babies will be born in the next 25 years, all needing room and board.
>over a billion more babies will be born in the next 25 years
More than a billion will die in the same timespan. The housing market is collapsing.
the housing crisis in the US is purely caused by zoning and construction laws
>oey vey goyim, its just these pesky zoning and construction laws
tell me more rabbi. surely it has nothing to do with the 100 million immigrants let into the country. weird how bill gates literally said this was his plan 20 years ago.
https://news.microsoft.com/1997/03/04/bill-gates-outlines-microsofts-educational-initiatives-for-india/
>lol lets set up thirdies to do computer science so we can have cheap waggies lmao
It's both
>inflate the price of already competitive real estate, while bringing illegals in
>prevent the construction of affordable starter homes using zoning and construction laws
>funnel every normal, law abiding citizen into a goyzone
But they can't. That's the problem, they're fricking idiots and produce garbage.
The housing crisis is caused by morons who think everyone should live in the same couple of trendy neighborhoods in the center of the city. There is no housing crisis outside of those areas.
>But there are no jobs out there.
That's a different issue and nowhere near as true as those who can't fathom living away from an urban center would have you believe. Once you get past midwit levels of thinking, you can see the entire landscape, how to make it work for you, and what chumps most people are following the flock wherever it goes.
No. Now it’s rural towns making building/subdividing hard to keep immigrants out.
There isn’t actually a housing shortage, we’re in the early stages of a political crisis.
>how to make it work for you
please enlighten us
> make six figures finally
> go to buy house not in california
> houses near cities are half a million $
> houses in bum frick nowhere do not have broadband infrastructure for remote work
> ???
>houses in bum frick nowhere do not have broadband infrastructure for remote work
Starlink is $120 dollars a month, this isn't an issue anymore.
>Once you get past midwit levels of thinking
Ironing.
It was also caused by new housing supply dropping to nothing for a year during covid, which created a situation with more demand than supply.
>purely caused by zoning and construction laws
This but all of Europe as well.
And the fact that government builds the roads.
Governments literally eminent domain private housing so they can add more lanes.
If roads were privatized, this would be a non-issue.
>over a billion more babies will be born in the next 25 years
Nah watch as the population starts plummeting soon as the globalist regime commences stage 2 of it's genocide.
We're currently in stage 1 still, though covid has begun the shift in centralised control over the planet.
>to help out our housing crisis instead.
We don't have a housing crisis. We have a "boomers landlording and Blackrock buying the houses" problem.
There is PLENTY of houses all around the nation for adults 18+. The ISSUE is: They're all owned by Boomers (to rent out) and/or owned by Blackrock because the housing costs have risen beyond 2-3 entire generations of wealth.
There's not enough over time, and it's fricking insane to want to turn every continent into a sea of concrete commieblocks. Frick off with your infinite growth Black person cult.
The problem is not that we lack urban planning, civil engineering or related workers, the problem is the bullshit bureaucracy and red tape they have to go through to get a permit to build anything. The cities are incentivized to limit housing supply to make line go up.
Also the newer generations all wanting to pile into urban centers and don't want to live in rural areas or flyover states. They also apparently like living with all the illegals flooding into the cities.
>Also the newer generations all wanting to pile into urban centers and don't want to live in rural areas
this has been happening since the industrial revolution first kicked off in the 1700s
construction is corrupt asf everywhere in the world
it is also bloated to frick, and the contracts are fricked
Historically, organized crime has been deeply entangled in the construction industry, and this is still true in most corners of the world today.
Your boss will grind you into a thin oily paste while skirting every possible safety regulation that exists. Then, when you inevitably get injured or your body finally gives out and you can no longer be productive, he'll just call up his "business partners" to fold you into an oil drum and embed it into a concrete pillar, and just hire a Mexican to take your place.
They don't pay, and they don't have jobs.
>help out our housing crisis instead
How stupid do you have to be to think urban planning will magically cease the existence of landlords and oligarchs?
>urban planning, civil engineering and construction
being CS dropouts and likely attracted to consumer tech and popsci, they will most certainly gravitate towards Modernism in the domain of architecture and urban planning. We definitely don't need more soulless suburban sprawl centered around the automobile. These are not good communities to live in and none of the freeways work any more because all of the wage slaves congest it with their daily three hour commute to the cubical farm.
the kinds of people who fail cs don't have the rigor for civil engineering or construction
cs is not a difficult field compared to engineering
I can't wait to build even more houses that will be owned by some rental company before they're even finished but will stay vacant until they turn to dust.
>but this time it just keeps growing
a crash similar to the dot com crash hasn't occurred yet
Part of ne expects a similar crash once people find out AI is only good for dicking around and computers are nowhere near capable enough for the cost to offset
People already know AI is shit. It's the CEO's that are huffing their own farts and moronic venture capitalists that are attempting to make it a thing.
