>lazy
how the frick is it the lazy option? they could have just persisted in a temporary world where microsoft continued to try and cut valve out. remember when win10(basic)tards couldn't even install steam because it wasn't in and wasn't allowed in the microsoft store? yeah no shit that really prompted an alternative to be created while valve is still on top. but that isn't lazy, they are thinking longer term. and it isn't cheaper right now either.
That's why they specifically introduced SteamOS when Microsoft stated they'd be phasing out win32 programs and make everything go through the Windows Store where Microsoft gets to take a 15% cut of sales. Fricking dumbfrick.
>Microsoft stated they'd be phasing out win32 programs
They never said that.
They said that they want to make windows more modular and easier to code on, and it might be true form the people that have seen the windows XP source code they say windows is completely Spaghetti code.
That's why they did the windows 10s thing they were only going to temporarily remove it.
Stupid uninformed historically illiterate pieces of shit.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Oh look, it's yet another anon posting links that have nothing to do with the point he was trying to refute. Always nice when that happens.
2 years ago
Anonymous
and the best is this article is almost 10 years old
2 years ago
Anonymous
>theverge
So boomers consider this a creditable news organisation?
2 years ago
Anonymous
anon they specifically said they wanted to replace win32 with UWP
I don't thing you remember the couple games that came on the MS Store like this, even AAA stuff like Tomb Raider.
They most certainly do not. They want to kill off Steam so Microsoft can take a 30% cut of PC games sales. The only saving grace for Steam is that the Microsoft Store is complete shit. Gabe is right to place his bets on Linux. Epic will do it too despite the CEO being openly Anti-Linux. They'll be forced to once Microsoft forces installations through their store.
They've already started dropping support for some 32 bit libraries that Valve is now maintaining. Just remember who actually has your back and wants you to be able to play whatever old games you have, it's sure as hell not Microsoft.
Epic is being actively paid by Microsoft, no doubt. MS is using them as controlled opposition because the MS store isn't cutting it. And unlike Valve, Epic doesn't care if MS buys them out, in fact that might even be their end goal.
2 years ago
Anonymous
epic is actually owned by china, ms by india
it's basically BRICS vs. one of the last truly American tech companies
This my game library on is on steam and then I would sooner install a linux or apple operating system before I ever use that homosexual Microsoft store for anything.
If Valve developed a desktop licensed Steam OS on arch linux with full emulation support for windows programs I would buy that license and never touch windows again. These guys could literally become an OS company that overtakes Microsoft just because they wanted an OS that ran vidya without bloatware.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>If Valve developed a desktop licensed Steam OS on arch linux with full emulation support for windows programs
They moved steam os to arch based
They are developing proton for using windows apps (wine technically isn't emulation but I know what you mean) >These guys could literally become an OS company that overtakes Microsoft
That's their game plan
See
Back when Gabe was working for Microsoft, he was task with porting Doom to windows. At the time the most installed piece of software on computers, beating out the versions of windows he worked on.
This convinced Gabe that gaming was the future, and subsequently formed valve.
Gabe was also aware of Microsoft policy of the day "embrace, extend, and extinguish". This doctrine originally referred to "Middleware" a sort of framework to enable easier cross platform development.
This practice continues today with "windows subsystem for linux" currently in the 'embrace' phase'
Now we come to the the question "why does valve care about linux?"
I'd argue that their investment lies in convincing consumers to hardware and platforms with Doom-like titles.
Alyx was for VR, and they definitely have a Deck focused title in the works, in hopes of greasing the wheels to make people feel more comfortable making the transition to linux/steambox
Steam was light-years ahead of anything at the time. And if they want to hold on 80% market share, they need to take some proactive measures against the inevitably of Microsoft.
Even if they only converted 10% of their active user base to switch over, that's nearly 12 million people away from Microsoft.
Thank you for coming to my TED talk :/
2 years ago
Anonymous
I'd be on Linux if adobe shit ran on it >but anon here are these shitty Linux alternatives
Unfortunately the shitty adobe softwares are industry standard
2 years ago
Anonymous
Dual boot
2 years ago
Anonymous
>If Valve developed a desktop licensed Steam OS on arch linux with full emulation support for windows programs I would buy that license and never touch windows again. These guys could literally become an OS company that overtakes Microsoft just because they wanted an OS that ran vidya without bloatware.