>ou have an almost zero percent chance of ever getting a job now
But I have a tech job anon and I also have a degree in painting. Maybe you just suck and cannot communicate well in interviews.
There are plenty of CS-related jobs out there, but the times of getting a 6 figure job straight out of undergrad are mostly over (unless you get hired in NYC/Cali, in which case the COL basically halves your salary anyway). Also like this anon said very few tech workers nowadays actually spend most of their day cooding, if you ever want to get past junior SWE level then you need some leadership and communication skills like everyone else
>if you ever want to get past junior SWE level
What are you talking about? The junior positions are the hardest ones to find. The problem isn't getting promoted when you already have a job, it's getting a job in the first place, and it's pretty much going to be impossible from here on out until we have another major global recession, the fed cuts interest rates back to 0, and half a decade of recovery has passed.
we've been in a recession for a while
Bidenomics!
>The junior positions are the hardest ones to find
you had 24 years to get a job
It’s the only degree with getting because it’s the easiest one that you can instantly call bullshit when the professor says something moronic. (Other than math but you don’t make money with math degrees.)
> (Other than math but you don’t make money with math degrees.)
computer science IS a math degree though anon.....................
>computer science IS a math degree
you mathlet homosexuals also claim that physics is math
no matter how much you say it, it ain't so
It most definitely is not. If my CS degree is a math degree, then how come I barely know any calculus?
Because you're moronic
Maybe so, I am here after all, but nonetheless I wasn't taught any calculus in my CS curriculum.
sorry bud, your state has a poor requirement for CS then. in my state all universities are mandated to teach calculus 1, 2, and 3 for a CS degree.
He probably is, but it isn't really his fault if he received a poor education. You cannot filter morons without challenging them.
Because you went to podunk state because you heard it was a good party school instead of MIT. Legit CS programs require calculus.
>instead of MIT
You pretty much need a perfect SAT score to even be considered for admission into MIT. That's like 140+ iq.
it absolutely is not
even applied math for say, becoming an actuary, has an iq floor like 10 points higher than that needed for CS
it isn't, math is much harder than CS, CS was created exactly because people wanted to get into computers with the least amount of math possible, the founders of CS were mathematicians, but CS people are not.
Now that I am in the industry myself, I realize that this field is the biggest pile of shit you could possible work in. All your intellect will be dedicated to endlessly learning different tools that do the exact same thing to solve problems that have been solved decades ago. Businesses are run by people who are ignorant of what technology can do for them. This is why you have morons fantasizing about replacing warehouse laborers with walking robots rather than something simpler that they could have had 10 or 15 years ago which might have offered the same efficiency gain.
>All your intellect will be dedicated to endlessly learning different tools that do the exact same thing to solve problems that have been solved decades ago
And learning the tools becomes a competition so you can one up yoir coworkers and avoid getting laid off. Frameworks and useless tools are such a scourge. Getting the job done efficiently usually does not matter. Corporations are too big to fail anyway. I have already accepted the tech field is thoroughly moronic.
The sad reality of webshitters
It used to be a decent employer would pay for learning (by new training). Tech workers fricked themselves by doing this on their own & by allowing all of India to work in this country.
I don't blame them. Getting a CS job in the states basically means you won at life. The work is incredibly easy for the amount of pay you get.
After high school CS was the only thing I could think of as the alternatives were even worse.
>Continue working in a dead-end warehouse job with minimal wage
>Too stupid for Math major, and no jobs available anyway
>Physics/CE/EE/other engineering majors are all super boring unless you are into that
I did a CS degree, because it was either that or being a useless low-paid/unemployed NEET.
Really?
I didn't do CS, but I began to cram programming knowledge thanks to covid ruining my career path for good and forcing me to the fringe.
That and I'm concerned we're already in an algorithmic nightmare that is fricking with people now. Digging more into programming has convinced this more to me.
>only thing I could think of as the alternatives were even worse.
>it was either that or being a useless low-paid/unemployed NEET.
> implying being a NEET is worse
Whether people know it's shit or not it'll keep going until we have another economic downturn (or the government stops propping up the economy) and some bank with insufficient liquidity that's overleveraged into AI startups fails.
What do you mean? Canadian industry associations are still paying for news articles screeching that there's a shortage of employees. The government must do something!