However Valve is moronic as frick and self sabotages itself.
What they should do:
1) Make Steam OS
2) Chose whatever (and i mean whatever) linux standards they want
3) Dictate to the devs that this is what they will write for
4) Any linux can install steam as long as it has the same dependencies as Steam OS, if not you can go pound sand.
5) Give devs a discount if people are buying their game on Linux/Steam OS
However Valveis moronic and greedy as frick >Give devs a discount ? NO ! GabeN needs to eat that money ! >Set up a standard ? NO ! WE will tell everyone to code for proton (that is the single most moronic thing you can do)
Imagine MS telling everyone that you are to develop games for their Nintendo 64 emulator.
A) It is emulation so it is shit
B) Proton is dictated by MS 100%
C) Proton plays catch up and NEEDS TO IMPLEMENT whatever shit MS comes up in windows.
>Whats this have an independent standard based on linux components we control 100% of the time and/or can fork ?! >NO slavery to MS it is !
>They'll be forced to once Microsoft forces installations through their store.
Windows is actually worthless without its software library so don't hold your breath on that one.
That's what he said. Steam would have to be "approved" by MS and they are competitors in the gaming arena already. It'd be stupid for Valve to allow a competitor to determine their future. Idiot.
tbf we shouldn't call current gen high level emulators emulators either. when architectures match they don't even emulate most things at all. they work just like wine, translating API calls
I think there's no universal answer. I don't remember the details, but L4D2 had better performance in Linux because of the way it handled data on the hard drive. In older games at least it can be explained by D9VK because driver developers have no incentive to make DX9 era games run better when all but the weakest PCs running modern systems can already easily handle those.
They don't want to be at Microsoft's mercy. Remember that while they are, to a certain extent, symbiotic, they're also competitors. Microsoft puts their games on Steam, because people like good service and dislike Microsoft service (aka bad service) and thus prefer to buy games on Steam than on the Microsoft store or whatever. But they'd prefer Steam didn't exist so they could frick over customers harder. The more power they have, the more danger Valve is in.
It is in Valve's interest to promote alternatives to Windows.
Because if they build up a successful and robust gaming platform on Linux that 'just werks' like how it does on Windows, they've unchained gaming from Windows and secured a monopoly for themselves. You should be able to see how that would be quite the motivator.
Because they make money off of PC gaming, which at the moment means Windows gaming.
Initially Gaben was scared of the Microsoft Store that was going to be introduced in Windows 8.
This obviously failed as a gaming platform, but it was enough to scare Valve into taking action.
Valve wants to decouple PC gaming from Microsoft.
what's the problem that people have with bringing gaming over to linux? do you have a problem with gaymes running on unbloated systems that provide better performance, more privacy and aren't paid/proprietary?
>Microsoft
Would rather you buy an Xbox.
Windows gets worse and worse every release.
GabeN has a personal vendetta against them. >Apple
LMAO. >Linux
Free, constantly improving, on the rise for home usage, open and easy to work with. Legions of NEETs willing to work on your OSS projects for free.
It's pretty obvious that Microsoft is reclaiming their PC platform. They're making big moves in the gaming industry and bundling stuff at very competitive prices.
Valve is essentially backed into a corner at this point. It was either Linux or BSD. Unfortunately, I don't think they're going to succeed. Linux is bloat and doesn't have a decent desktop environment.
they had autists in the company that went "hey i like linux we should port steam to linux"
then they found out how easy developing for linux can be due to their super autism so they now make tools for linux
GAY ben used to work at Microsoft before he started Valve. While at Valve he's had multiple issues with Microsoft trying to basically replace steam with their appstore. GAY ben understands that he needs assurances that if Microsoft goes full tyranny he can still sell vidya.
Back when Gabe was working for Microsoft, he was task with porting Doom to windows. At the time the most installed piece of software on computers, beating out the versions of windows he worked on.
This convinced Gabe that gaming was the future, and subsequently formed valve.
Gabe was also aware of Microsoft policy of the day "embrace, extend, and extinguish". This doctrine originally referred to "Middleware" a sort of framework to enable easier cross platform development.
This practice continues today with "windows subsystem for linux" currently in the 'embrace' phase'
Now we come to the the question "why does valve care about linux?"
I'd argue that their investment lies in convincing consumers to hardware and platforms with Doom-like titles.
Alyx was for VR, and they definitely have a Deck focused title in the works, in hopes of greasing the wheels to make people feel more comfortable making the transition to linux/steambox
Steam was light-years ahead of anything at the time. And if they want to hold on 80% market share, they need to take some proactive measures against the inevitably of Microsoft.
Even if they only converted 10% of their active user base to switch over, that's nearly 12 million people away from Microsoft.
But WSL has all the negatives of windows, with almost none of the positives of linux, just more negatives.
I dont see the appeal at all.
2 years ago
Anonymous
I completely agree. But you're missing the point. Their strategy is clear: embrace linux on windows to keep users
Whether or not it's successful is either here nor there
This. "Steam boxes" will come back and you'll probably buy one, mark my words. They'll completely undercut Windows prebuilts and give up almost no flexibility. My guess is they'll probably be very similar to the consoles with a custom APU but with some additional SATA and NVMe connectors and most likely with an unpopulated PCIe x16 slot for future expansion.
>My guess is they'll probably be very similar to the consoles with a custom APU
Sad truth is a lot of people don't realize that APUs are destined to take over
And they make it seem like a down side, when in reality it's amazing.
They only praise I can give apple is that they've already invested heavily into them
AMD also has this locked down. And it makes total sense. GPU units are just multiplication machines at the core
With decreased size, cost, and power consumption you can fit an entire fully capable pc into one chip
External GPUs being for extra if you need them
I could see them making a few different Steam box skus, lower end SFF ones that only a single M 2 drive is modular, Medium spec ones with a few M.2 connectors and SATA connectors and modular RAM, and higher end ones that the only non-modular part is the motherboard with a soldered APU that includes a PCIe x16 slot, also a way overbuilt or modular PSU. Obviously SteamOS will be able to be installed on any PC, you already can aside from if you have NVIDIA graphics.
This is what I'm hoping for at least. Semi custom APUs with excellent perf/$ figures that are mostly modular could be a great gateway for people into PC gaming. Not to mention it would just be some awesome hardware to have.
plan b for if windows turned into a locked down games console
valve wants to keep their independence and linux is a good fallback
plus of course they can do things like the steamdeck without needing to pay microsoft for the privilege
>A few weeks after this post went out, some very senior developers from Microsoft came by for a discreet visit. They loved our post, because it lit a fire underneath Microsoft's executives to get their act together and keep supporting Direct3D development. (Remember, at this point it was years since the last DirectX SDK release. The DirectX team was on life support.) Linux is obviously extremely influential.
>It's perhaps hard to believe, but the Steam Linux effort made a significant impact inside of multiple corporations. It was a surprisingly influential project. Valve being deeply involved with Linux also gives the company a "worse case scenario" hedge vs. Microsoft. It's like a club held over MS's heads. They just need to keep spending the resources to keep their in-house Linux expertise in a healthy state.
>bug reports from windows users
"help, it doesnt work, fix it now or i shitbomb you on twitter" >bug reports from linux users
"regression on current build since version X, [kernel version here], [system libs and versions here], [error messages here], also i attached a debugger and think it was a double free in $symbol_name_here but my system is cursed with gnu/gremlins so i am not sure, also thnx for providing linux support"
True. People often make fun of Linux gamers by claiming that "they are 1% of the audience but responsible for 99% of bug reports". However, they ignore that, most of the time, those bug reports are actually defects inherent to the game itself and not caused my system misconfiguration. They are helpful and informative and help the developers ship a game with better, more stable code.
There was that one game that got hundreds of bug reports from Linux users, but only three of the bugs were unique to Linux, the devs were pretty pleased and surprised.
Most of their devs are Linux users. And the lack of corporate culture driving resources to feedback-based features allows them to work on things they want.
Anyone who isn't moronic realized long ago that Windows is getting shittier and shittier every day with no going back. While businesses with production services running on Windows will keep using it for many years, it's not unlikely that gaymers will eventually move away from Windows in the near future.
Another problem from Valve's perspective is that Windows is becoming more and more of a walled garden. It was always a proprietary OS, yes, but it's recently becoming more developer-hostile and a walled garden. As it stands nowadays, Microsoft has leverage over PC gaming companies and developers.