It's because of pajeets. Look at how they run their country. Know what India needs more of? Anything but more Indians. But Indian politicians still talk about increasing the birth rate over there. Think they need more call center workers, webshitters, data center techs, etc? Nope. But they're too moronic to stop.
i was 13 when i got super interested in the field and it was 2016, so i chose to focus on this in highschool and then started my university degree in 2022 and since then the field has just overgrown
why the frick did this happen? is it randos that are inflating the field lately or is it actually the wave of people of my age from around 2017 that are finally getting out of universities and getting jobs?
can anyone that has a better view on this tell me?
this situation stinks to me, but it'd accept it if it was the wave of people of my age
the classes were packed in 2010 when i graduated. everyone wanted to be a cs major. i knew it was unsustainable even back then.
zoomies are getting into the field to learn how to do basic computing
but so many people get degrees though
and it's not as easy as people make it seem, you need to put a lot of effort to understand things like algorithms and data structures and to be properly rigorous about them
and despite the effort i can confidently say i dont understand things as in depth as i would like
does everyone actually manage to get past these courses without understanding anything? i cant imagine these type of people putting so much effort into it, and yet it's full of self centered people who brag about their exams scores online
>let's get Word open
This sentence has never been uttered in a CS class.
Silicon Valley happenned. In the early 2010s it was possible to get a 500k $ salary with basic programming skills so there was a gold rush to get into programming. Fast forward to today and not only the field is overcrowded, the average junior is expected to know and use hundreds of different technologies from git to esoteric concepts like microservices.
Best part? Most of them do nothing but shitty programs that interact with databases. It was always unsustainable.
CS is also the field where all the boys who don't know what to do with their lives gravitate towards. It's the Psychology of STEM.
>CS is also the field where all the boys who don't know what to do with their lives gravitate towards
this pisses me off even more, it's beyond me
is it an hype train they jump on without knowing how it'll be or is actually easy for most people? i dont get it
hope you dont mind, but what about my other reply
this was supposed to be a comfy field, and now it's the most cancerous you can get into, it feels like i got scammed, except i still care about the topics... just not the people
i was thinking of doing a physics degree too later on because i was interested in it, do i have to fricking expect people to ruin it as well
i hate this world
Can you only enjoy learning something if no one else chooses to do the same thing as you?
...frick, i think so
what the frick do i do
sauce
relife
that's chizuru's way of smiling so she's totally fricking autistic
Lmao, when I graduated Business was the degree for people who didn't know what they wanted to do in their lives.
was this before cs? if not, what happened after?
>because we all have advanced degrees
ideally wouldn't you be able to get a job with less advanced requirements? like getting one that only requires a bachelors or a master
im an undergrad so idk anything about this
>was this before cs?
2018
It seems like CS has become the major for people that don't know what they want to do, but want a job (and tbf, it was basically the only field with the openings to place most undergrads in the jobs they studied for from 2009-2022 ish)
>ideally wouldn't you be able to get a job with less advanced requirements? like getting one that only requires a bachelors or a master
>im an undergrad so idk anything about this
You can get a job with a Bachelor's degree, but you will eventually hit a ceiling in R&D. But overall a BSc will allow you to start working sooner and make more overall, but you'll have to start at the bottom and work your way up.
>Also, biotech in general is notoriously boom or bust. After product development it's not uncommon to just lay off the entire research team that developed because you don't need them anymore.
Yup, this is exactly where we're at right now. I graduated with my PhD a few months ago and now I'm dealing with this. Talk about bad timing. What are you doing now?
>you'll have to start at the bottom and work your way up
i may have not understood you correctly, but if i did, i was talking about yourself
like getting a job a bachelors would get even though you have a phd
Oh I see what you're saying, but unfortunately, no, that's not an option. A company won't hire a PhD to do Bachelor's level work, because they: 1) have a ton of other applicants who are also applying to the position, and 2) they know you're going to leave ASAP once you get another position (and they're right kek).
Awesome, happy to see you were able to successfully pivot. I'm looking to do the same and this gives me hope. Best of luck to you as well anon.
>they know you're going to leave ASAP
fuuuuck i see, that's so bad
does this mean im going to make things harder for myself if i do masters (doubt phd but who knows) even though i would be fine with a bachelors level job?
unless you get more enjoyable jobs when they're higher level, but as of now i wasn't planning to care about that
It depends on your field, but in biotech/pharma a MSc is said to be worthless for the most part. At least with a Bachelor's degree you can work and gain experience, which is incredibly valuable, and with a PhD you have shown competency in pacing yourself and project management. On top of that, a PhD program in STEM should be fully funded so there's no debt unlike a Master's program that are usually not funded. You should look at job postings on LinkedIn for your field and see what they're asking for. I've heard that companies will pay for employees to go to school, so if you were to go in the workforce with a BSc, then that option will hopefully be available and you'll earn a MSc without paying a dime. If you're still in school then I want to stress the importance of going to job fairs and going to conferences. This is where you'll meet many useful people and you'll get a foot in the door instead of competing with a bunch of randos from India and whoever else applying online.
To summarize, experience is the most valuable thing you can have. Internships, co-opts, etc. are all great and take advantage of these while you can. Degrees are fine but they do not replace experience.
>What are you doing now?
I pivoted to Data Analytics and I'm hoping to work my way into Data Engineering eventually. I'm in a similar position though; the market is dog shit, and it's hard to find advancement opportunities, so I'm just hunkering down, skill building, and networking while I wait for things to blow over.
Having a science or research background is surprisingly valuable to most business because the assumption is that you have hands-on experience gathering and working with opaque and complex data sets. Also, you're very likely to have a fairly strong practical background in math and statistics, even if it's something fluffy like Sociology or Psychology. The trick is how to pitch this experience in the context of their own business needs.
I'm pulling for you, Anon. Best of luck.
a bunch of """product managers""" being fired from the "tech industry" doesn't mean tech is dead, nor are tech careers dead for competent programmers.
the market is dead
I thought you might see signs of improvement in 2025. Now, you might see improvement in 2026.
>when the tech industry is pretty much dead
It's not dead, the main problemo here is that the people at all the big corpos thought that the bonanza times from the pandemic with people spending money hand over fist for meaningless shit would last basically forever, but people aren't inside they homes anymore, and we're entering head first to an even worse recession than the 2008 one, it's obvious people would save on spending much, more so without the free pandemic money.
Or the big corpos realized that they own money printers and could fire employees and not see any hurt for multiple quarters? It's the paradigm adopted by so many other corps in other markets so the major tech corporations wouldn't be immune forever. Eventually they'd have the critical mass of managers who think and act like all the other managers that this had to happen. Then it's monkey-see monkey-do both in reality and in the articles regularly read by the industry's management.
Capital hates capitalism so whenever they should be working hard to develop the domestic job market or increasing wages to meet the demands of scarce talent, they instead prefer to go crying to government to make the booboo better. Or collude corruptly amongst one-another. Or both!
>the tech industry is pretty much dead
there's masses of jobs out there, we're still hiring
it's just the silly valley giants that are laying people off, but they're very much not the only employers
>there's masses of jobs out there, we're still hiring
your employer may be hiring
the job market is dead
I've gotten ONE legitimate hot opportunity call in the last 4 months
the issue is with you,not the market. You have main character syndrome like a woman. You're neither as important or good as you think you are.
Because most goycattle are living BEHIND reality. It will take them a long time, years, to catch up.
Because they don't to working at 3 am in fricking McDonald's
>Why are so many people still getting CS degrees when the tech industry is pretty much dead and you have an almost zero percent chance of ever getting a job now? When the dot com crash happened in the early 2000s, CS enrollment fell off a cliff, but this time it just keeps growing. Is it just delusion at this point?
The israelites are trying to trick everyone who is capable of a non-tech job into giving that up so when they *really* announce AI they can mass layoff everyone and strand all these fake workers into total helplessness. Then those workers will accept global tyranny as the solution. Or worse, those workers will CLAMOUR for it.
Most of those homosexuals only care about money and frick over people like us who actually love tech
oh my god i am so tired of hearing this sad ass cope.
>t. got in for the money
kys live so we can enjoy
im becoming toxic like everybody else i should kill myself too
>doing a job for the money is wrong
What a childish position to take. If you think life is meant to be about other people paying you money to pursue your passions and hobbies then you're a naive nu male soi b***h who never grew up.
Nobody gets into roadwork because it was their interest and passion. They do it because they need to make a living, pay bills and put bread on the table for their family. Roadwork needs to be done and it pays.
Software development needs to be done and it pays too. Dev jobs don't exist so soi boy manchildren can follow their life long passion of sitting in a stuffy room at a computer, adding fonts and color schemes to their terminals and debating camelCase vs snake_case with their nerd friends. Dev jobs exist to generate money for the company and the shareholders.
>What a childish position to take
i guess you're right, as focusing on learning because you care and not to think of getting a job for you life later on is indeed considered childish by our society
You are so full of shit. "I'm an enlightened learner who pursues education for its own merit", yeah right loser, shut the frick up. If you were truly a seeker of wisdom, you would have already learned the folly of being a self-aggrandizing ass.
none of what you said is even remotely true
>pursues education for its own merit
no way in hell, education fricking sucks, exams are just tests to see how aligned to expectations and non-creative you are
if i wanted to learn because i like learning i would learn things by myself by taking time to read books
going to uni just makes things easier to learn, and right now i care about getting a good enough overview of the topics that exist, and the degree itself is just "proof of work", it's to be preemptive
>folly of being a self-aggrandizing ass
if i wanted to look smart to others i would just pretend and not make all this effort for it, just keep redoing the exams until i get full score on each one and then blab about it like everybody else
i wasn't lucky enough to be so smart as to be able to learn quickly, so this wouldn't be the path of least resistance i would take to be an butthole
>doing a job for the money is wrong
That's not the point.