Valve was one of the few gayming companies smart enough to realize this: they need an alternative OS to keep PC gaymers gayming and to avoid depending so much on Microsoft.. Mac OS is out of the question since, excluding Hackintoshes, it only runs on specific monolithic machines (which can arguably not be considered IBM PC compatibles). Hence, the only feasible option is GNU/Linux.
>It's recently becoming more developer-hostile
I disagree with this point but everything else is spot on. They're banking on developers bringing apps to the Windows store and strongarming them into giving Microsoft a cut. They are becoming hostile to alternative stores on Windows though.
Honestly all computing follows gamers, whether you agree or not you have to admit the level of influence they have. Once gamers start switching to Linux there will be more app support and more development money and more people will switch, etc.
We've already seen EA, Ubisoft and Bethesda start to take notice of Steam as a partner rather than a competitor. The only real holdouts are Activision and Epic. It's a case of the enemy of my enemy is my friend and those two platforms are just plain moronic.
>They are becoming hostile to alternative stores on Windows though.
Yes, I wasn't clear, that's what I meant when I said "developer-hostile". It's not that Windows is TECHNICALLY difficult to develop for and that Microsoft doesn't want third parties to develop for it (after all, their entire fortune is built on being a platform for third party software). However, they are clearly trying to shift distribution towards a single channel they have direct control over.
Valve, whose primary purpose is being a platform for software distribution, clearly stands to lose a lot from it. Shifting to another OS as their main platform would sidestep the issue and allow them to retain control over their distribution IF enough people switch to it. Given that Windows is such a well established monopoly, this is a very hard goal, but I don't think it's impossible. Only time will tell.
>all computing follows gamers
When it comes to end-user personal computing, yes. It's not just a matter of software: the entire IBM PC compatible platform was effectively kept alive and modular through all these years by the demands of the gaming market, whether we want to admit it or not. Companies have tried multiple times to shill all-in-one PCs and they failed over and over precisely because there was still a high demand for discrete, high performance components and extensive customization. And let's be honest, the vast majority of the time that high performance hardware is used for AAA games.
10 years into the future, MS might strongarm their way into the online game sales market and Valve wants to protect their future against that happening.
I find it unlikely to happen, which is why there is not yet a serious commitment from Valve to push for Linux as a gaming platform.
Because Microsoft is trying to abuse its monopoly even further and only allow trusted™ apps on their store. Valve, being a very popular distributor of third party software, wants to avoid this.
History truly repeats itself. If it keeps going on like this, Microsoft will eventually lose its dominance on the personal computing market in the same way IBM did. Walled gardens simply don't work long term.
Like other anons said, the Microsoft store and xbox services are long-term threats to valve/steam
Steamos is just a plan B if M$ decides to pull the rug from under valve by limiting application installs to the M$ store
Money
fpbp
fpbp
/thread
fpbp
its cheap and lazy way to get their job done and can market linux tards to support their proprietary bs
>lazy
how the frick is it the lazy option? they could have just persisted in a temporary world where microsoft continued to try and cut valve out. remember when win10(basic)tards couldn't even install steam because it wasn't in and wasn't allowed in the microsoft store? yeah no shit that really prompted an alternative to be created while valve is still on top. but that isn't lazy, they are thinking longer term. and it isn't cheaper right now either.
based capitalists
Because Microsoft wants to turn Windows into a walled garden and Steam would be competition to the Microsoft Store.
No, they want steam in the Microsoft store.
That's why they specifically introduced SteamOS when Microsoft stated they'd be phasing out win32 programs and make everything go through the Windows Store where Microsoft gets to take a 15% cut of sales. Fricking dumbfrick.
>Microsoft stated they'd be phasing out win32 programs
They never said that.
They said that they want to make windows more modular and easier to code on, and it might be true form the people that have seen the windows XP source code they say windows is completely Spaghetti code.
That's why they did the windows 10s thing they were only going to temporarily remove it.
Oh look, it's another "zoomers are pig-ignorant sacks of shit that have no idea what happened more than 15 minutes ago" thread
https://www.theverge.com/2013/1/8/3852144/gabe-newell-interview-steam-box-future-of-gaming
Stupid uninformed historically illiterate pieces of shit.