>needs to be done and it pays too
Practice what you preach and prostitute yourself out
My uni isn't overcrowded but the industry definitely is, which is one of the reasons I'm dropping out. I'm considering learning a trade instead, any recommendations? Becoming an electrician sounds cool.
if i had to go trades i'd pick electrician first. i heard its hard to get into though depending on where you live since there's alot of demand.
My electrician & his work co-partner have no end of work. One worked a Fidelity & the other has an EE degree.
>electrician first
Why?
Imagine dropping out in 2001 after the dotcom bubble popped. Computers were just a fad, anyway.
No matter, what you pick, you're going to end up in crippling pain and your coworkers and clients are some of the biggest shitbags and cheapskates you will ever encounter for a salary worse than schoolteacher, when you account for how little teachers work.
Stop trying to gatekeep jobs moron, or you want more homeless on the streets?
Yes, especially jeets. Our civilization is totally unsustainable.
Gee, I wonder who could be behind this post.
A 192cm white-germanic man. Cope harder you fricking moronic homosexual. The world does not owe you luxury and happiness.
>germanic
LMAO, as expected.
Good morning sir, please be preparing to sleep in the designated shitting street batch
Nope, I'm a Slav, but nice try.
You sound like someone who started browsing /misc/ last week and then found IQfy to shitpost your moronic points.
I used to be <censored>. You've likely seen pictures of me. Spoiler alert: It all went to fricking shit in 2016-2018 and almost every pol narrative since then has been pure fricking horseshit. Online alt right whatever the frick is overrun with pants shittings morons that might as well be from Mumbai. Nupol is always wrong and Trump is a fricking israelite worshipping moron.
Anyway, I hope all of you die. Money worshippers are worse than Black folk and you're likely both.
>I used to be <censored>. You've likely seen pictures of me. Spoiler alert: It all went to fricking shit in 2016-2018 and almost every pol narrative since then has been pure fricking horseshit. Online alt right whatever the frick is overrun with pants shittings morons that might as well be from Mumbai. Nupol is always wrong and Trump is a fricking israelite worshipping moron.
>Anyway, I hope all of you die. Money worshippers are worse than Black folk and you're likely both.
>A 192cm white-germanic man. Cope harder you fricking moronic homosexual. The world does not owe you luxury and happiness.
aka israeli larping as germanic
Nah soon EVERYONE will need some CS knowledge. EVERYONE.
This is just the start.
Because I like programming you fricking gatekeeping homosexual.
>Why are so many people still getting CS degrees
Money.
>when the tech industry is pretty much dead and you have an almost zero percent chance of ever getting a job now?
First, this is an exaggeration. But more importantly it's going to take at least 10 years before this information makes it out to the masses.
Nah man, it's not money.
To me CS is just cybersecurity now and competence with understanding the effect machines have on our data and information in other fields of science.
CS should be mandatory knowledge at school, let alone university. We're not in 1970. Machines run our lives and their errors completely screw up our data now.
CS has just become part and parcel with all science. As it should have been.
You need to understand your instruments otherwise your data is meaningless to you. It could mean any fricking thing.
The problem is, most people aren't good enough to complete it, so we'd start to have shortages of scientists full stop. So we pretend the machines are infallible right now, when they're really not at all.
>Nah man, it's not money.
The vast majority of people in CS programs are there because of the promise of a 6-figure white collar salary.
The main problem is just less than 1% high autistic coders are need and for other 99% already other STEM majors or other degree take the jobs.
Normal CS students can't compete whole STEM, bootcamps, H1B and self taught coders
>almost zero percent chance of ever getting a job now?
okay come on now
its bad but not impossible
compute science majors could be good factory workers for the MIC given we are heading for a new Cold war I presume thats the endgame for most of us if we don't end up on the frontline.
I have several friends who work in HR. They keep repeating the mantra of "there's a trillon programming jobs available and they pay well." Of course they're too stupid to realize that the positions they recruit for require too much experience and an absurd amount of tech stack.
On the other hand there's a billion dollar industry of bootcamps and programmer influencers overselling the demand for these skills because that's basically their job.
Normies are still behind in this regard. They haven't realized the CS market is fricked and there's zero junior level positions available. I imagine it also has to do with the fact that CS is where stupid boys who have no idea what to do their life gravitate towards. They just think "I like videogames" and "I can install an antivirus" and equate that with "I should study programming."
>They haven't realized the CS market is fricked and there's zero junior level positions available. I
How are things if you have a couple years experience?
Shit
t. 5 years of (mediocre) experience
I am currently working on a CS degree. it gives me a sampling of many different topics so I can choose to go deeply into one, right now I am thinking AI because I'm intrigued by the power of parallel processing. I don't expect a degree to get me a job nor am I willing to play the phony LinkedIn game. My main motivation is to know how everything works so I go cyberpunk and maintain privacy and customization
Your IQ seems too low for university. I suggest doing military work or farm work instead.