Oh look, it's yet another anon posting links that have nothing to do with the point he was trying to refute. Always nice when that happens.
and the best is this article is almost 10 years old
>theverge
So boomers consider this a creditable news organisation?
anon they specifically said they wanted to replace win32 with UWP
I don't thing you remember the couple games that came on the MS Store like this, even AAA stuff like Tomb Raider.
https://www.extremetech.com/computing/291124-microsoft-throws-in-the-towel-on-uwp-elevates-win32
>phasing out win32
Which fantasy world did your dumb ass crawl out of?
Weekday will happen to 30 years of win32 programs?
*What will happen...
They most certainly do not. They want to kill off Steam so Microsoft can take a 30% cut of PC games sales. The only saving grace for Steam is that the Microsoft Store is complete shit. Gabe is right to place his bets on Linux. Epic will do it too despite the CEO being openly Anti-Linux. They'll be forced to once Microsoft forces installations through their store.
They've already started dropping support for some 32 bit libraries that Valve is now maintaining. Just remember who actually has your back and wants you to be able to play whatever old games you have, it's sure as hell not Microsoft.
Epic is being actively paid by Microsoft, no doubt. MS is using them as controlled opposition because the MS store isn't cutting it. And unlike Valve, Epic doesn't care if MS buys them out, in fact that might even be their end goal.
epic is actually owned by china, ms by india
it's basically BRICS vs. one of the last truly American tech companies
>owned by a israelite
truly american
Gayben is kosher?
This my game library on is on steam and then I would sooner install a linux or apple operating system before I ever use that homosexual Microsoft store for anything.
If Valve developed a desktop licensed Steam OS on arch linux with full emulation support for windows programs I would buy that license and never touch windows again. These guys could literally become an OS company that overtakes Microsoft just because they wanted an OS that ran vidya without bloatware.
>If Valve developed a desktop licensed Steam OS on arch linux with full emulation support for windows programs
They moved steam os to arch based
They are developing proton for using windows apps (wine technically isn't emulation but I know what you mean)
>These guys could literally become an OS company that overtakes Microsoft
That's their game plan
See
I'd be on Linux if adobe shit ran on it
>but anon here are these shitty Linux alternatives
Unfortunately the shitty adobe softwares are industry standard
Dual boot
>If Valve developed a desktop licensed Steam OS on arch linux with full emulation support for windows programs I would buy that license and never touch windows again. These guys could literally become an OS company that overtakes Microsoft just because they wanted an OS that ran vidya without bloatware.
However Valve is moronic as frick and self sabotages itself.
What they should do:
1) Make Steam OS
2) Chose whatever (and i mean whatever) linux standards they want
3) Dictate to the devs that this is what they will write for
4) Any linux can install steam as long as it has the same dependencies as Steam OS, if not you can go pound sand.
5) Give devs a discount if people are buying their game on Linux/Steam OS
However Valveis moronic and greedy as frick
>Give devs a discount ? NO ! GabeN needs to eat that money !
>Set up a standard ? NO ! WE will tell everyone to code for proton (that is the single most moronic thing you can do)
Imagine MS telling everyone that you are to develop games for their Nintendo 64 emulator.
A) It is emulation so it is shit
B) Proton is dictated by MS 100%
C) Proton plays catch up and NEEDS TO IMPLEMENT whatever shit MS comes up in windows.
>Whats this have an independent standard based on linux components we control 100% of the time and/or can fork ?!
>NO slavery to MS it is !
WTF !
Remember the Steam Deck ?
The Steam Machine ?
They are as moronic as it gets.
>They'll be forced to once Microsoft forces installations through their store.
Windows is actually worthless without its software library so don't hold your breath on that one.
That's what he said. Steam would have to be "approved" by MS and they are competitors in the gaming arena already. It'd be stupid for Valve to allow a competitor to determine their future. Idiot.
>imagine being this moronic
>Yes, I love when my competitor taxes me 15%!
>LOOK GUYS I'M moronic!
Don't know but they are betraying the people who put them in this position to begin with.
damn you are autistic
They think they can take the gaming market from Windows - by writing emulators for it. Obviously, they don't remember OS/2.
What is OS/2?
Also steam is unusable on displays over 1080p
What? I've been using it on a 4k display for 7 years now.
They are bankrolling wine, which already has better support for older games than modern windows.
You know very little.
>Calling WINE an emulator
Tell me more about how little you know.
Literally uncheck the box that says "Scale to Display" and restart Steam, dumbass.
yea if it was emulator maybe it wouldnt run like shit
>t. moron
Proton/WINE run great. Maybe the problem is you've never used it and are just parroting an opinion of someone who also never used it.
Can't uncheck it if I can't see it, dumbass
>switch resolution lower
>check it
>switch resolution back.
How are you this stupid? Please don't breed.
tbf we shouldn't call current gen high level emulators emulators either. when architectures match they don't even emulate most things at all. they work just like wine, translating API calls
they were smart enough to see that there is a growing market which nobody noticed.
Theyve literally been making that market for a decade
Why wouldn't they? It's the most popular free operating system. Freedom is a human right.
Because they can do whatever they want it and it is free
Also tons of people willing to report bugs and triage shit for absolutely free
I don't understand why games run better on wine.
But that doesn't translate over to programs.
I think there's no universal answer. I don't remember the details, but L4D2 had better performance in Linux because of the way it handled data on the hard drive. In older games at least it can be explained by D9VK because driver developers have no incentive to make DX9 era games run better when all but the weakest PCs running modern systems can already easily handle those.
why not ?
They don't want to be at Microsoft's mercy. Remember that while they are, to a certain extent, symbiotic, they're also competitors. Microsoft puts their games on Steam, because people like good service and dislike Microsoft service (aka bad service) and thus prefer to buy games on Steam than on the Microsoft store or whatever. But they'd prefer Steam didn't exist so they could frick over customers harder. The more power they have, the more danger Valve is in.
It is in Valve's interest to promote alternatives to Windows.
Because if they build up a successful and robust gaming platform on Linux that 'just werks' like how it does on Windows, they've unchained gaming from Windows and secured a monopoly for themselves. You should be able to see how that would be quite the motivator.
Steam OS 3.0 runs on Arch
Gaben doesn't trust Microsoft to not eventually frick them over. It's basically a preventative move.
bump
they don't want to depend on microsoft
It's not that they love Linux, they do it because they hate Microsoft.
Even disregarding business reason, do you really want to live with windows forever
Because they make money off of PC gaming, which at the moment means Windows gaming.
Initially Gaben was scared of the Microsoft Store that was going to be introduced in Windows 8.
This obviously failed as a gaming platform, but it was enough to scare Valve into taking action.
Valve wants to decouple PC gaming from Microsoft.
>video games
oh look another lgbt thread in IQfy, it's all so tiresome
what's the problem that people have with bringing gaming over to linux? do you have a problem with gaymes running on unbloated systems that provide better performance, more privacy and aren't paid/proprietary?
They want to sell their hardware that runs Linux so they have an interest in Linux being as gaming friendly as possible
microsoft wants to compete with valve and it is bad business to be reliant on a competitor
>Microsoft
Would rather you buy an Xbox.
Windows gets worse and worse every release.
GabeN has a personal vendetta against them.
>Apple
LMAO.
>Linux
Free, constantly improving, on the rise for home usage, open and easy to work with. Legions of NEETs willing to work on your OSS projects for free.
It's pretty obvious that Microsoft is reclaiming their PC platform. They're making big moves in the gaming industry and bundling stuff at very competitive prices.
Valve is essentially backed into a corner at this point. It was either Linux or BSD. Unfortunately, I don't think they're going to succeed. Linux is bloat and doesn't have a decent desktop environment.
>bundling stuff at very competitive prices.
Like what?
I think there's a bundle that includes the Xbox game pass, OneDrive, and Microsoft Office.
Lel are windows targeting boomers?
Mmm, that's a pretty good deal, tbh.
I guess, but I can't imagine wanting any of those things
Performance
wtf is this even measuring?
Fps
But its shown as a percentage comparison.
they had autists in the company that went "hey i like linux we should port steam to linux"
then they found out how easy developing for linux can be due to their super autism so they now make tools for linux
valve doesnt care for money :^)
Because even they can see the horror in a world where Microsoft has a full monopoly on PC gaming.
GAY ben used to work at Microsoft before he started Valve. While at Valve he's had multiple issues with Microsoft trying to basically replace steam with their appstore. GAY ben understands that he needs assurances that if Microsoft goes full tyranny he can still sell vidya.
Back when Gabe was working for Microsoft, he was task with porting Doom to windows. At the time the most installed piece of software on computers, beating out the versions of windows he worked on.
This convinced Gabe that gaming was the future, and subsequently formed valve.