It's WGU and my employer pays. My IQ is higher than most that i can tell you and I am a manual laborer it keeps me in great shape
I don't think your IQ is that high, you seem like a chink.
Probably higher than yours if you think I'm a chink
>wgu
>high iq
lol.
nobody is stopping you from enjoying your passion. in fact there are many projects you can contribute your time to for free. have at it
>nobody is stopping you from enjoying your passion
you're right, it's wise to do something about this
i need to find a way to just do what i like without polluting my mind with others opinions that mean nothing of value
probably get rid of the means by which i am fed this toxicity
unironically that is a good mindset. just dont be yet another sourpuss gay that some people want to earn a living. i like programming and i did it before i got a job and degree. wouldnt do it if it didnt pay well though.
i really have to try my best, because this is also making me dislikable irl
>i like programming and i did it before i got a job and degree
kek i guess this proves i shouldn't have insulted you, who would've guessed being toxic brings no good? it's almost as if i was part of the problem
you’re going to go far with your mindset, anon. Good luck 🙂
I'm all for learning for the sake of learning, but doing 4 years of college in a field as dry and dull of CS just for the sake of it doesn't sound like a good idea.
Progress in tech has far surpassed the public's implicit understanding of the limitations of tech. This means whenever they see something new, they think, "yeah it's obvious" and "why didn't they do this earlier?" and "this must be so easy".
Then when you tell them "new grads" get 100K starting, their eyes start fricking watering from excitement. They can't believe that fricking posting on instagram will get them a job!
People have NO FRICKING IDEA how much work getting a "simple", "trivial" phone to run an app is. You could spend five years learning the in and outs and still not cover everything.
Most people can't digest this. They have a degree, and that smart stuff is for smart people, but I was promised a $100K job after leetcode. Programming in your spare time? Yeah that's for the smart guys. Why'd I pick webshitting? Websites, man. I've been using them and apps forever.
>You could spend five years learning the in and outs and still not cover everything.
No you can't. iOS has an extremely simple and limited API that you can learn in a few weeks. Mobile app development is 10x easier than desktop app development, where you have significantly more complex APIs like Win32 and the freedom to do anything outside of it too, down to the lowest level assembly programming.
Contrary to popular belief, it's actually a really strong job market right now. It's just that the skillset that the market demands has shifted, and droves of new grads, juniors and pajeets got left behind.
Quick history lesson. As the economy recovered from the 2008 subprime mortgage crisis, demand in webshitter tech surged until reaching its all time high during corona. The 2010 - 2022 era saw any tard who could write fizzbuzz in javascript getting hired for solid six fig gigs straight out of a webdev bootcamp. Once corona ended, demand for webshit crashed hard and never recovered. Venture capital was no longer realizing the returns that they were once getting because every low hanging fruit and market niche had been dominated and saturated in the web tech verticals. All the new grads, juniors and pajeets who had been focusing on webshit technology are just now realizing they are entering a market where there is only demand for senior, staff, and principle tier skillsets because only seasoned professionals are needed to maintain all the legacy systems that were written the last decade. So now they claim tech is dead and there's no jobs.
In reality, Venture Capital has simply moved away from webshit and towards hard tech and they took all the jobs with them. Hard tech, that's where all the greenfield and exciting projects and companies are and where all the venture capital is pouring into. You need to reskill in hard tech if you want a job, or in other words computer engineering, electrical engineering, cpu design, embedding systems, low latency systems, gpu programming, high performance programming, advanced mathematics and statistics, etc. Haven't you been paying attention to all the chip stocks (nvidia, amd, asml, etc) going to the moon the last 1.5 years?
This.
Depends on how good you are. It's spray-and-pray for most.
That's what happens when you dangle $100K starting in a recession and tell girls they can be no-code managers because they're le oppressed.
farent those jobs requiring a massive skill set that is beyond morons like us?
those are what CS majors are supposed to do in the first place. we're just the modern equivelant of the masses of women taking that degree to write basic code for secretarial work
Based. Webshit was always boring. I hate webdevs.
This post is why I visit IQfy. Informative and truthful
Good explanation of current situation. The unsustainable demand for useless webdevs has plummeted, and we are back to where the field normally is. Like any field, there are still jobs. Those jobs simply get filled by people with actual skills, talent, and interest. For new grads this is grim, especially with so many people from low trust cultures who have no issues lying on resumes.
My personal experience is that since 2016, the majority of people doing software engineering and computer science are chasing money and have no interest or passion. They assume salaries are good, and jump through whatever hoops the degree requires without thinking further. Without an influx of money to effectively subsidize them, these people offer no real value to a business.