Gabe was also aware of Microsoft policy of the day "embrace, extend, and extinguish". This doctrine originally referred to "Middleware" a sort of framework to enable easier cross platform development.
This practice continues today with "windows subsystem for linux" currently in the 'embrace' phase'
Now we come to the the question "why does valve care about linux?"
I'd argue that their investment lies in convincing consumers to hardware and platforms with Doom-like titles.
Alyx was for VR, and they definitely have a Deck focused title in the works, in hopes of greasing the wheels to make people feel more comfortable making the transition to linux/steambox
Steam was light-years ahead of anything at the time. And if they want to hold on 80% market share, they need to take some proactive measures against the inevitably of Microsoft.
Even if they only converted 10% of their active user base to switch over, that's nearly 12 million people away from Microsoft.
Thank you for coming to my TED talk :/
>This practice continues today with "windows subsystem for linux" currently in the 'embrace' phase'
Linux is GPL, and thus immune to EEE.
The integration of Linux into windows is supposed to make using linux as a desktop irrelevant
But WSL has all the negatives of windows, with almost none of the positives of linux, just more negatives.
I dont see the appeal at all.
I completely agree. But you're missing the point. Their strategy is clear: embrace linux on windows to keep users
Whether or not it's successful is either here nor there
A decent amount of people running Linux do so for ideological reasons. Even if WSL works perfectly, they aren't going to run a proprietary OS.
This. "Steam boxes" will come back and you'll probably buy one, mark my words. They'll completely undercut Windows prebuilts and give up almost no flexibility. My guess is they'll probably be very similar to the consoles with a custom APU but with some additional SATA and NVMe connectors and most likely with an unpopulated PCIe x16 slot for future expansion.
Ironically it actually did the opposite.
>My guess is they'll probably be very similar to the consoles with a custom APU
Sad truth is a lot of people don't realize that APUs are destined to take over
And they make it seem like a down side, when in reality it's amazing.
They only praise I can give apple is that they've already invested heavily into them
AMD also has this locked down. And it makes total sense. GPU units are just multiplication machines at the core
With decreased size, cost, and power consumption you can fit an entire fully capable pc into one chip
External GPUs being for extra if you need them
I could see them making a few different Steam box skus, lower end SFF ones that only a single M 2 drive is modular, Medium spec ones with a few M.2 connectors and SATA connectors and modular RAM, and higher end ones that the only non-modular part is the motherboard with a soldered APU that includes a PCIe x16 slot, also a way overbuilt or modular PSU. Obviously SteamOS will be able to be installed on any PC, you already can aside from if you have NVIDIA graphics.
This is what I'm hoping for at least. Semi custom APUs with excellent perf/$ figures that are mostly modular could be a great gateway for people into PC gaming. Not to mention it would just be some awesome hardware to have.
Linux isn't getting extinguished because it provides something that Windows doesn't: a free and open source operating system
If you watch this whole debacle closely you will see that Steam will be forced into an IPO by Microsoft. They simply can't survive inside Linux.
Yes
plan b for if windows turned into a locked down games console
valve wants to keep their independence and linux is a good fallback
plus of course they can do things like the steamdeck without needing to pay microsoft for the privilege
Page 11
unironically? one dev revealed that it was a ploy to force microsoft to update directx
source?
https://richg42.blogspot.com/2017/01/the-faster-zombies-blog-post.html?m=1
>A few weeks after this post went out, some very senior developers from Microsoft came by for a discreet visit. They loved our post, because it lit a fire underneath Microsoft's executives to get their act together and keep supporting Direct3D development. (Remember, at this point it was years since the last DirectX SDK release. The DirectX team was on life support.) Linux is obviously extremely influential.
>It's perhaps hard to believe, but the Steam Linux effort made a significant impact inside of multiple corporations. It was a surprisingly influential project. Valve being deeply involved with Linux also gives the company a "worse case scenario" hedge vs. Microsoft. It's like a club held over MS's heads. They just need to keep spending the resources to keep their in-house Linux expertise in a healthy state.
https://venturebeat.com/2012/07/25/valves-gabe-newell-talks/
MAD for DRM services. I just pirate it all.