Embedded development is still easy to find a job, and easy to keep a job. None of the computer science drones have any idea how to do it. I know the same is true for other areas like hardware design and FPGA design.
Most of the new graduates are so fricking useless.
>Those jobs simply get filled by people with actual skills, talent, and interest. For new grads this is grim
Yeah, they get filled by people who ALREADY HAVE EXPERIENCE IN THAT SPECIFIC TECH STACK, and a Bachelor’s in CS isn’t even enough anymore. Not like college actually prepares you for the real world anyway. How can it when companies only want people who have experience?
>Not like college actually prepares you for the real world anyway.
It never did. Real world changes what it wants too often for colleges to keep up, so they teach fundamentals and how to learn. Details of particular things need to be learned later.
Grad school teaches more, but is more specialist; you're diving deep, not going shallow. Maybe you'll find a job that uses that stuff if you go that way, as the top end of that can have a job designed just for them.
>especially with so many people from low trust cultures who have no issues lying on resumes
never hire a pajeet, or at least not unless you've watched them code up a competent fizzbuzz in front of you without any internet access
sure it's easy for any actual programmer, but it filters out the no-hoper oxygen thieves
i've been taking math at my local community college and so far over 50% of the students I've met in my classes were all "computer science majors". Several have even told me they have no interest in computer science, they just want to make $.
fricking lol, cs is going to be the new biology and business degree. absolutely meaningless slop major that a billion zoombies are going to do for muh $200k starting. kinda feel bad for the actual dudes that are legitimately interested or who graduated before this before a true meme. if i was an employer recruiting for dev roles, i would just disregard all new grads with cs majors and focus on people with engineering, math, or physics instead + some programming background.
FRICK OFF we are FULL.
I'm 2 years into my software engineering job and barely know how to code. I am making 6 figures though, but I am pretty sure I only got hired because I am latino. I went to a small private school that had a terrible CS program that didn't teach me shit. I'm hoping to pivot somewhere else, maybe get a masters, any ideas? Like other anons have said, I got into this field for all the wrong reasons mainly money. I'd rather pursue something in writing/film/art but it doesn't seem realistic at this point. I'm hoping that is something I can pursue on the side once I get enough knowledge and experience in my current job.
>I got into this field for all the wrong reasons mainly money
but why? why did you really think "who cares if i like it or not, everybody is doing it and it offers lots of money"
idk it could be my autism but i dont understand why people would screw their interests and life over for fricking money
>people would screw their interests and life over for fricking money
Ironically putting your interests as your money maker is where fun goes to die.
there's plenty of time for fun after you retire with 10-15 years of working instead of the 50-60 that most americans have to put in.
Are cover letters still required for most jobs? I barely see it as an option on most applications I've filled out so far this past week.
Because almost every other career is dead
Do you want to not live around Black folk and trailer, and the endless noise and dysfunction - you need to be making $120-150k? Do you want a house? similar story. Do you want to actually afford a 2-week vacation at a domestic destination? See above.
What industries offer this?
Tech, Finance, Biglaw, Medicine. And Finance and Medicine also hire SWEs. Tech for the last ~10yrs has been the liferaft of the American Dream of making enough money to live around people that aren't morons and scumbags.
It's the same thing in the pharmaceutical industry, jobs are insanely hard to get right now. You would think healthcare, especially drugs, would be full of opportunities, but investors aren't investing at the moment. I'm just going back into academia in either a staff or postdoc position and weather the storm. It's even worse for us because we all have advanced degrees and are older.
Pharmacy was at one point the target of one of the greatest "worker shortage" propaganda blitzes ever in the early to mid 2000's. New outlets were running op eds on-stop about how there weren't enough pharmacists and that it was going to kill your nana if we didn't funnel hundreds of thousands of new students through PharmD programs. Now the market is completely and thoroughly saturated, especially at retail pharmacies. The result is that today you'll be lucky to crack a 6-figure income after graduating with essentially a medical degree unless you get lucky end up somewhere remarkably prestigious.
Also, biotech in general is notoriously boom or bust. After product development it's not uncommon to just lay off the entire research team that developed because you don't need them anymore.
t. regards worked in pharmacy and biology for 6 years.
CS is your best bet for actually paying back student loans. Even though everything useful has already been written and now all these companies do is sift through the giant pile of noise that human communication and activity has become and dredging up stuff to the surface, while trying to bury competing messages.
I chose CS because something medical related would require lots of studying and I hate everything else. I cannot force myself to study, and CS seems like an easy degree because I did some programming since middle school.
After seeing how bad the interview process for most places truly is, and now the recession, im kinda sad and grew to hate it. I only have a few classes left so Im just finishing it to have a piece of paper.
It was 95% free at least...