Because they’re good people who care about the Linux community 🙂
Just beat a windows-only game using proton, ran perfectly
>bug reports from windows users
"help, it doesnt work, fix it now or i shitbomb you on twitter"
>bug reports from linux users
"regression on current build since version X, [kernel version here], [system libs and versions here], [error messages here], also i attached a debugger and think it was a double free in $symbol_name_here but my system is cursed with gnu/gremlins so i am not sure, also thnx for providing linux support"
i wonder why...
True. People often make fun of Linux gamers by claiming that "they are 1% of the audience but responsible for 99% of bug reports". However, they ignore that, most of the time, those bug reports are actually defects inherent to the game itself and not caused my system misconfiguration. They are helpful and informative and help the developers ship a game with better, more stable code.
There was that one game that got hundreds of bug reports from Linux users, but only three of the bugs were unique to Linux, the devs were pretty pleased and surprised.
>Why do they care about linux?
Because MS/windows will ban all third party stores in windows.
Most of their devs are Linux users. And the lack of corporate culture driving resources to feedback-based features allows them to work on things they want.
Anyone who isn't moronic realized long ago that Windows is getting shittier and shittier every day with no going back. While businesses with production services running on Windows will keep using it for many years, it's not unlikely that gaymers will eventually move away from Windows in the near future.
Another problem from Valve's perspective is that Windows is becoming more and more of a walled garden. It was always a proprietary OS, yes, but it's recently becoming more developer-hostile and a walled garden. As it stands nowadays, Microsoft has leverage over PC gaming companies and developers.
Valve was one of the few gayming companies smart enough to realize this: they need an alternative OS to keep PC gaymers gayming and to avoid depending so much on Microsoft.. Mac OS is out of the question since, excluding Hackintoshes, it only runs on specific monolithic machines (which can arguably not be considered IBM PC compatibles). Hence, the only feasible option is GNU/Linux.
>It's recently becoming more developer-hostile
I disagree with this point but everything else is spot on. They're banking on developers bringing apps to the Windows store and strongarming them into giving Microsoft a cut. They are becoming hostile to alternative stores on Windows though.
Honestly all computing follows gamers, whether you agree or not you have to admit the level of influence they have. Once gamers start switching to Linux there will be more app support and more development money and more people will switch, etc.
We've already seen EA, Ubisoft and Bethesda start to take notice of Steam as a partner rather than a competitor. The only real holdouts are Activision and Epic. It's a case of the enemy of my enemy is my friend and those two platforms are just plain moronic.
>They are becoming hostile to alternative stores on Windows though.
Yes, I wasn't clear, that's what I meant when I said "developer-hostile". It's not that Windows is TECHNICALLY difficult to develop for and that Microsoft doesn't want third parties to develop for it (after all, their entire fortune is built on being a platform for third party software). However, they are clearly trying to shift distribution towards a single channel they have direct control over.
Valve, whose primary purpose is being a platform for software distribution, clearly stands to lose a lot from it. Shifting to another OS as their main platform would sidestep the issue and allow them to retain control over their distribution IF enough people switch to it. Given that Windows is such a well established monopoly, this is a very hard goal, but I don't think it's impossible. Only time will tell.
>all computing follows gamers
When it comes to end-user personal computing, yes. It's not just a matter of software: the entire IBM PC compatible platform was effectively kept alive and modular through all these years by the demands of the gaming market, whether we want to admit it or not. Companies have tried multiple times to shill all-in-one PCs and they failed over and over precisely because there was still a high demand for discrete, high performance components and extensive customization. And let's be honest, the vast majority of the time that high performance hardware is used for AAA games.
10 years into the future, MS might strongarm their way into the online game sales market and Valve wants to protect their future against that happening.
I find it unlikely to happen, which is why there is not yet a serious commitment from Valve to push for Linux as a gaming platform.
Because Microsoft is trying to abuse its monopoly even further and only allow trusted™ apps on their store. Valve, being a very popular distributor of third party software, wants to avoid this.
History truly repeats itself. If it keeps going on like this, Microsoft will eventually lose its dominance on the personal computing market in the same way IBM did. Walled gardens simply don't work long term.
Like other anons said, the Microsoft store and xbox services are long-term threats to valve/steam
Steamos is just a plan B if M$ decides to pull the rug from under valve by limiting application installs to the M$ store
>limiting application installs to the M$ store
Windows would be as useless as 9front without software unavailable in the Microsoft Store.
My ass + farts from my ass
based flatulator
>tfw can't play csgo on linux because my linux username is too long