It's not delusion, because of all the big tech companies and every on Fortune 500 spawning a frickton of useless shit that needs to be managed, creating a cascading effect on the amount of jobs that needs to be created and maintained, which is a good thing, but also a bad thing because most of the CS undergrads will work for a few years doing some stupid shit that's basically just 2-3 extra steps of bureaucratic/administrative work.
Companies realized that outsourcing to India isn't feasible because they're Indians and 95% of the time they just don't give a frick about your company and they can't communicate properly, so on top of having liability issues your production slows down. At least with someone in the US, the moron you hired can speak English at least and would give some shit. Imagine this for every other small & medium businesses. Also, CS degree is just an entrypoint - it covers all of IT and software development. If you're a failure at software development, working an IT job is better than any alternative in the blue or white collar areas. If you fail biology, physics, or math, you either become a teacher/tutor or you bust your ass through the PhD route and hope you do well enough for someone to hire you. Or you get lucky and network your ass up. In IT you just get certifications, pass the moronation test, bear with the roasties and normies (as usual), and you're set for life. It's boring but it pays the bills.
>Why are so many people still getting CS degrees when the tech industry is pretty much dead
Why the frick would a student know firsthand what the industry looks like if they haven't participated in it at all, you fricking moron?
Did you know what the industry was like in your second year?
What a dumb fricking question
>covid ruined uni social life
>cs degree values plummeting
>housing is fricking shit
lol i should kill myself
At least emigrate or take a politician/banker with you. Don’t waste it.
CS is fine, degrees are worthless though so you have to do projects and prove you're not a mouthbreathing moron through other avenues these days. I expect to see filter classes come back in a big way in the near future as they should because most of my classmates graduated while struggling with for loops.
I didn't get a CS degree, but I can hardly believe this shit. Are students these days really this moronic? Back when I was starting out I was able to figure out for loops in Python in like an afternoon with almost no experience, and even looking back I would've said that's slow.
You have no idea how despair I felt when I saw these same students in the next class next year.
He saw one woman struggling with it on linkedin and now he's made up a story about how everyone is like her and how he's special for knowing a basic programming concept.
If people struggled with for loops then it'd be over for them in the 2nd week, let alone all the way up to graduation.
>Computers are involved in every aspect of every day living
>People want to learn about them
>Also CS is known for being a high paying field (LOL)
>People decide to get a degree in it
It's not really that hard to figure out.
Not hopeless at all. To really create unique AI replacement systems, the the assigned copilot should learn from the user and attempt to replicate their uniqueness. That means many months of future employment.
>have an almost zero percent chance of ever getting a job now
It's kinda the opposite for me, I don't have any trouble getting any tech related jobs, but all I get is bread crumbs as payout (yes, I'm a third worlder) since I don't have any CS degrees, and interviewers only have my word on experience and portfolio. I'm starting to reconsider this field and just flip burgers for a living since the pay is almost the same.
Literally my experience bro.... I got paid less then fricking blue collar worker.
Going back to school for CS was a mistake. I’m worse off financially, mentally than when I started. Doesn’t help that I’m 38 as well. Frick life.
i want to go back to better days when computers were still fun
can someone go back and redo the universe capping Moore's Law at its 2005 levels? kthx.
Don't care. I'm still going to finish my CS degree and compete with you for remote positions.
Getting even a first job or internship really isn't that bad even compared to other fields. Especially with how you can actually prove some ability in this field by just sitting down and doing it for free in your room. Just comp sci people are more terminally online and whiny.
If you're really worried about the job market, convince trump/Biden to lower corporate taxes again or to reverse Trump's whole thing where R&D can't be written off.
>If you're really worried about the job market, convince trump/Biden to lower corporate taxes again or to reverse Trump's whole thing where R&D can't be written off.
Never going to happen
The United States is dead, bury it.
Make CS Math Again
how come theres nothing similar to apprenticeships for STEM
why are all the associates worthless and why do you have to bloat your resume so hard
>why are all the associates worthless
too many credits and courses unrelated to your actual major. associates are for clearing out the general curriculum crap for cheap before moving to a 4 year.
there is in my country (european)
Currently getting a degree and I spend two weeks at the company that hired me and two weeks at school. I earn a wage (minimum wage, but I'm paid whether I'm at work or in school)
> when the tech industry is pretty much dead and you have an almost zero percent chance of ever getting a job now?
I just got a tech job a month ago, I don't even have a degree.
But sure, enjoy going to live in the woods and learning to weld lmao
My friend graduated last year and had to spend about a month applying but eventually got a job without even a technical interview
>zero chance of getting a job
shut down the information factory known as your ass
you have to be really really shit to now get a tech job. The amount of sheet incompetence I see is hilarious, if you're semi capable can get really good jobs
no other industry has such low barriers for cushy jobs